Posted by Graeme Lee on August 19, 2006 at 6:12 AM
Morning all,
I could do with some help on the fundamentals of printing. I haven't time to explore the highly technical aspects of printing, but would like to print some of my images at A4 size and get the best out of them in the small amount of time I have. I want to use an on-line printing service that only accepts JPEGs in RGB colourspace (whatever that means!!) (It's the photobox.net photobook).
I'm only just learning the output for web and haven't touched printing so any help would be great.
Perhaps if anyone could state 5 fundamentals when preparing for print would help. Assuming I've done the levels, curves etc.
Also, do you need to sharpen more/less for print? Apologies if this is a bit vague, but any help would be appreciated.
Regards, Graeme
Posted by Sean Bolton on August 19, 2006 at 7:11 AM
Hi Graeme
Preparing output for printing is essentially the same process as for web images, except the image size is bigger for printing. I have used online print services such as PhotoBox before for prints and the service is very good. I will be interested in your opinion of the photobox book when you have had it done.
Ok, a quick summary of what I would do ;
1. Convert RAW to TIFF16
2. Do all levels, contrast, colour adjustment in PhotoShop
3. Crop if needed bearing in mind proportions of the intended print (6x4, 7x5, etc)
4. Sharpen with USM
5. Convert to 8 bit mode
6. Convert to sRGB colour space
7. Save as JPEG file (quality level 10 is enough)
8. job done, upload JPEGs
For Sharpening there are many approaches but as a rule of thumb I would say applying USM at about Amount 300, Radius 0.5, Threshold 0 is an ok starting point. Adjust the amount and radius a bit until you are happy. Generally for prints you probably need to apply slightly more USM than you would for a websize image.
Whilst Photobox uses a 300dpi printing process you don't need to resize your images to meet this requirement, Photobox will upres or downres accordingly. 8 Megapixel files are approximately A4 at 300 dpi (11.75 x 300 dpi = 3525 ) so the files out of your 1dMk2 will be about right for printing without any modification. If you want to put several smaller photos onto one page then I would recommend reducing your image size accordingly (if you do resize do it before applying sharpening).
For their books, you would be best using sRGB at 300ppi. Size the image to roughly what you think the final printed size would be, and then sharpen to "taste" - basically to the same level as you would print on your own inkjet.
One problem with sharpening for photobox is that the files for the book are likely to be resized within their system...this means that any fine tuning of sharpening that you do is a total waste of time as the image is liable to be resized by their own system.
The one time I was going to try the photobox book, I ended up cancelling the order because their technical help couldn't give me the accurate pixel sizes for each of the page layout "windows" - that meant I couldn't size the files appropriately, nor sharpen them to get a result to my satisfaction. They also couldn't say if or when they would be able to give me the dimensions. Neither where they able to give any accurate info on the full bleed pages (border-border full page) to say how much overlap to allow, nor to say what the safety border (what they would guarantee not to crop off) would be. When I saw a sample book at Focus-on-Imaging back in Feb, the print quality looked decent enough (up to their other stuff), but the book covers and binding looked cheapish.
At the end of the day though, you have to remember that Photobox is only targeted at consumers - not at the semi/pro or advanced amateur customers - that is reflected in the prices and the results. Trouble is that there seems to be a huge gap in the market between Photobox and the next level up (£300+ ).
Posted by Graeme Lee on August 19, 2006 at 4:30 PM
Thanks very much. Appreciate the responses guys.
The workflow you've given Sean is just what I needed at this stage. I wasn't too far off this but just needed some reassurance I wasn't missing basic fundamentals along the way.
And thanks Nick. You've certainly highlighted the fact that for more accurate processing and better control from yourself over the final print, there's a lot more factors to consider. A great help.
Regards, Graeme
Posted by Tom Dodson on August 21, 2006 at 8:22 PM
I have just received my Photobox book back and am fairly pleased. I found the layout a bit hit and miss / inaccurate though. Great for the price but NOT in the same league as some of the more expensive items.More a bit of fun than a pro tool.
Discussion
4 repliesI could do with some help on the fundamentals of printing. I haven't time to explore the highly technical aspects of printing, but would like to print some of my images at A4 size and get the best out of them in the small amount of time I have. I want to use an on-line printing service that only accepts JPEGs in RGB colourspace (whatever that means!!) (It's the photobox.net photobook).
I'm only just learning the output for web and haven't touched printing so any help would be great.
Perhaps if anyone could state 5 fundamentals when preparing for print would help. Assuming I've done the levels, curves etc.
Also, do you need to sharpen more/less for print? Apologies if this is a bit vague, but any help would be appreciated.
Regards, Graeme
Preparing output for printing is essentially the same process as for web images, except the image size is bigger for printing. I have used online print services such as PhotoBox before for prints and the service is very good. I will be interested in your opinion of the photobox book when you have had it done.
Ok, a quick summary of what I would do ;
1. Convert RAW to TIFF16
2. Do all levels, contrast, colour adjustment in PhotoShop
3. Crop if needed bearing in mind proportions of the intended print (6x4, 7x5, etc)
4. Sharpen with USM
5. Convert to 8 bit mode
6. Convert to sRGB colour space
7. Save as JPEG file (quality level 10 is enough)
8. job done, upload JPEGs
For Sharpening there are many approaches but as a rule of thumb I would say applying USM at about Amount 300, Radius 0.5, Threshold 0 is an ok starting point. Adjust the amount and radius a bit until you are happy. Generally for prints you probably need to apply slightly more USM than you would for a websize image.
Whilst Photobox uses a 300dpi printing process you don't need to resize your images to meet this requirement, Photobox will upres or downres accordingly. 8 Megapixel files are approximately A4 at 300 dpi (11.75 x 300 dpi = 3525 ) so the files out of your 1dMk2 will be about right for printing without any modification. If you want to put several smaller photos onto one page then I would recommend reducing your image size accordingly (if you do resize do it before applying sharpening).
I hope that helps a bit.
cheers
Sean
One problem with sharpening for photobox is that the files for the book are likely to be resized within their system...this means that any fine tuning of sharpening that you do is a total waste of time as the image is liable to be resized by their own system.
The one time I was going to try the photobox book, I ended up cancelling the order because their technical help couldn't give me the accurate pixel sizes for each of the page layout "windows" - that meant I couldn't size the files appropriately, nor sharpen them to get a result to my satisfaction. They also couldn't say if or when they would be able to give me the dimensions. Neither where they able to give any accurate info on the full bleed pages (border-border full page) to say how much overlap to allow, nor to say what the safety border (what they would guarantee not to crop off) would be. When I saw a sample book at Focus-on-Imaging back in Feb, the print quality looked decent enough (up to their other stuff), but the book covers and binding looked cheapish.
At the end of the day though, you have to remember that Photobox is only targeted at consumers - not at the semi/pro or advanced amateur customers - that is reflected in the prices and the results. Trouble is that there seems to be a huge gap in the market between Photobox and the next level up (£300+
The workflow you've given Sean is just what I needed at this stage. I wasn't too far off this but just needed some reassurance I wasn't missing basic fundamentals along the way.
And thanks Nick. You've certainly highlighted the fact that for more accurate processing and better control from yourself over the final print, there's a lot more factors to consider. A great help.
Regards, Graeme