Posted by Dale Williams on November 29, 2006 at 3:00 PM
Hello everyone!
My first post is mainly to say hello and let everyone know what a great forum and site this and how much I enjoy reading everything and looking at the photos. WOW! Those photos!!! This has to be the best collection of nature photography anywhere and certainly by the best photographers. I thought some of my photos were okay but I am nowhere near being in the league of the photographers in this network...at least not yet!
My only complaint about this site is that it is keeping me up late at night reading the discussion posts and all the great articles. I can't get enough sleep now! Seriously, I have learned more about photography in the last couple of weeks from this site than I think I could have any place else. I also appreciate the nature of the discussions here. I have experienced a couple of photography forums where people were rude and didn't seem to want to help anybody. Haven't seen that at all here. In fact, it seems the better photographers here all have a desire to help out with information.
One question: I have just purchased the D80 (my first SLR) with a couple of kit lenses (28mm-80mm and 70mm-300mm)which from what I have read, are probably okay for starters but are not exceptionally high quality lenses...even though Nikkor. Is there a better lense that you recommend that I should try to get and use on my camera most of the time? I mostly shoot close-ups of flowers, a few animals and some scenic landscapes. I don't do alot of avian photos. I have about $500-$800 budget right now for a good lense. Any thoughts would be very helpful!
Again, what a great place for any nature photographer to hang out!
Thanks again!
Dale
Posted by Bill Stice on November 29, 2006 at 3:42 PM
Dale, welcome to a wonderful photography site with many outstanding photographers. We are glad to have you as a part of the group. If you are interested in close-up photos you might want to start with your 70 to 300 and simply add a close up accessory filter. Both Nikon and Canon make good ones and there are also some good ones from other manufacturers. I would give them a try since they are relatively low cost and produce some outstanding results. If you decide to get more into it in the future you can go to a dedicated macro lens. I would however make sure to get a two element close up lens because they are much better. On the landscape side I'd probably recommend that you go with something in the 17 to 50 range zoom. With the cropping factor of the D80 that would be about 25mm on the wide end and about 75 on the long end. In either case you may want to take a look at the KEH web site. They sell a lot of used equipment and you can get good used lenses for much less than new. Hope this helps and again welcome.
I don't have much experience with the modern Nikkors myself but I will suggest you cut your teeth on the lenses you have before spending the money on the high end models. Once you've had a chance to hone your specific style, identify specific limitations with your current gear, etc. you will likely be in a much better position to decide your next purchase.
Welcome to NPN! The campfire circle here is one of the all-time greats!
I am in complete agreement with Guy's remarks and second them wholeheartedly.
Where are you from? You might want to check out the Regional Forum that corresponds to your location. A lot of nice images are posted on those forums, and you also might find somone who lives close by to go out with and make photographs.
Have fun!
-PB
Posted by Dale Williams on November 29, 2006 at 4:56 PM
Thank you very much for your replies. You all are very helpful.
Preston, I am located in the north Texas area. I will check out the regional forum as suggested.
Posted by Bill Chambers on November 29, 2006 at 5:10 PM
Welcome to NPN Dale. Some great advice already so I have nothing to add there. Where about in north Texas? I used to live in the Hill Country - wonderful photo opportunities there, especially in Spring, and also out in Big Bend National Park. Near Amarillo there's Cap Rock and others. You should be able to really maximize your D80 out there. Have fun, and can't wait to see your first post.
Posted by Nathan Buck on November 29, 2006 at 5:17 PM
Welcome Dale!
I agree with the others...do what you can with your current lenses, see if you like the focal lengths, or if you need more reach or a wider angle. Then you know what to buy. I have an older 70-210 f4 Nikkor lens that I just love, and it would be very affordable - it is also nice and sharp. This might be an option for you at some time if you just want a bit of a sharper lens, with a larger max aperture.
Good advice to start with the Nikon or Canon diopters for close up shots. The Nikons are the 5T and 6T. The similar canon diopters are the 500d (I think). Either will work with your lenses, as they are just screw on filters. The Nikons are 62mm if I remember right, so you may need a step ring to get to the right size for your lens.
Again...Welcome! We look forward to seeing you around!
Nathan
Posted by Dale Williams on November 29, 2006 at 5:32 PM
Thank you very much for your replies. You all are very helpful.
Preston, I am located in the north Texas area. I will check out the regional forum as suggested.
Posted by Ed Cordes on November 29, 2006 at 5:55 PM
Dale you have already received excellent advice. I just want to welcome you to NPN. I too have learned a lot here and continue to hone my skills by my participation. Enjoy the experience.!
Posted by Robert Helms on November 29, 2006 at 5:59 PM
Welcome aboard, Dale.
I'll have to agree with the information that Guy provided. I wish someone had told me to use the gear I have first to realize the limitations before purchasing an item that I may, or may not have a use for. I started photography before I found NPN.
Early into my photography hobby I dropped over a grand on a lens, that even though it was a stellar performer I found I was using it more on vacations than around home where I spend most of my time.
After a period of time went by I started to notice that I was seeing compositions around home that required a longer focal length than one would really associate with landscapes. I finally got that focal length lens and now I'm very happy to the point of feeling reborn.
It really is good advice to take some time and figure out what you need before purchasing too many items. Less of course your independently wealthy, which sadly isn't my case.
Welcome aboard again and we look forward to viewing your images.
Robert
Posted by Basil Greber on November 29, 2006 at 6:47 PM
Hi there.
Regarding your equipment questions: I'd get rid of the 28-80 and replace it with the 18-70 DX Nikkor, or if budget is really tight, with the 18-55 DX. The latter is a very cheap lens, but 28 mm on a DSLR simply is not wide enough for landscapes (at least not for me), and the 18-55 DX is not all that bad at the wide end. For close-ups, I think the 105/2.8 VR Nikkor is hard to beat, but again, if budget is tight, a used 105/2.8 Micro (non-VR) will deliver very good quality (using such a thing myself), or for example the Tokina (100 mm) and Tamron (90 mm) offer great value for money. The 70-300, I'd keep. Even if it's not the best of lenses, it will do the job until something better comes along.
If you want to combine the close-up and landscape aspects, the Sigma 17-70 2.8-4 DC has a good reputation (never tried it, so don't shoot me if I'm wrong ). It offers a decent wide angle, and a repro ratio of 1/2.3 or something like that.
It depends a bit on what your priorities are... but maybe it's advisable to first try & see what you like most, and where your current equipment limits you most, before you buy anything new. Will prevent spending money on things you don't really need...
Basil
Posted by Dale Williams on November 29, 2006 at 8:03 PM
Thank you again for some great advice. Bill, I live in Arlington and love to take pictures in the Southwest US. I want to get out to Palo Duro soon.
It seems the consensus is to use what I have and continue to learn the basics and limitations of my equipment.
To me, the more important things like composition, exposure, and lighting are areas that I can learn regardless of equipment and lenses, huh?
Again, thanks for the great replies.
Dale
Posted by Jack Graham on November 30, 2006 at 12:23 AM
Dale,
NPN is like a neighborhood saloon. In many years here I've never experienced any thing negative, only good info good comments and lots of good friends.
Sit back, relax and hoist a tall one to you and your new photo friends!
Another Texan! Good! I like that. I was born in Tyler, lived in Dallas for good spell and was stationed in Amarillo and Laredo during my Air Force years. Lots of nice country there to wander around in, that's for sure!
Some Air Force friends and I used to go out to Palo Duro and hike around. I recall that it was quite wild, but that was in 1966. It's likely gotten 'civilized' by now.
I always loved the valley and the mountains out around Marfa and Alpine in far west Texas. It alwaus seemed quiet and peaceful there. Again, that was many years ago. Hopefully the area retains its rural character.
Do well with your photography, Dale! Your learning outcomes will be greatly accelerated by hanging out 'round here!
Hi Dale!! I'll throw in a welcome mat also!!! I agree about the sleep thing and not getting anything done too while I'm on this site!!! Have fun with it!! I know I do!!!
Posted by Dale Williams on November 30, 2006 at 11:35 AM
Thank you for the welcome mat everyone. BTW, it is sleeting right now in the metroplex with some snow forecasted for this afternoon. Any suggestions on exposure settings for winter photos?
Dale
Posted by Bill Chambers on November 30, 2006 at 12:04 PM
I live in Florida now Dale, so my winter settings are pretty much the same as most folks summer settings. I'm afarid I'm no help on that one.
Posted by Nathan Buck on November 30, 2006 at 4:06 PM
For snow shots, if the shot that you are taking is mostly snow, you should bump up the exposure by at least one stop. If you are not sure how to do that, let us know. Typically snow scenes require at least one extra stop, up to just under two extra stops. (like +1 2/3) I don't know that I would go clear to two stops. This all depends on the amount of snow in the shot, as the snow reflects light and fools your camera into thinking that the exposure does not need to be as long as it should to properly expose the shot.
With the D80 you don't really need to guess. Make an exposure, study the histogram and correct as necessary.
Guy
Posted by Gary Crabbe on December 2, 2006 at 8:11 PM
I often tell many starting out that better gear won't guarentee turning you into a better photographer. For that budget, I'd strongly suggest that you'll get much more bang for your buck over the long run by investing in some type of workshop, whether it be a one-on-one private deal, or a group. If you can find a one-on-one deal with a photographer, you'll probably get more attention, and as you become a bit more competent with the gear, then try a group workshop where you get less personal attention, but more social interactions.
Hi, Dale, and welcome! I have to agree with Guy and with Gary: use what you have for awhile. You'll be better able to decide which features in lenses are most important for you to make the images you like to make; AND save up! Any of my recommendations are beyond your budget. But those kinds of lenses, you'll have lots of room to further evolve your vision. And what Gary said, take a workshop from someone who is familiar with your local area and with your camera. And then post some photos for us to see! We'll help you out, too! I've learned so much more since going to digital, taking workshops and finding NPN. And as Dale suggested, come on in, pull up a stool, and talk with enthusiastic fellow photogs. We'll keep you up all night and then some!
Discussion
20 repliesMy first post is mainly to say hello and let everyone know what a great forum and site this and how much I enjoy reading everything and looking at the photos. WOW! Those photos!!! This has to be the best collection of nature photography anywhere and certainly by the best photographers. I thought some of my photos were okay but I am nowhere near being in the league of the photographers in this network...at least not yet!
My only complaint about this site is that it is keeping me up late at night reading the discussion posts and all the great articles. I can't get enough sleep now! Seriously, I have learned more about photography in the last couple of weeks from this site than I think I could have any place else. I also appreciate the nature of the discussions here. I have experienced a couple of photography forums where people were rude and didn't seem to want to help anybody. Haven't seen that at all here. In fact, it seems the better photographers here all have a desire to help out with information.
One question: I have just purchased the D80 (my first SLR) with a couple of kit lenses (28mm-80mm and 70mm-300mm)which from what I have read, are probably okay for starters but are not exceptionally high quality lenses...even though Nikkor. Is there a better lense that you recommend that I should try to get and use on my camera most of the time? I mostly shoot close-ups of flowers, a few animals and some scenic landscapes. I don't do alot of avian photos. I have about $500-$800 budget right now for a good lense. Any thoughts would be very helpful!
Again, what a great place for any nature photographer to hang out!
Thanks again!
Dale
I don't have much experience with the modern Nikkors myself but I will suggest you cut your teeth on the lenses you have before spending the money on the high end models. Once you've had a chance to hone your specific style, identify specific limitations with your current gear, etc. you will likely be in a much better position to decide your next purchase.
Guy
Welcome to NPN! The campfire circle here is one of the all-time greats!
I am in complete agreement with Guy's remarks and second them wholeheartedly.
Where are you from? You might want to check out the Regional Forum that corresponds to your location. A lot of nice images are posted on those forums, and you also might find somone who lives close by to go out with and make photographs.
Have fun!
-PB
Preston, I am located in the north Texas area. I will check out the regional forum as suggested.
I agree with the others...do what you can with your current lenses, see if you like the focal lengths, or if you need more reach or a wider angle. Then you know what to buy. I have an older 70-210 f4 Nikkor lens that I just love, and it would be very affordable - it is also nice and sharp. This might be an option for you at some time if you just want a bit of a sharper lens, with a larger max aperture.
Good advice to start with the Nikon or Canon diopters for close up shots. The Nikons are the 5T and 6T. The similar canon diopters are the 500d (I think). Either will work with your lenses, as they are just screw on filters. The Nikons are 62mm if I remember right, so you may need a step ring to get to the right size for your lens.
Again...Welcome! We look forward to seeing you around!
Nathan
Preston, I am located in the north Texas area. I will check out the regional forum as suggested.
I'll have to agree with the information that Guy provided. I wish someone had told me to use the gear I have first to realize the limitations before purchasing an item that I may, or may not have a use for. I started photography before I found NPN.
Early into my photography hobby I dropped over a grand on a lens, that even though it was a stellar performer I found I was using it more on vacations than around home where I spend most of my time.
After a period of time went by I started to notice that I was seeing compositions around home that required a longer focal length than one would really associate with landscapes. I finally got that focal length lens and now I'm very happy to the point of feeling reborn.
It really is good advice to take some time and figure out what you need before purchasing too many items. Less of course your independently wealthy, which sadly isn't my case.
Welcome aboard again and we look forward to viewing your images.
Robert
Regarding your equipment questions: I'd get rid of the 28-80 and replace it with the 18-70 DX Nikkor, or if budget is really tight, with the 18-55 DX. The latter is a very cheap lens, but 28 mm on a DSLR simply is not wide enough for landscapes (at least not for me), and the 18-55 DX is not all that bad at the wide end. For close-ups, I think the 105/2.8 VR Nikkor is hard to beat, but again, if budget is tight, a used 105/2.8 Micro (non-VR) will deliver very good quality (using such a thing myself), or for example the Tokina (100 mm) and Tamron (90 mm) offer great value for money. The 70-300, I'd keep. Even if it's not the best of lenses, it will do the job until something better comes along.
If you want to combine the close-up and landscape aspects, the Sigma 17-70 2.8-4 DC has a good reputation (never tried it, so don't shoot me if I'm wrong
It depends a bit on what your priorities are... but maybe it's advisable to first try & see what you like most, and where your current equipment limits you most, before you buy anything new. Will prevent spending money on things you don't really need...
Basil
It seems the consensus is to use what I have and continue to learn the basics and limitations of my equipment.
To me, the more important things like composition, exposure, and lighting are areas that I can learn regardless of equipment and lenses, huh?
Again, thanks for the great replies.
Dale
NPN is like a neighborhood saloon. In many years here I've never experienced any thing negative, only good info good comments and lots of good friends.
Sit back, relax and hoist a tall one to you and your new photo friends!
Welcome!
Jack
Some Air Force friends and I used to go out to Palo Duro and hike around. I recall that it was quite wild, but that was in 1966. It's likely gotten 'civilized' by now.
I always loved the valley and the mountains out around Marfa and Alpine in far west Texas. It alwaus seemed quiet and peaceful there. Again, that was many years ago. Hopefully the area retains its rural character.
Do well with your photography, Dale! Your learning outcomes will be greatly accelerated by hanging out 'round here!
-PB
Dale
Nathan
Guy
Cheers, Welcome, and Good Luck!