Advice needed for visually challenged photographer
Discussion
18 replies
Posted by Dale Williams on January 22, 2007 at 11:31 AM
Hello everyone,
I am 52 years young and my vision has started to deteriorate. I wear trifocals and see pretty well with them for most things so no real complaints there.
However, as I have recently begun to get more serious about this hobby, I decided to upgrade from my trusty Nikon CP8800 to the D80 which I absolutely love. (I've taken it around the block a few times but haven't had a chance to get it out on the road and open it up all the way). The only problem with the camera I have is trying to see the numbers in the viewfinder...specifically the exposure meter. Since I am trying to shoot 100% manual, it is obviously critical to me. The viewfinder is very nice and bright (one of the reasons I settled on the D80) so the scene is clear and focused for me but those darn numbers are just so hard to see. Sometimes I just set the exposure the hard way by setting the aperature and then estimating what shutter speed to use based upon the light I see but I am not experienced enough to work without the exposure meter!
Are there any of you Nikon (or otherwise) shooters that know of any settings I can change on the D80 or any attachments I can get from Nikon or third party vendors to magnify the viewfinder somewhat?
I know I could probably "google" this (hey, I'm learning new terms everyday) but thought I would see if anyone else here may have dealt with this and/or knows a possible solution.
As I stated in my very first post after joining NPN, this is a great community. I feel I have started to know some of you just by reading your posts and viewing your photos. Sometimes I feel like I am hiking some trail in Utah with Guy, climbing a mountain in the Sierras with Preston, shooting trains with Kent in the Dakotas somewhere, or running the Everglades with Bill. And of course, most any day I feel like I am sitting down with Hank over a cup of coffee and talking shop or just about anything else. Well, the list goes on. I think Mayor Jim Erhardt and Donna have a great little town here and I really like the time I spend here with all of you!! And thanks for all the excellent image critiques you have been providing to my posts.
Nikon makes magnifier attachment (DG-2, I think) that may fit your camera. I don't know specifically if it will work on the D-80 though. It depends on the shape of the finder eyepiece.
Guy
Posted by Ed Dubois on January 22, 2007 at 12:15 PM
Hi Dale,
While I don't know the Nikon products, I know that Canon makes a wide variety of corrective diopter eyepieces that replace the rubber eye cup for some of their models. A friend used one on his EOS which really helped. I suspect that if you found the right amount of correction for your viewfinder there would be a way either you or a camera technician could modify a Nikon eyepiece to use this type of extra lens. Also an optomitrist should be able to help you discover the right magnification. I believe the info in a viewfinder is correct to appear to be at about a 3-4 foot focal length.
I suspect you may have to come up with a prototype or two with silicon adhesive and tape before you get the right answer for you but I'd encourage you not to give up.
My wife has exremely strong myopia. We went through a few cameras and finally have a solution that works for her. She prefers one of the old-fashioned focussing screens that has the split image in the middle. With that and her right angle finder for her macro work she manages wonderfully.
Good luck and let us know how you make out
Posted by Bill Chambers on January 22, 2007 at 1:04 PM
Nikon makes different corrective diopter eyepieces, but I don't know how they work, or if they're available for the D80. Your D80 probably has a small corrective tuning capability already built in but it may not be enough to help with your problem.
I certainly share your concern, though we don't (yet) own any D80's. You roused my curiosity, so I checked the specs. The D80 has "Built-in diopter adjustment (-2.0 to +1.0 m-1)." If you haven't adjusted that, doing so might bring the focus into line for you. In a nutshell, point your camera at the sky or some other blank background and twist the lens out of focus. Now use the diopter adjustment to focus the screen #'s for your eyes. All done. If that isn't enough for your eyes, you will need some kind of add-on diopter. I haven't been able to find the right ones on Nikon's accessory list, but haven't dug deeply in their site. The literature that came with your camera should tell you if they are available.
While I can compensate for my eyes with diopter adjustment on our SLR's, I cannot on our 4x5's. My strategy might help you: I simply got one of those embarrassing little chain thingies you put on your glasses so they can hang around your neck while not in use. I put that on my reading glasses and let them dangle till I need them. I bring that up because I do the same when I grab one of my wife's cameras without the diopter adjustment, using the glasses to see the screen details while relying in the focus indicator in the LRC of the screen to indicate proper focus. That might be a good fallback for you!
Hi, Dale,
The only viewfinder in which I've been able to read every little darn thing is the F6. It's a glorious machine, but it's film. I have a D200 which is close kin to the D80. So I have a couple suggestions, not ideal, but one or more of them might work for you:
Don't rush out and buy or order the DG-2 until you try it on your camera. It magnifies only the center of the viewfinder. Great for macro and/or copy work but IMO not much good for general photography or for what you need.
If you haven't, find the little control wheel to the right of the viewfinder. Max it out to minus if you are nearsighted, to plus if you are farsighted. It doesn't provide much correction, but every little bit helps.
Use the top panel to read the analog meter. It's a pain if you need to shoot quickly, but once dialed in, if the lighting in the scene doesn't change much, you're okay and can usually tweak the exposure during post processing.
You can also achieve a "manual" shooting method by selecting either A- or S-priority and using the exposure compenstion button on the top of the camera. That number is very readable in the viewfinder as you set it.
Your eye doctor can measure and prescribe a lens for you where one of the elements of the bi- or trifocal is the strength needed and is positioned in your eyeglasses so as to read just the bottom of the viewfinder where the readout is.
Take your camera to the drug store & buy the correct magnifying pair of "reading glasses" that allow you to see the readout. Once safely home with them, pop the lens out of the frame and tape it securely onto the camera where it magnifies just the readout area.
Last but not least, with practice using the camera, I've gotten to where I can tell how the exposure meter looks at various manual settings. So, getting out on the road and winding it out will definitely help too!
Please feel free to e-mail me. Sometimes the devil's in the details.
Let us know what works for you. You're not alone in your little boat.
Posted by Bill Fach on January 22, 2007 at 2:34 PM
Dale: Optometry is what I do between photo sessions You need to find out the prescription values for the distance correction on your glasses. If you can get it e-mail me and I can give you some more specific advice. In the meantime though I would suggest that you learn the sequences to bring up your histogram quickly. That was one of the first things I learned when I went digital. Unless it is fast action I just check the scale after each shot and see where the light fell and then adjust accordingly. If the action is fast I trust the camera's auto systems and am rarely disappointed. I probably shoot 95% of my shots in aperture priority and find the camera amazingly accurate. >=))>
I dug deeper into the Nikon site, and they list accessories that should help. Here's a screen grab.
Posted by Dale Williams on January 22, 2007 at 3:16 PM
Wow! Once again, you are all great and I appreciate your suggestions. Hank, I assume those accessories will fit the D80. I'll email Nikon support to make sure. In the meantime, you all have given me some great ideas as workarounds. Bill, I have an eye exam coming up in a few weeks. I'll let you know what the prescription looks like then. Thanks again for helping. I'll let you know of my progress.
Posted by Jim Erhardt on January 22, 2007 at 4:21 PM
Dale, thanks for your kind words!
I agree, all those members reaching out to lend a hand is a beautiful thing!
That grab is right from pdf of D80 tech specs I downloaded from the Nikon site. You'll need the right DK-20C viewfinder lens to match your prescription, rather than the magnifying eyepiece also listed. Dig a little deeper to see what you can find out about the specifics of each lens and take that info when you go in for your eye exam. Your optometrist can help you choose the right one. For that matter, if sufficient info is not available to share with your optometrist, reverse the order of things and call Nikon for advice once you have your prescription in hand.
Posted by David Senesac on January 22, 2007 at 5:26 PM
Welcome to the club. Presbyopia affects most of we older folk and I am no different. My near vision used to be fine at 6 inches but these days anything closer than 15 suffers. So most of us start using reading glasses for all manner of purposes. I have a number of pairs in my home, car, at work, and in my photography gear. Focusing on a ground glass is the most critical and tedious task when I use my view camera. Under the dark cloth I use, that requires a rather close eye to glass distance so I use 3.0 diopter reading glasses for that while for book reading use 1.25 diopter glasses. For tasks such as photography where one is likely to be putting on and removing the glasses frequently, some type of eyeglass keeper works well. I would suggest using inexpensive prescription reading glasses for shooting in the field as there is considerable opportunity for glasses to become broken, scratched, or lost. ...David
Posted by Alex Lofquist on January 22, 2007 at 6:14 PM
I remember this quip:
"She was only the optometrist's daughter, but if she had a couple of glasses she would make a spectacle!"
A hand held light meter such as the Sekonic L558R should be useful. I too have vision problems like you describe, and for LF photography I find reading glasses work the best. Glasses also prevent you from getting close enough to the viewfinder. I think they should be designed specifically for spectacle wearers, especially since most people over 50 wear them.
Thanks, Hank. I didn't know Nikon had all those other accessories. Once I get my eye overhauled, I'll check into it more. Maybe I will at last be able use something "off the shelf" and have it be just the right solution.
Gees, Dale, I'm glad you posted the question.
Posted by Dale Williams on January 23, 2007 at 10:03 AM
Glad to be of service Catherine! At least I know I'm not the only one who struggles with this. Hey,does anyone know about the Katz-eye sp? split-screen accessory? I'm thinking it is more of a focusing aid and not necessarily a diopter of any kind but a friend suggested I look into it.
Thanks again for all your replies everyone!
Dale Williams
Arlington, Texas
Posted by Dale Williams on January 23, 2007 at 10:03 AM
Glad to be of service Catherine! At least I know I'm not the only one who struggles with this. Hey,does anyone know about the Katz-eye sp? split-screen accessory? I'm thinking it is more of a focusing aid and not necessarily a diopter of any kind but a friend suggested I look into it.
Posted by Kent Staubus on January 23, 2007 at 11:33 PM
Dale--
Yes, I chase a few trains out here in the snow. It's just like wildlife--they leave tracks, sometimes you have to be sneaky to get close, and they have places you can catch them at rest! Lately though I've been photo'ing my favorite winter subject--the great frozen glacial lakes and ice fishermen! There's about 15 inches of good ice so it's safe to drive on now. Just don't get lost in a snowstorm and drive off into open water like the two teenagers did up by Willmar MN the other day! (They got out OK but the truck is 13 ft. down.)
Anyway, you might consider another route here if all you want are the numbers in the viewfinder. I too use the D80. If you take a shot, push the little arrow on the upper left back of the camera to make the image appear on the LCD. Now, jog the little tumb dial, (the one that changes the focus points--back of camera) up or down until you come to the screen that tells you what the exposure data was in little white writing. By using a magnifying glass you can easily see this (possibly easy?) You can make the images stay on longer by adjusting the time in your menu. See the manual. What I've been doing is simply taking a test shot and then looking at the histogram deal. It's easy to see and very quick to use. Having your camera set in manual you can easily adjust f-stop or shutter speed with the dials and then check the histogram again. I did this just tonight in very dim light as a fast train was coming up at me and it worked very well. Either of these work arounds should do what you want without having to buy anything.
Discussion
18 repliesI am 52 years young and my vision has started to deteriorate. I wear trifocals and see pretty well with them for most things so no real complaints there.
However, as I have recently begun to get more serious about this hobby, I decided to upgrade from my trusty Nikon CP8800 to the D80 which I absolutely love. (I've taken it around the block a few times but haven't had a chance to get it out on the road and open it up all the way). The only problem with the camera I have is trying to see the numbers in the viewfinder...specifically the exposure meter. Since I am trying to shoot 100% manual, it is obviously critical to me. The viewfinder is very nice and bright (one of the reasons I settled on the D80) so the scene is clear and focused for me but those darn numbers are just so hard to see.
Are there any of you Nikon (or otherwise) shooters that know of any settings I can change on the D80 or any attachments I can get from Nikon or third party vendors to magnify the viewfinder somewhat?
I know I could probably "google" this (hey, I'm learning new terms everyday) but thought I would see if anyone else here may have dealt with this and/or knows a possible solution.
As I stated in my very first post after joining NPN, this is a great community. I feel I have started to know some of you just by reading your posts and viewing your photos. Sometimes I feel like I am hiking some trail in Utah with Guy, climbing a mountain in the Sierras with Preston, shooting trains with Kent in the Dakotas somewhere, or running the Everglades with Bill. And of course, most any day I feel like I am sitting down with Hank over a cup of coffee and talking shop or just about anything else. Well, the list goes on. I think Mayor Jim Erhardt and Donna have a great little town here and I really like the time I spend here with all of you!!
Dale Williams
Arlington, Texas
Guy
While I don't know the Nikon products, I know that Canon makes a wide variety of corrective diopter eyepieces that replace the rubber eye cup for some of their models. A friend used one on his EOS which really helped. I suspect that if you found the right amount of correction for your viewfinder there would be a way either you or a camera technician could modify a Nikon eyepiece to use this type of extra lens. Also an optomitrist should be able to help you discover the right magnification. I believe the info in a viewfinder is correct to appear to be at about a 3-4 foot focal length.
I suspect you may have to come up with a prototype or two with silicon adhesive and tape before you get the right answer for you but I'd encourage you not to give up.
My wife has exremely strong myopia. We went through a few cameras and finally have a solution that works for her. She prefers one of the old-fashioned focussing screens that has the split image in the middle. With that and her right angle finder for her macro work she manages wonderfully.
Good luck and let us know how you make out
I certainly share your concern, though we don't (yet) own any D80's. You roused my curiosity, so I checked the specs. The D80 has "Built-in diopter adjustment (-2.0 to +1.0 m-1)." If you haven't adjusted that, doing so might bring the focus into line for you. In a nutshell, point your camera at the sky or some other blank background and twist the lens out of focus. Now use the diopter adjustment to focus the screen #'s for your eyes. All done. If that isn't enough for your eyes, you will need some kind of add-on diopter. I haven't been able to find the right ones on Nikon's accessory list, but haven't dug deeply in their site. The literature that came with your camera should tell you if they are available.
While I can compensate for my eyes with diopter adjustment on our SLR's, I cannot on our 4x5's. My strategy might help you: I simply got one of those embarrassing little chain thingies you put on your glasses so they can hang around your neck while not in use. I put that on my reading glasses and let them dangle till I need them. I bring that up because I do the same when I grab one of my wife's cameras without the diopter adjustment, using the glasses to see the screen details while relying in the focus indicator in the LRC of the screen to indicate proper focus. That might be a good fallback for you!
The only viewfinder in which I've been able to read every little darn thing is the F6. It's a glorious machine, but it's film. I have a D200 which is close kin to the D80. So I have a couple suggestions, not ideal, but one or more of them might work for you:
Don't rush out and buy or order the DG-2 until you try it on your camera. It magnifies only the center of the viewfinder. Great for macro and/or copy work but IMO not much good for general photography or for what you need.
If you haven't, find the little control wheel to the right of the viewfinder. Max it out to minus if you are nearsighted, to plus if you are farsighted. It doesn't provide much correction, but every little bit helps.
Use the top panel to read the analog meter. It's a pain if you need to shoot quickly, but once dialed in, if the lighting in the scene doesn't change much, you're okay and can usually tweak the exposure during post processing.
You can also achieve a "manual" shooting method by selecting either A- or S-priority and using the exposure compenstion button on the top of the camera. That number is very readable in the viewfinder as you set it.
Your eye doctor can measure and prescribe a lens for you where one of the elements of the bi- or trifocal is the strength needed and is positioned in your eyeglasses so as to read just the bottom of the viewfinder where the readout is.
Take your camera to the drug store & buy the correct magnifying pair of "reading glasses" that allow you to see the readout. Once safely home with them, pop the lens out of the frame and tape it securely onto the camera where it magnifies just the readout area.
Last but not least, with practice using the camera, I've gotten to where I can tell how the exposure meter looks at various manual settings. So, getting out on the road and winding it out will definitely help too!
Please feel free to e-mail me. Sometimes the devil's in the details.
Let us know what works for you. You're not alone in your little boat.
I dug deeper into the Nikon site, and they list accessories that should help. Here's a screen grab.
I agree, all those members reaching out to lend a hand is a beautiful thing!
That grab is right from pdf of D80 tech specs I downloaded from the Nikon site. You'll need the right DK-20C viewfinder lens to match your prescription, rather than the magnifying eyepiece also listed. Dig a little deeper to see what you can find out about the specifics of each lens and take that info when you go in for your eye exam. Your optometrist can help you choose the right one. For that matter, if sufficient info is not available to share with your optometrist, reverse the order of things and call Nikon for advice once you have your prescription in hand.
"She was only the optometrist's daughter, but if she had a couple of glasses she would make a spectacle!"
The Nikon D80 is the camera of my choice too.
Will
Edmonton, Alberta
Canada
Gees, Dale, I'm glad you posted the question.
Thanks again for all your replies everyone!
Dale Williams
Arlington, Texas
Thanks again for all your replies everyone!
Dale Williams
Arlington, Texas
http://www.zigview.co.uk/S2.htm
Yes, I chase a few trains out here in the snow. It's just like wildlife--they leave tracks, sometimes you have to be sneaky to get close, and they have places you can catch them at rest! Lately though I've been photo'ing my favorite winter subject--the great frozen glacial lakes and ice fishermen! There's about 15 inches of good ice so it's safe to drive on now. Just don't get lost in a snowstorm and drive off into open water like the two teenagers did up by Willmar MN the other day!
Anyway, you might consider another route here if all you want are the numbers in the viewfinder. I too use the D80. If you take a shot, push the little arrow on the upper left back of the camera to make the image appear on the LCD. Now, jog the little tumb dial, (the one that changes the focus points--back of camera) up or down until you come to the screen that tells you what the exposure data was in little white writing. By using a magnifying glass you can easily see this (possibly easy?) You can make the images stay on longer by adjusting the time in your menu. See the manual. What I've been doing is simply taking a test shot and then looking at the histogram deal. It's easy to see and very quick to use. Having your camera set in manual you can easily adjust f-stop or shutter speed with the dials and then check the histogram again. I did this just tonight in very dim light as a fast train was coming up at me and it worked very well. Either of these work arounds should do what you want without having to buy anything.
Kent in SD