I am about to go on a Wildlife workshop and want to make sure i have the best equipment my limited funds can give me.
I am using Nikon equipment.
The lens will be used for General wildlife and also some Airshows.
A few of the usual options i have been looking at are
Nikon 80-400 VR (Can't use TC's though)
Sigma 80-400 OS (Can't seem to find stock)
Sigma 50-500 (Does not seem very sharp going by the reviews i have read)
Nikon 300mm f4 with 1.7TC
I think the 300mm looks the best option, but i would be very grateful if you could help me decide or if indeed, you have any other ideas
Check out either a used 300/2.8 or used 500/4.5 Sigma.
Not the most fashionable lenses on the planet, but in terms of image quality for the money they are hard to beat
FFordes have a used Tokina 300/2.8 in stock....another very good lens and well suited for use with a t/c
https://secure.ffordes.com/Shop/Store/Itemdet.asp?Type=secd&sub=1&Code=NK&SubCode=AL&id=69802&promo=0
Hi if you shop a round you may find the sigma 300 f2.8hsm (private sale) at around £1000, I managed to pick one up for a close friend of mine absolutely mint a very sharp lens indeed I would only go for the HSM/AFS lenses with your camera selection I will be surprised if you can find a 500hsm f4.5 for that kind of money, I see you already have the 70-200f2.8 why don't you buy both the 1.4 & 2x sigma converts.
Phillip.
Posted by Mark Smith on January 23, 2007 at 2:13 AM
Hi,
I've previously owned a Sigma 50-500mm and found I got sharp photos with a D70, my only criticism of this lens is that it was a bit slow at the 500 end, but I'm thinking of getting another one for some travelling I'm doing.
I've also owned a Tokina 300 f2.8 AF which is a beautiful lens, I would still have it now if I could carry it with my 600 F4 it works well with the Kenko Pro TC's x1.4 and x2, so I swapped it for the Nikon 300 F4 AFS which is probably my favourite lens, it works well with a 1.4TC but very slow with my x2 TC.
I have to second Philip's comment about getting the TC's for the 70-200f2.8, you'll save a good proportion of the £1000 which you can put towards a 500mm at a later date.
If you do go down the Tokina route checkout Aperture as they have what i think is my old one for sale at £850, if so, it is is mint condition, he's had it a while now so you could knock another 100-150 quid off.
Mark
Posted by Andy Bate on January 23, 2007 at 4:34 AM
I picked up my Sigma 500mm F4.5 for £900, so they are out there!!!!
Regarding the 70-200 with a TC, at best that would give me 400mm, is that really long enough for wildlife ? I would of thought that would be too short.
I was intending n buying a Nikon 1.7TC anyway with whicever lens i buy. Would the Nikon TC work with the Sigma lenses ?
Just found out that the Nikon TC would not work with the Sigma 70-200.
Posted by Chris Lloyd on January 23, 2007 at 6:38 AM
Hi Paul,
Avoid the Nikon 80-400mm, I think its a terrible lens!
I had one on my D70 and D2X and sold it soon after, AF was slow and noisy and image quality wasn't great IMHO.
Shame your not using canon , i have a Sigma 500mm F4.5 that i would have let you have for that sort of cash, it would be ideal and a great lens for the money and if you can pick one up with the sort of cash you have i would go for it.
400mm plus 1.5x crop factor gives you an angle of view comparable to 600mm on a film camera. This really isn`t that short, maybe except for small birds. The Sigma 80-400 OS can take Sigma converters (although on a f/5.6 lens, only 1.4x would make sense) The Nikon 80-400 VR doesn`t take any Nikon tc-s that would retain AF but it _might_ work with some cheap third party converter (worth a google but probably not the way to get sharp images)
The 300/4 would certainly be a fine choice if you expect to have use for the lens alone (It will be quite similar to your 70-200/2.8 with an 1.4x converter, just sharper). If not, I must agree with some of the others: a used 300/2.8 might open some new opportunities for you. I know a couple of photographers who get excellent stuff with Sigma 300/2.8 HSM-s combined with 1.4x or 2x converters. I borrowed this combo on a shoot and while quite heavy, it seemed well-made and was surprisingly responsive (It was the Canon mount version, though). Sigma also makes a 120-300/2.8 zoom that might be worth a look.
You have a lot of choices if you consider used gear as well as new. It would be best if you could handle some of the alternatives in a shop before you buy. Especially so for heavier lenses or those that lack the AF-S/HSM style focussing motors.
Posted by Andy Bate on January 23, 2007 at 7:35 AM
I use the Sigma 500mm with the Kenko 1.4x, results are good and am happy with it, one day ill own a nikon 500mm, one day!!!!
Posted by John Swift on January 23, 2007 at 9:26 AM
Paul,
Having owned several of the lenses you are considering I would make the following observations:
80-400VR autofocus too slow, best stopped down for really sharp images.
50-500 slightly better af but max aperture f6.3 at the long end, not really sharp either.
500 f4.5 good af, sharp and takes a 1.4 tc reasonably well.
The 500 I sold because I have a 300-800 and it never got used, the others were just not good enough for my requirements.
As others have said 300 is not really long enough for wildlife photography in this country unless you intend to use feeding stations to get close. In that instance I would echo what Ott said regarding the Sigma 120-300 f2.8 which is a great lens that I've used several times shooting bears in Alaska and takes a 1.4 tc really well (a modified Nikon one is best). I still have this lens although having changed systems from Nikon to Canon it is now surplus to requirements along with the 300-800.
Regards
JohnS
Posted by Martin Fowler on January 23, 2007 at 11:37 AM
I'd agree with John, 300/2.8 or 500/4.5
I have both but have never carried both at the same time. The 300 gets the most use, often with 1.4 or 2x, but I'm not doing birds much at present.
The Sigma 500 will take the Nikon convertor with minor modification, though AF is a bit iffy.
Looking at your current kit, you may have to add in a couple of £00 for a tripod/head for the heavier lens , and a bag to carry it in . It just goes on.
Posted by Paul Wilkinson on January 23, 2007 at 12:01 PM
Thx all
I have a tripod and bag !! That should not be a problem !!
Cheers
paul
Posted by Andy Bate on January 23, 2007 at 12:10 PM
hi john, is your nikon 300-800 surplus to you???
Posted by John Swift on January 23, 2007 at 1:23 PM
Hi Andy,
Yup, I'm afraid all my Nikon gear is surplus now although I might just take it along with me to Aviemore this weekend to backup my Canon kit (if I can shake off this cold that is!!!!!). There is an ad on this forum and in the classifieds and it will all be appearing on a popular web based auction site in the fullness of time for those interested.
Regards
JohnS
Posted by Andy Bate on January 23, 2007 at 1:41 PM
Discussion
21 repliesI am about to go on a Wildlife workshop and want to make sure i have the best equipment my limited funds can give me.
I am using Nikon equipment.
The lens will be used for General wildlife and also some Airshows.
A few of the usual options i have been looking at are
Nikon 80-400 VR (Can't use TC's though)
Sigma 80-400 OS (Can't seem to find stock)
Sigma 50-500 (Does not seem very sharp going by the reviews i have read)
Nikon 300mm f4 with 1.7TC
I think the 300mm looks the best option, but i would be very grateful if you could help me decide or if indeed, you have any other ideas
Thx
Paul
Not the most fashionable lenses on the planet, but in terms of image quality for the money they are hard to beat
FFordes have a used Tokina 300/2.8 in stock....another very good lens and well suited for use with a t/c
https://secure.ffordes.com/Shop/Store/Itemdet.asp?Type=secd&sub=1&Code=NK&SubCode=AL&id=69802&promo=0
Are the ones you mention manual focus, because I would prefer AF if possible
Thx
Paul
Phillip.
I've previously owned a Sigma 50-500mm and found I got sharp photos with a D70, my only criticism of this lens is that it was a bit slow at the 500 end, but I'm thinking of getting another one for some travelling I'm doing.
I've also owned a Tokina 300 f2.8 AF which is a beautiful lens, I would still have it now if I could carry it with my 600 F4 it works well with the Kenko Pro TC's x1.4 and x2, so I swapped it for the Nikon 300 F4 AFS which is probably my favourite lens, it works well with a 1.4TC but very slow with my x2 TC.
I have to second Philip's comment about getting the TC's for the 70-200f2.8, you'll save a good proportion of the £1000 which you can put towards a 500mm at a later date.
If you do go down the Tokina route checkout Aperture as they have what i think is my old one for sale at £850, if so, it is is mint condition, he's had it a while now so you could knock another 100-150 quid off.
Mark
Regarding the 70-200 with a TC, at best that would give me 400mm, is that really long enough for wildlife ? I would of thought that would be too short.
I was intending n buying a Nikon 1.7TC anyway with whicever lens i buy. Would the Nikon TC work with the Sigma lenses ?
Thx
Paul
Avoid the Nikon 80-400mm, I think its a terrible lens!
I had one on my D70 and D2X and sold it soon after, AF was slow and noisy and image quality wasn't great IMHO.
Regards Chris
www.c-m-l.com
To be honest, I know i added it in my original list, i have pretty much dis regarded it. Apparently it is slow and can't add TC's !!
Brian
The 300/4 would certainly be a fine choice if you expect to have use for the lens alone (It will be quite similar to your 70-200/2.8 with an 1.4x converter, just sharper). If not, I must agree with some of the others: a used 300/2.8 might open some new opportunities for you. I know a couple of photographers who get excellent stuff with Sigma 300/2.8 HSM-s combined with 1.4x or 2x converters. I borrowed this combo on a shoot and while quite heavy, it seemed well-made and was surprisingly responsive (It was the Canon mount version, though). Sigma also makes a 120-300/2.8 zoom that might be worth a look.
You have a lot of choices if you consider used gear as well as new. It would be best if you could handle some of the alternatives in a shop before you buy. Especially so for heavier lenses or those that lack the AF-S/HSM style focussing motors.
Having owned several of the lenses you are considering I would make the following observations:
80-400VR autofocus too slow, best stopped down for really sharp images.
50-500 slightly better af but max aperture f6.3 at the long end, not really sharp either.
500 f4.5 good af, sharp and takes a 1.4 tc reasonably well.
The 500 I sold because I have a 300-800 and it never got used, the others were just not good enough for my requirements.
As others have said 300 is not really long enough for wildlife photography in this country unless you intend to use feeding stations to get close. In that instance I would echo what Ott said regarding the Sigma 120-300 f2.8 which is a great lens that I've used several times shooting bears in Alaska and takes a 1.4 tc really well (a modified Nikon one is best). I still have this lens although having changed systems from Nikon to Canon it is now surplus to requirements along with the 300-800.
Regards
JohnS
I have both but have never carried both at the same time. The 300 gets the most use, often with 1.4 or 2x, but I'm not doing birds much at present.
The Sigma 500 will take the Nikon convertor with minor modification, though AF is a bit iffy.
Looking at your current kit, you may have to add in a couple of £00 for a tripod/head for the heavier lens
I have a tripod and bag !! That should not be a problem !!
Cheers
paul
Yup, I'm afraid all my Nikon gear is surplus now although I might just take it along with me to Aviemore this weekend to backup my Canon kit (if I can shake off this cold that is!!!!!). There is an ad on this forum and in the classifieds and it will all be appearing on a popular web based auction site in the fullness of time for those interested.
Regards
JohnS
Dave,
Forest of Dean, UK