Backpacking and Camping Help

Ok, I am now accruing equipment to start treking through the wilderness. I really want to photograph "off the beaten path". Since I am a novice, I am struggling with how to store food and make it animal proof. I have seen jugs sold at REI that are bear proof and you place them somewhere 300 ft away from you. I'm just not sure about it. Any equipment suggestions and techniques?

Additionally, I am concerned about lightning. Are there also any suggestions or techniques people can share about pitching the tent in safe areas in alpine terrain?

Thanks,
Tad

Tad, always have a plan to pitch your tent below treeline or at least beneath surrounding landforms. Do not pitch at the base of large rocks or trees. Watch the sky for the formation of lower cumulous clouds that often develop into thunderstorms over mountainous regions with the afternoon sun, especially in the Rockies. Should a thunderstorm hit, sit on a thermarest air matress or foam pad. It's rare in the US to find an area where suitable sites cannot be found with a little planning.

As food storage goes, Bear canisters are the safest and most versitle option, but they are also heavy and bulky. You should store them and cook your meals several hundered feet from camp when in Bear country. I've not heard of a bear actually walking off with one yet, but I suppose a Bear might throw it around a bit if it were trying to get the food out. I have never heard of one being destroyed by a bear.
I prefer to hang my food. Weight and space is a problem with all my photo gear so I hate the idea of carrying a bear canister but have done so where required, like Yosemite. It's unusual to find a spot where I cannot hang food appropriately. Remember, Black Bears can climb trees well and have been caught stealing food from inproperly hung bags. Always hang your food bag more than 12 feet off the ground and 5 feet from the trunk of the tree so the Bear cannot climb and swipe at it. Using multiple trees works well sometimes. Also, if trees are not available you are A: probably not in typical Black Bear country (unless north of the Tetons you may be in Grizzly country - Grizzlies favor areas near treeline) B: probably near enough to some large rocks or cliffs from which you can hang your food off of. C: in Marmot country, and those little guys can be a big problem too. I once aquired a camp-pet Marmot we named Mo while staying at 13,000 feet in RMNP - a testament to these critters doing just about anything to get at your food. I found him upside-down in my open backpack.

Look at your route and make choices accordingly. If it is a mostly alpine route a canister might work best. In all other situations I'd save the space and hang your food. Also keep in mind that many national parks offer Bear-safe storage options at the required backcountry campsites. Glacier NP. and the Canadian Rockies have poles for hanging food at almost all campsites.

Thanks Marc for the detailed response. I really appreciate it!

It depends on where you are going and how off the beaten path you intend to travel. After working for several years in the backcountry for the park service I have acquired a new respect for bear cans. People simply can't figure out how to hang food...it is almost always hung in a way that would be a slight challenge for a warthog but no trouble for a bear. If you are staying in developed backcountry campsites on federal land, however, the park service may have installed bear wires which are easy to use and fool proof. Just make sure you bring some sort of stuff sack with a loop or rope to attach to the clip. You can always call ahead and see what provisions will be available.

When this isn't an option the bear can really isn't so bad. The most frustrating thing about them is their dimensions more than their weight (and I usually backpack with a full 6x7 outfit); there is just never a good place in the pack for it. On the other hand it is really convenient to have solid container for trash and food...you can carry more fragile things like pop tarts without them becoming mush. The little black garcia cans also make a pretty good seat.

Thanks for the response Mark. Maybe this is a stupid question, but do you have to wedge the cannister or tie it down too? I was thinking along the lines of what Marc said in his post about a bear or another animal playing around with it. I would hate to wake up and find that it had been tossed down hill or not find it at all.

I've not personally heard of anyone tying it down, which might be hard to do right given the shape of the canister. I doubt you could find a rock heavy enough to stop a hungry bear from at least playing with it either, but again, the chances of it going far don't seem all that great. I haven't heard of it happening.

Mark - you're totally right. People can NOT figure out how to hang those things! The cliff strategy is pretty fool-proof (assuming there is one around) though the tree strategy can be more complicated. I blame it mostly on laziness.

I certainly don't mean this with disrespect, only for safety's sake.... And from a woman's perspective, I guess, too...
If you are a novice in the backcountry, go a few times with someone who has more experience. Besides it's fun to tell "war stories" around the campfire when you have company.
Best wishes and good adventuring to you.

Tad, I got a BearVault 350 Solo cannister last year for my Wind Rivers backpacking trip. I've always hung my food, but I knew I was going to be in an area frequented by black bears and with few options for hanging a bag (short stubby trees). The cannister worked very well but, as Marc mentioned, is bulky. The directions for the cannister recommend wedging it under a rock or large tree stump to help prevent the bear from getting it and tossing it around. It is supposedly very hard for a bear to get a proper bite on one of these cannisters to be able to carry it away. They are incredibly tough and very smooth.

That being said, a friend on the trip had an Ursack. It is a WAY-tough stuff sack that you tie to a log, tree or rock. I like that idea better because it would be easier to fit into a pack than a large round cannister. And it compresses down to the volume of whatever you have in it. I found myself filling my cannister with other stuff as my food volume decreased during the days of the trip. I don't know if the Ursack is approved by the various National Parks that require bear cannisters, but that would be easy to find out with a visit to their website.

I totally agree with the remark about many people not knowing how to properly hang a bear bag (though I'm sure Mark and Marc do.. ), or just being too lazy to do it right. It can be a tedious task sometimes.

I will carry a bear canister in the Sierra where bears are more habituated, but in the lower Rockies (at least here in Utah) I just put my food and other bear desirables (toothpaste, etc.) wrapped in a stuff sack and hang it from a high thin branch (not near a large trunk where the bear can climb), anchoring the other end of the string to a stake or another tree. This has so far worked well. I only had one black bear encounter in the Uinta mountains when my food was stored this way though. The bear stood under it, stretched up to sniff (it couldn't reach the bag) and just wandered away. I also found bear and raccoon tracks around my camp numerous times in the morning or when coming back from a hike and they never got to my food.

I think a bigger danger to your food is actually rodents. Many people don't secure their food when not in bear country and are often surprised to find their food all over the place after a mouse had gnawed through the packaging and helped itself to the content.

Aside from that, perhaps the equivalent of a backpacking bible is the ubiquitous "Mountaineering - Freedom of the Hills". It is packed with all kinds of useful advice and techniques. I suggest you get a copy and skim through it every time you get a chance as you gain more practical experience.

Guy

tip of iceberg of what you might find on www ...David

http://www.lnt.org/programs/lnt7/index.html

http://www.thebackpacker.com/trailtalk/thread/29978,-1.php

http://www.ursack.com/home.htm

The only problem with ursack, is if the bear does find your sack, you'll be eating mashed-up crumbs the rest of your days out there. That and there is a lot of debate about the level of protection it offers. As I recall, Ursack was not allowed as a substitute for a canister when I was in Yosemite in 2003. I believe it has gained more acceptance in recent years.

Guy is right. Rodents can be a problem - I once had a chipmunk chew through my bag when I was camped at 11,000 feet in Great Basin NP. in January!! You'd think it would have been hibernating?! I've also had them chew through my backpack and tent on seperate occasions (should have kept my tent cleaner!). Animals are frequently after salt too. I've heard of Deer and Goats eating peoples boots - I had mine eaten partially by a Porcupine once in Jasper. I'd keep those inside your tent in Goat country.

Lotsa talk about bears, and good advice with it. It's probably time to interject a useful piece of advice:

Don't let the prospect of bears or anything else start to cool your ardor for packing. There are so many good choices in gear and tactics that it may be a little overhwhelming and start to seem like bears are a big deal. They're only a big deal if you don't take precautions, but you have a lot of easy and reasonable countermeasures to choose from.

Pick the one that seems most sensible and likely to fit your routine, then get on with your plans. With the simple precautions, bears are no big deal at all in your daily happiness and success on a hike. In truth the fit of your pack and your boots will have a much greater impact on your trips. Sleeping comfortably is key too, especially in the kind of marginal weather that usually makes for the best photography.

Conditioning and matching your load with your capabilities are key, too. Match the rigor of your first hike with your conditioning, and don't be overly ambitious. I'll guarantee that your pack will be too heavy on your first trip, and that you won't use half the gear you carry. It will be a very good idea to take a shorter "break-in" hike or two before taking on a real ambitious trip. You'll need to know what you are capable of and which gear to leave at home and replace with the things you should have brought.

Haven't even gotten to camera gear yet, have we? Especially on your break-in hikes, I'd be tempted to take only a pocket digicam and explore with that before deciding which camera gear you will really need for your style of photography. Camera gear is worse than backpack gear for accumulating weight you really don't need, so it's better to start out with the minimum and add as you discover your own needs and tastes.

Two other general rules about where to pitch a tent.

Along with the lightning in a thuderstorm can come heavy rain, which can lead to stream flooding. watch for evidence of flooding if you are going to setup near a stream and don't camp there if in doubt. So basically the ridgelines and stream channels are the least desireable places to camp.

Also from a sanitary perspective, do your cooking cleanup away from your camp site AND any water sources. Same goes for the bodily functions. Try to stay the length of a football field away from the water.

I've had worse than Marc with a chipmonk. I was sleeping and my hand was sticking outside my tent (June or July in the Colorado front range). Darn rodent bit my finger. It was like 2:00AM. If you know how fingers bleed, then you can imagine how surprised I was when I woke up.

Wow! That's weird. I once woke up due to a Pine Marten climbing onto my face - thankfully it didn't bite me!

My experience suggests that Marc's comments are right on. You read about how to do things, and think that maybe that would never happen. I was in the Wind River area a few years back and woke to some noise in the middle of the night. A black bear had indeed climbed the tree my food pack was hanging from, pulled it close to the trunk with a paw, ripped a hole in the material and was munching on my food. At the base of a tree was a skunk picking at the food falling down from what the bear was eating. They both shooed away pretty easily, but it was a lesson learned. It was fortunately our last night out so the loss of food wasn't a big deal.

FWIW, in Yosemite and King's Canyon national parks, you are required to use a bear cannister on overnight trips (though they're testing the Ursack and may be allowing its use now). Anyone who remembers these parks before bear-cannister use will be able to appreciate how well this requirement has worked.

In my experiences, running into a bear or a bear messing with your stuff is pretty remote if you follow the rules. But watch out for raccoons, if left alone for a short period of time, a couple of raccoons will mess up all your gear.

Wow. Thanks so much everyone for the feedback. This really helps a lot. I really appreciate it!

An October backpacking trip on the Appalachian Trail in GSMNP provided many of the same experiences as mentioned above. The NPS has very good bear hangs at each shelter that are simple to use. We had a bear come near the shelter on our last of 3 nights but it just kept moving on w/ no problems. Keeping a clean campsite is key to preventing encounters. The mice were, of course, a nuisance chewing through one of the elastic cords on my backpack the 1st night and chewing on my buddy's camelback tube another night. Best to open up all zippers on pack, jackets, etc to let them explore rather than chewing their way in. 2 of 3 nights the rodents did their damage. This was my first backpacking trip carrying my camera gear and I plan to scale down next time..primarily by reducing my tripod weight by switching to carbon fiber. As with anything the more you do it the better you'll get. I can't wait for my next trip!

Very nice topic which I've been wanting to start too, thanks for doing it for me, Tad.

I'm a very "novice" camper, I've been doing mostly day hikes since about 6-7 months; I've actually started taking photography seriously only slightly more than a year ago.

My problem is that I tend to camp/hike alone; most of my buddies would rather check into a local pub and drink all night; photography is something they do when people get married

I'm a bit nervous venturing out alone in the wild at night; and I believe this is primarily due to my Indian background. For people like, the wild forest/jungle is the place for leopards, tigers and kraits and cobras. So my experience in the wild at night and on multi-day trips is almost non-existent. It would be nice to know how you guys

- carry so much food for a multi-day trip (i.e 10+ days?)
- keep it safe from other competitors in the wild
- personal hygiene on such a trip?

Thanks in advance, and continue with the very informative discussion.

Good info, here. One thing I don't think has been mentioned is to always check for dead branches above you before pitching your tent beneath trees. It's never happened to me, but they can come tumbling down onto your tent while you sleep.

Lori