With a digital camera just use the histogram as an indicator and adjust exposure as needed. With film the common wisdom is to open one stop from the meter reading (or dial in +1 stop exposure compensation), but that's a dangerous assumption with matrix/evaluative meters since some of them actually do a pretty good job compensating for snow.
As we have snow for about seven months of the year I'd like to say I've got snow figured out. Not a chance!
With the digital I find the largest influence is the position of the sun and resulting colour temperatures. Here, where dawn and dusk are very drawn out, there is a general blue cast to everything shot at those times, though they can be quite dramatic right at dawn and dusk. When the sun is a bit higher, shadows, when you have the sun at your back don't tend to have any blue but shooting against the light they will. I've been trying out various pre settings on my camera but can't say that I've found anything I'm completely happy with as of yet.
To date the best results seem to be at dawn or dusk on a lightly overcast day.
While the digital seems to have a broader depth of exposure over film, in the end it rests on the subject. In shooting some bison here using matrix metering the bison was underexposed and the snow over. Using the spot gave better results for the bison.
Depending on the conditions, it may just come down to what is the most important part of the shot and lose the detail of the snow in favour of some other aspect of the photo.
Dave
Posted by Bill Fach on January 30, 2007 at 2:00 PM
Sandy: I was in RMNP in December and had great results by doing just what Guy said. I reviewed the histogram and set the exposure so there were no clipped highlights. For landscapes where you have the time to review that should be all that you need to do. If you get into a situation with wildlife where you may have to shoot quickly you might just have to trust the matrix meter. If anything it may leave you underexposed which will probably be easier to deal with in processing. >=))>
As I recall Sandy you're shooting Nikon like me, so here's a "test" for you- the same one I did with my D2X in Yellowstone snow last spring: Apply all your manual adjustments, compensations and voodoo, and take the shot. Now switch the camera to P mode with matrix metering and shoot it again. I've never been a P shooter because I didn't trust the metering and software applied. Gotta say that I was totally unprepared for the results of my test: In virtually every case, the camera gave as good or better results on P than I was able to manage on M! I'm still suspicious, but the test did a bunch to improve my attitude about auto exposure.
One variation specific to your examples of the black wolf and bison: Remeber the Sunny 11 and Sunny 22 companions to the Sunny 16 rule. In my experience that was important over and above the snow exposure, whether shooting M or P. In fact, black subjects were the only circumstances in which I dialed in comensation on the P mode. I just wanted a little more light on the dark subjects (+.7) than ambient exposures called for. The trick was to get the detail in the dark areas without blowing the light areas too noticeably.
What others said about histogram.
If lighting conditions are uniform across the area you shoot, you might take a meter reading from snow, then compensate +1EV, take a test shot, check histogram, and if it`s OK, switch to manual and use the same exposure as long as the conditions don`t change. It is a bit risky, but avoids the matrix metering screwing up the exposure when you include a big dark bison in the frame. Obviously you need to pay close attention to the light - if you miss when it changes, you lose some shots.
This is what I did this weekend while stalking roe deer on a snowy field (I shot film, so no histogram, but it worked).
When searching for subjects, it is a good idea to take readings from various areas every now and then. This way, you get a good idea what the right exposure should be and you can easily spot when your camera is getting it wrong while shooting an animal. Some people use gray cards for reference metering.
You hadn't mentioned P mode before. Haven't tried it having the same aversion as you.
Do you notice a difference in shooting snow at the higher latitudes in Alaska? There was no snow when we went south for Christmas so I didn't get a chance to compare. It would be nice to get some confirmation about the difference in colour temperature and the effect on snow.
Not so much latitude as altitude, and perhaps weather, I think. Maybe it's the lack of sun in Alaska this year along with the lower elevation, but color balance seems pretty true up here compared to what I got at the higher elevations at Yellowstone. Subtle blue cast to images from the trip- so subtle it's not really noticeable till you pull one up alongside my local shots. Not talking just the blue in shadows, so much as overall. Very easy adjustment in Color Balance, but once I became aware of it, I did feel obliged to dial it out.
After having black fingertips a number of times I'm trying to get a one size fits all camera setting for the winter. Even -20C sees me putting on mitts rather than gloves, making in camera adjustments difficult.
The first snow scenes I shot after the last firmware up grade looked more like a cyanotype than colour photography. Being a sled dog race I was shooting shutter priority. My first thought was the upgrade had affected the WB, but suspect it was the morning light as the sun had just broken the horizon.
Perhaps your suggestion of using the P mode might make a difference, but suspect the differences with a digital camera will require more experimentation yet as the colour casts with snow do seem different from film. As you suggest it can be adjusted in colour balance; but at the expense of other elements?
Still experimenting, but in addition to Color Balance (and more recently, to the exclusion of it), I've been working in Selective Color, specifically the black slider attached to each of the colors. I like the SC controls better, as they don't affect any of the other colors while you work on one. As a matter of fact, I've recently started using the black, white and neutral bands in it instead of Curves. A lot less "lossy" in my current enthusiastic POV, plus you don't end up pushing the other colors around while working on one. If that all doesn't make sense, get back to me.
Posted by Kent Staubus on January 30, 2007 at 10:21 PM
The Nikon meters do a great job of metering snow scenes when set in matrix until the scene is nearly all white. Otherwise, I'm doing the check the histogram for clipping thing. It works very well. This isn't hard.
Posted by Kim Kaiser on January 31, 2007 at 2:12 AM
depends on the lighting, sunny or cloudy, size of the big dark beast in the frame,,,as someone abvoe stated, it depends on what is important in framing as to how you handle it,, jsut too many variables,, have to keep close eye on histogram
Posted by Tom Webster on January 31, 2007 at 4:52 AM
I'll be the "odd man out" here. I get my best results using an incident meter and then just adjusting a little from there. I found it was much more accurate than Canon's evaluative metering. Dark bison on snow. No problem. Use the indicated incident reading and open up 1/3 to 2/3 stop for a little extra detail in the fur. A white snow goose sitting on snow. Use the incident metered exposure and stop down 1/3 stop to keep the whites separated. Works a charm for me. This way I don't have to worry if my exposure will change if the bison gets bigger or smaller in the frame. I know I'll get "dissed" for this but my exposures have been much more accurate and consistent since I started using an incident meter for 90% of my photos and it has cut down my dependence on the histogram. This is especially important if you are photographing moving subjects against a changing background. The in-camera meter will keep trying to adjust the exposures based on the tones of the whole scene. Incident metering alleviates that mess and keeps exposures consistent for the subject against a moving background.
Discussion
13 repliesCan someone offer some suggestions on exposing for snow landscapes ? And (hopefully) black wolves and dark bison on white snow?
thanks!
Sandy r
Guy
As we have snow for about seven months of the year I'd like to say I've got snow figured out. Not a chance!
With the digital I find the largest influence is the position of the sun and resulting colour temperatures. Here, where dawn and dusk are very drawn out, there is a general blue cast to everything shot at those times, though they can be quite dramatic right at dawn and dusk. When the sun is a bit higher, shadows, when you have the sun at your back don't tend to have any blue but shooting against the light they will. I've been trying out various pre settings on my camera but can't say that I've found anything I'm completely happy with as of yet.
To date the best results seem to be at dawn or dusk on a lightly overcast day.
While the digital seems to have a broader depth of exposure over film, in the end it rests on the subject. In shooting some bison here using matrix metering the bison was underexposed and the snow over. Using the spot gave better results for the bison.
Depending on the conditions, it may just come down to what is the most important part of the shot and lose the detail of the snow in favour of some other aspect of the photo.
Dave
One variation specific to your examples of the black wolf and bison: Remeber the Sunny 11 and Sunny 22 companions to the Sunny 16 rule. In my experience that was important over and above the snow exposure, whether shooting M or P. In fact, black subjects were the only circumstances in which I dialed in comensation on the P mode. I just wanted a little more light on the dark subjects (+.7) than ambient exposures called for. The trick was to get the detail in the dark areas without blowing the light areas too noticeably.
If lighting conditions are uniform across the area you shoot, you might take a meter reading from snow, then compensate +1EV, take a test shot, check histogram, and if it`s OK, switch to manual and use the same exposure as long as the conditions don`t change. It is a bit risky, but avoids the matrix metering screwing up the exposure when you include a big dark bison in the frame. Obviously you need to pay close attention to the light - if you miss when it changes, you lose some shots.
This is what I did this weekend while stalking roe deer on a snowy field (I shot film, so no histogram, but it worked).
When searching for subjects, it is a good idea to take readings from various areas every now and then. This way, you get a good idea what the right exposure should be and you can easily spot when your camera is getting it wrong while shooting an animal. Some people use gray cards for reference metering.
You hadn't mentioned P mode before.
Do you notice a difference in shooting snow at the higher latitudes in Alaska? There was no snow when we went south for Christmas so I didn't get a chance to compare. It would be nice to get some confirmation about the difference in colour temperature and the effect on snow.
Dave
Not so much latitude as altitude, and perhaps weather, I think. Maybe it's the lack of sun in Alaska this year
After having black fingertips a number of times I'm trying to get a one size fits all camera setting for the winter. Even -20C sees me putting on mitts rather than gloves, making in camera adjustments difficult.
The first snow scenes I shot after the last firmware up grade looked more like a cyanotype than colour photography. Being a sled dog race I was shooting shutter priority. My first thought was the upgrade had affected the WB, but suspect it was the morning light as the sun had just broken the horizon.
Perhaps your suggestion of using the P mode might make a difference, but suspect the differences with a digital camera will require more experimentation yet as the colour casts with snow do seem different from film. As you suggest it can be adjusted in colour balance; but at the expense of other elements?
Dave
Still experimenting, but in addition to Color Balance (and more recently, to the exclusion of it), I've been working in Selective Color, specifically the black slider attached to each of the colors. I like the SC controls better, as they don't affect any of the other colors while you work on one. As a matter of fact, I've recently started using the black, white and neutral bands in it instead of Curves. A lot less "lossy" in my current enthusiastic POV, plus you don't end up pushing the other colors around while working on one. If that all doesn't make sense, get back to me.
Kent in SD
sandy