For those who use RAW processors you will undoubtedly have noticed that Adobe Lightroom V1 has been released, possibly more importantly it has been released with an initially discounted price if you buy it before the end of April 07.
A few (8) of you, having noticed that I am using Lightroom, have emailed me with questions about the V1 product. A number of others have been asking me questions on the same subject when we have met. To date, these questions generally centered around Lightroom V1's ability to aid your workflow or/and RAW process your images; also if the functionality is better than ‘XYZ’ product.
Given that I have been working with the Beta Lightroom version since it was made publicly available ( over 6 months ago) I have a reasonable, if not slightly more detailed, knowledge of what Lightroom is capable off than possibly most on the forum – hence why I reckon I am getting these questions. I also have, or had, Breezebrowser, C1Pro, RawShooter Premium, Dx and Bridge to compare it too, the only think I do not have is Aperature as I don't have a Mac.
So now a question to everybody, especially the 8 people who have had a cursory email response and the few that have asked directly.
Would you like me to TRY and book the same room as we held the conference in (near Loughborough) for some Saturday morning before the end of the initial rebate period (probably the 14th April) and give a small ( approx 3 * 30 mins ) demo/run through of Lightroom’s Library and Develop Modules as I use them in my workflow? Their strengths and weakness so to speak and how I changed by workflow to accomadate Lightroom. There is a LOT in the Lightroom product and I will not be able to cover it all all I will cover is is General settings/import, Library, Develop and Export only.
To be clear from the onset this is a small tutorial/demo type presentation which may run onto a Q&A session and it is on Lightroom only. Its purpose is simply for you to see/consider it in time to get the rebate if you decide to purchase it; and to see how it fits into one persons workflow.
To state categorically, this is for simply for UKNP forumites to see the product in action and I have no connections, nor know anybody, who works for Adobe or their resellers
Be warned the Venue may want a small charge for the room; my time is free.
Up to you… if you are interested say so below and if there is enough interest I will see what I can arrange – no promises yet .
A very generous offer, one that I believe anyone interested in Lightroom should take you up on.... it is certainly an application that should be looked at very seriously, particularly as people like Pixel Genius are looking at developing modules (sharpening) with the release of the SDK.... I'm afraid I tried it and uninstalled, I tested both alpha and beta and also qualified for a free copy of V.1, the develop module has some great features in particular it is a breeze to refine complex curves, but the engine behind it all is still 'inferior' (it does appear to be better implimented in CS3, but without the extra refinements in the Lighttroom interface).
The most important thing though, is that along with Aperture it introduces a totally new paradigm that for quite a few photographers will be very advantageous and needs a different(new?) way of thinking that an offer such as this will help people to take on board...
Summing up, although I will not be taking you up on this very kind offer I encourage others to do so......
The C1Pro engine still possibly has an edge but it has not the functionality. I cannot see a difference with Photoshop, although I am one version of the pace with this product.
T
Posted by Adrian North on March 2, 2007 at 5:01 AM
Tom,
Being an ex-Rawshooter Premium user I would be very interested in learning a lot more about Lightroom so count me in
If you where a user of RSP then you should have recieved an e-mail from Adobe with your Lightroom serial number by now - if you haven't then you need to chase up Adobe's customer support...
Agreed about the C1 engine, it will be interesting to see what V.4 brings.... In my testing with 20D files and 5D files the C1 engine rendered better micro detail, note, not such a difference that it would be noticable, the biggest difference was in the handling of noise, most of the time with C1 and ISO400 20D files I do not have to apply any NR, the same file when processed in Lightroom procuced noticably more noise that required the use of NR software.
The Lightroom paradigm is certainly a good one it is just a shame that it is based on the ACR engine. As I said the ability to edit and create complex curves by dragging in the area of the image you wish to alter is brilliant and innovative, plus the stacking and ability to save a number of different versions of the same file without an increase in disk storage space...
For me, at least in this stage of the development of lightroom, it just isn't me, probably because I am so stuck in the downloader pro/BB/C1/PS/portfolio workflow, gee just writing that list I might look at LR again, one app to replace 5....
I don't think it will every replace Photoshop (unless the Sharpening plugin's are the DB's), I don't think that is Adobes intention. The biggest question is will it be a plugin to Bridge, will bridge be a subset of it, or (and my opinion at the moment) is that its is an attempt at creating colour darkroom functionality but going as far as manipulations that could not have been performed colour darkroom (except the dust spotting).
Most of the Raw convertors are now pretty much on an equal par with the main differences in conversion coming down to how familiar the user is with the individual conversion program. When you consider that very little has changed in Phaseone's CaptureOne for 2 to 3 yrs, they where streets ahead of the game and it has taken that length of time for others to play catch-up. I will be interested to see if PhaseOne can continue that original innovative streak. However, I don't think we're going to see much more innovation in actual RAW processing (Lightzone being the exception) - more innovation will now take place in the overall workflow arena - which is where Lightroom and Aperture begin to push out the likes of Breezebrowser, iView etc.
Having played with C1, Lightroom, Breezebrowser, Aperture, iView etc etc, Lightroom is an excellent 1st generation program. It has a lot of catching up on Aperture to do and I'm sure it will given time - they've already 'borrowed' stacking and versioning from Aperture, although they are a pale shadow of Aperture's functionality.
For simple speed of adjusting multiple images and functionality of interface (once you get used to it!), C1 is still top dog for me. If I have to do a batch of shots quickly, then this is the program I'll go for.
For overall functionality, Aperture on the Mac wins against Lightroom - it's interface is better thought out and doesn't get in the way, although Aperture is a power hungry hog - Lightroom moves faster. If you don't have a Mac, then Lightroom is your winner . Neither are perfect, each have their idiosyncracies.
Breezebrowser is still excellent at what it does - allows you to view and review thumbnails very quickly (without importing into a database). I haven't found anything to quite match Breezebrowser on the Mac (PhotoMechanic comes close, but not close enough!).
So, got a PC?
Downloaderpro, Breezebrowser and Lightroom will give you an excellent system. Doing lots of RAW Conversion...get CaptureOne.
Got a Mac?
Get Aperture (and possibly Photomechanic). Doing lots of RAW Conversion...get CaptureOne.
Posted by Nick Caddick on March 2, 2007 at 12:08 PM
Tom,
I would come.
Posted by Adrian North on March 2, 2007 at 6:41 PM
Nick,
Yep I've got it (at least on my laptop - my main machine needs an upgrade to Windows XP ) but I still have to work out how to use it
Adrian
Posted by Elliott Neep on March 3, 2007 at 12:59 PM
I'd like to take this opportunity to say that I too have trailled the Beta software and now own the V1. To anyone thinking about making a move to a new RAW converter I advise you to take Tom up on his generous offer. To put it simply, Lightroom is brilliant! I moaned about the Beta versions incesantly, but the V1 has blown my socks off. Its a real cracker. Its very fast and the conversion quality is the best I have seen. The library module that will help sort and find your images is now very, very fast.
Discussion
11 repliesA few (8) of you, having noticed that I am using Lightroom, have emailed me with questions about the V1 product. A number of others have been asking me questions on the same subject when we have met. To date, these questions generally centered around Lightroom V1's ability to aid your workflow or/and RAW process your images; also if the functionality is better than ‘XYZ’ product.
Given that I have been working with the Beta Lightroom version since it was made publicly available ( over 6 months ago) I have a reasonable, if not slightly more detailed, knowledge of what Lightroom is capable off than possibly most on the forum – hence why I reckon I am getting these questions. I also have, or had, Breezebrowser, C1Pro, RawShooter Premium, Dx and Bridge to compare it too, the only think I do not have is Aperature as I don't have a Mac.
So now a question to everybody, especially the 8 people who have had a cursory email response and the few that have asked directly.
Would you like me to TRY and book the same room as we held the conference in (near Loughborough) for some Saturday morning before the end of the initial rebate period (probably the 14th April) and give a small ( approx 3 * 30 mins ) demo/run through of Lightroom’s Library and Develop Modules as I use them in my workflow? Their strengths and weakness so to speak and how I changed by workflow to accomadate Lightroom. There is a LOT in the Lightroom product and I will not be able to cover it all all I will cover is is General settings/import, Library, Develop and Export only.
To be clear from the onset this is a small tutorial/demo type presentation which may run onto a Q&A session and it is on Lightroom only. Its purpose is simply for you to see/consider it in time to get the rebate if you decide to purchase it; and to see how it fits into one persons workflow.
To state categorically, this is for simply for UKNP forumites to see the product in action and I have no connections, nor know anybody, who works for Adobe or their resellers
Be warned the Venue may want a small charge for the room; my time is free.
Up to you… if you are interested say so below and if there is enough interest I will see what I can arrange – no promises yet .
Tom
John
A very generous offer, one that I believe anyone interested in Lightroom should take you up on.... it is certainly an application that should be looked at very seriously, particularly as people like Pixel Genius are looking at developing modules (sharpening) with the release of the SDK.... I'm afraid I tried it and uninstalled, I tested both alpha and beta and also qualified for a free copy of V.1, the develop module has some great features in particular it is a breeze to refine complex curves, but the engine behind it all is still 'inferior' (it does appear to be better implimented in CS3, but without the extra refinements in the Lighttroom interface).
The most important thing though, is that along with Aperture it introduces a totally new paradigm that for quite a few photographers will be very advantageous and needs a different(new?) way of thinking that an offer such as this will help people to take on board...
Summing up, although I will not be taking you up on this very kind offer I encourage others to do so......
All the best
Phil
The C1Pro engine still possibly has an edge but it has not the functionality. I cannot see a difference with Photoshop, although I am one version of the pace with this product.
T
Being an ex-Rawshooter Premium user I would be very interested in learning a lot more about Lightroom so count me in
Adrian
If you where a user of RSP then you should have recieved an e-mail from Adobe with your Lightroom serial number by now - if you haven't then you need to chase up Adobe's customer support...
Agreed about the C1 engine, it will be interesting to see what V.4 brings.... In my testing with 20D files and 5D files the C1 engine rendered better micro detail, note, not such a difference that it would be noticable, the biggest difference was in the handling of noise, most of the time with C1 and ISO400 20D files I do not have to apply any NR, the same file when processed in Lightroom procuced noticably more noise that required the use of NR software.
The Lightroom paradigm is certainly a good one it is just a shame that it is based on the ACR engine. As I said the ability to edit and create complex curves by dragging in the area of the image you wish to alter is brilliant and innovative, plus the stacking and ability to save a number of different versions of the same file without an increase in disk storage space...
For me, at least in this stage of the development of lightroom, it just isn't me, probably because I am so stuck in the downloader pro/BB/C1/PS/portfolio workflow, gee just writing that list I might look at LR again, one app to replace 5....
All the best
Phil
Most of the Raw convertors are now pretty much on an equal par with the main differences in conversion coming down to how familiar the user is with the individual conversion program. When you consider that very little has changed in Phaseone's CaptureOne for 2 to 3 yrs, they where streets ahead of the game and it has taken that length of time for others to play catch-up. I will be interested to see if PhaseOne can continue that original innovative streak. However, I don't think we're going to see much more innovation in actual RAW processing (Lightzone being the exception) - more innovation will now take place in the overall workflow arena - which is where Lightroom and Aperture begin to push out the likes of Breezebrowser, iView etc.
Having played with C1, Lightroom, Breezebrowser, Aperture, iView etc etc, Lightroom is an excellent 1st generation program. It has a lot of catching up on Aperture to do and I'm sure it will given time - they've already 'borrowed' stacking and versioning from Aperture, although they are a pale shadow of Aperture's functionality.
For simple speed of adjusting multiple images and functionality of interface (once you get used to it!), C1 is still top dog for me. If I have to do a batch of shots quickly, then this is the program I'll go for.
For overall functionality, Aperture on the Mac wins against Lightroom - it's interface is better thought out and doesn't get in the way, although Aperture is a power hungry hog - Lightroom moves faster. If you don't have a Mac, then Lightroom is your winner
Breezebrowser is still excellent at what it does - allows you to view and review thumbnails very quickly (without importing into a database). I haven't found anything to quite match Breezebrowser on the Mac (PhotoMechanic comes close, but not close enough!).
So, got a PC?
Downloaderpro, Breezebrowser and Lightroom will give you an excellent system. Doing lots of RAW Conversion...get CaptureOne.
Got a Mac?
Get Aperture (and possibly Photomechanic). Doing lots of RAW Conversion...get CaptureOne.
I would come.
Yep I've got it (at least on my laptop - my main machine needs an upgrade to Windows XP
Adrian