I highly recommend printing out a pdf of the letter Western Slope No Fee Coalition sent to the Colorado Transportation Commission, and taking it with you to the entrance station as proof that you DO have the right to use the STATE highway, including parking along its right-of-way and at scenic overlooks WITHOUT paying the USFS fee. That they told Bill he could use the road without paying, but only if he didn't stop anywhere along the route, is a serious misrepresentation of the law. Our state tax dollars pay to maintain that highway, and unless we stop to use the "facilities," we shouldn't be bothered by USFS employees. (Then again, even the use of such "facilities" is within the scope of the no-fee structure, as Western Slope No Fee convincingly argues, since any site requiring a fee payment must meet a list of six criteria, with which none of the USFS sites along the Mt. Evans Highway comply.)
Might be time to put a caravan of no-fee champions together to swarm the entrance booth. Strength in numbers. Better yet, maybe somebody needs to station themselves just below the entrance station on one fine weekend day and hand out fliers to the unsuspecting hordes to let them know their rights. But not me, I'm busy that day.
I will be arriving in Colorado tomorrow and plan on visiting Mt. Evans 2 times during my visit. I will be visiting Mt. Evans on May 31 and again June 4. I printed out the letter as suggested by Todd and will bring it with me. I usually don't mind paying an access fee. But if they are charging a fee when they shouldn't I will challenge it. I plan on parking and looking around so will see what happens. Any words of advice?
I agree, Laurie, that reasonable fees are fine, but also agree with you that the USFS shoiuldn't be collecting fees for things they shouldn't be. I'm so sick of being fee'd to death, especially at places where all you're doing, and all that's available to do, is parking.
Todd, I think a RNMP photo excursion would be a "strength in numbers" showing that says we've had enough. We should put one together over the next few weeks to do a sunset shoot. Count me in if we have one!
Craig
BTW, nice idea on the flyer handout. That would get them riled up wouldn't it?
I buy a Golden Eagle passport every year which has always gotten me into Mt Evans anyways. Our National Parks receive so little money from the feds anyways I consider my measly purchase of the Golden Eagle charity anyways.
True enough, Rich. I usually consider user fees to be one of the more fair taxes that can be collected, since it's being collected directly from those who use a facility. However, the USFS is collecting a fee for use of a highway that is paid for with Colorado state tax money. And that ain't right.
But I'd probably argue your point about the NPS getting so little money, whether you're talking comparatively to other agencies, or actual dollars.
Yeah, and the silly argument that you could use your little hologram sticker to get onto Mount Evans but not Brainaird Lake was that one was an entrance fee, one was a use fee, and the sticker only covered one of those (don't remember which one, as it was an utterly pointless distinction).
I have bought the Golden Eagle for years now. The new pass is supposed to cover all the national fee areas, as I understand it. We will see.
Have any of you been to a national park without a fee? Try going to The Great Smoky Mountains and looking at the trash and graffiti. If a fee, as small as most are, prevents that, I'm all for it. As Todd said, the fees are collected from those that use the facilities. I do agree that the fees should stay with the area and a small percentage going to national to make up for those of us who make it a point to buy the passes at our favolite park, RMNP.
Mount Evans is just one of many little power plays by the Forest Service.
I have been studying the issue quite a bit. I have come to the conclusion
that Forest users are in big trouble. The charges are just the tip of the iceberg.
They have invented a term that isn't in the law called a H.I.R.A. High Impact Recreation
Area. They are declaring these all over the U.S. This is what they have decided to
call Mount Evans. They like this designation because you don't have to have any
improvements in order to charge. A good introduction to the subject can be found\
in Congressional Testimony at: http://www.westernslopenofee.org/NoFee/Kitty_Testimony.html
The only distinction I was ever told of at Brainard was that it was a concessioner running it, so they got to keep the fees and hence the Golden Eagle didn't apply to them. Otherwise, Brainard was a Use Fee, Mt. Evans was an Access Fee - you couldn't get out of paying Use Fees, but Access Fees were covered by the Golden Eagle sticker... Glad to hear that with the coming of the Lands Pass, they're taking Golden Eagle for the short remaining duration of its existance.
Art, I think HIRA came from the trial fee program; Maroon Bells, Mt. Evans, and Cataract Lake all fell under that category. But the trial fee program's been dead for a couple of years now...
I don't have any issues with Mt. Evans because like a number of people on the list, I've always purchased a Golden Eagle sticker with my pass - most years at RMNP, last year at GSDNP&P. And now with the Federal Lands Pass, I will continue to not have issues with it. And I wouldn't have any issues paying the money otherwise if it were going mostly to maintenance of the area and other areas like the Parks fees do. Taking the fee (is it $10 or $5? The automated machine still says $5...) and applying it to the Mt. Goliath Nature Center or to road and trail maintenance is more than worth it to me; taking it to finance the government's efforts to sell off USFS land is not so fine by me.
Discussion
16 replieshttp://www.14ers.com/bb/viewtopic.php?t=6320
Might be time to put a caravan of no-fee champions together to swarm the entrance booth. Strength in numbers. Better yet, maybe somebody needs to station themselves just below the entrance station on one fine weekend day and hand out fliers to the unsuspecting hordes to let them know their rights. But not me, I'm busy that day.
Read and print the letter here: http://www.westernslopenofee.org/NoFee/letter.pdf
Bring a lawyer?
I agree, Laurie, that reasonable fees are fine, but also agree with you that the USFS shoiuldn't be collecting fees for things they shouldn't be. I'm so sick of being fee'd to death, especially at places where all you're doing, and all that's available to do, is parking.
Craig
BTW, nice idea on the flyer handout. That would get them riled up wouldn't it?
Rich
But I'd probably argue your point about the NPS getting so little money, whether you're talking comparatively to other agencies, or actual dollars.
RichieV
http://www.fs.fed.us/r2/arnf/recreation/brainard/index.shtml
Rich
I have bought the Golden Eagle for years now. The new pass is supposed to cover all the national fee areas, as I understand it. We will see.
Have any of you been to a national park without a fee? Try going to The Great Smoky Mountains and looking at the trash and graffiti. If a fee, as small as most are, prevents that, I'm all for it. As Todd said, the fees are collected from those that use the facilities. I do agree that the fees should stay with the area and a small percentage going to national to make up for those of us who make it a point to buy the passes at our favolite park, RMNP.
I have been studying the issue quite a bit. I have come to the conclusion
that Forest users are in big trouble. The charges are just the tip of the iceberg.
They have invented a term that isn't in the law called a H.I.R.A. High Impact Recreation
Area. They are declaring these all over the U.S. This is what they have decided to
call Mount Evans. They like this designation because you don't have to have any
improvements in order to charge. A good introduction to the subject can be found\
in Congressional Testimony at:
http://www.westernslopenofee.org/NoFee/Kitty_Testimony.html
Art Lund
Art, I think HIRA came from the trial fee program; Maroon Bells, Mt. Evans, and Cataract Lake all fell under that category. But the trial fee program's been dead for a couple of years now...
I don't have any issues with Mt. Evans because like a number of people on the list, I've always purchased a Golden Eagle sticker with my pass - most years at RMNP, last year at GSDNP&P. And now with the Federal Lands Pass, I will continue to not have issues with it. And I wouldn't have any issues paying the money otherwise if it were going mostly to maintenance of the area and other areas like the Parks fees do. Taking the fee (is it $10 or $5? The automated machine still says $5...) and applying it to the Mt. Goliath Nature Center or to road and trail maintenance is more than worth it to me; taking it to finance the government's efforts to sell off USFS land is not so fine by me.
what is being used on Mount Evans.
Art L.