why it's ok to let a pet wander the neighborhood, hunting wild birds. Recent experiences have made this an issue I just can't let go of. Help me to understand how this is resposible pet ownership.
My cats stay indoors for exactly that reason. They are all rescued from shelters or the streets and all neutered (all male too). It took them a while to get used to it, but ultimately they get to live and have a big house to play in (and two dogs to torment) and are doing just fine. Every now and then I'll take them on supervised outings in the yard where they love to roll around in the dirt and lay in the sun but they don't get to roam on their own.
Dan, I've got the same thing here - why is it that cats get to roam the neighborhood, but everything else that moves has to be on a leash? It's a problem here, too, and it ticks me off, since the cats are going after the birds I so carefully encourage to be in my yard and am trying to photograph.
Okay, enough of my griping, I'm curious how you'll handle your situation.
When I moved into my new house in 1999, I planted many, many, maybe too many gardens. I done so to attract wildlife. Well, my planned worked great with hundreds of lizards and many insects. I put up bird houses and planted many plants that were inviting for nesting birds. Everything went just as planned until my neighbor showed up with a cat. Like most people, they let the cat roam day and night. Wasn't long before I could not find a lizard and insects seemed to deminish. Since the cat arrived all birds stopped nesting in the boxes: Bluebirds, Chickadees and Carolina wrens. I have seen many cardinals, mockingbird and one Yellow-billed cuckoo nest with either eggs or chick attacked by the cat. One morning leaving for work, before daylight, I saw the cat on top of the nesting box containing mother and young chickadees. That afternoon the adult and young were gone. Over the span of a year or so, I found the feathers of two bluebirds just outside one of the nesting boxes.
Well, one day last summer the cat dissappeared. Things quickly started returning to normal until this winter the neighbor accross the street showed up with a cat. That cat has destroyed several Cardinal nest already. The only bright side to this cat is he doesn't spend a large amount of time in my yard. Seems the bird boxes are not on his hit list as I've seen one brood of wrens fledge and another female is sitting on six eggs as of last Thursday. I haven't seen any more Cardinals lately, not sure if the cat also got the adult.
I'm thinking that shortly this cat may also dissappear one day.
Note: No harm was done to the neighbors cat, it was just relocated.
I hope the neighbor doesn't read this.
Dan, I doubt I can help you understand, because I don't understand, myself. I know some cat owners who believe they are being cruel to their cat if they don't let it outside to roam on its own and be a cat.
I don't know why allowing that is any different than allowing dogs to roam free, but to these folks it seems to be. I've tried explaining things nicely, but that has not worked.
In my neighborhood, there is only one cat who roams. For a short period, he came into my yard, which, as an avian photographer and garden lover and former landscaper, I have turned into a bird haven. That period was short because I took measures. I was not proud of my measures, but I took them. Since, I have seen the cat looking into my yard with what seems to be longing in his eyes, but apparently even a cat can be conditioned, because he doesn't come in.
We have two cats. We love them. They only go outdoors on short, rare occasions, and are supervised every moment. I suspect, if it hasn't happened yet, that someone will document depredation by pet cats left to roam and will sue the cat owner for allowing their animal to curtail someone's pursuit of happiness.
I am now a cat owner, primarily due to a relationship, our cat stays indoors all of the time (actually she seems to prefer that). I used to feed lots of birds and cats killed many birds in my back yard several years ago at a different house.
I encourage everyone that owns a cat to make it an outdoor cat and get it neutered.
I do not understand why som cat owners do not care to listen.
I responded to this topic above, then went to the Tweeter's birding website I check everyday, and found the topic there, too! So, I asked that forum for an article they mentioned, and have posted it on my website. Maybe there's some wording in there in how to approach the cat owners in the area and see if they'll work with you. Here's the link to the article:
I'm glad I'm not alone. My most effective deterrents so far have been my pooch, a squirt gun and for one particularly persistent cat, a hose. Haven't seen it since. I don't enjoy harassing animals -I like cats- but desperate times, call for desperate measures. I'm in our new home and am thrilled with the birdlife, including a nesting pair of California Towees. I've observed and photographed the pair, and now fledglings, for hours and have grown quite attatched. It's funny, if a Coopers Hawk or even a raven did this family in, I would be bummed, but I would accept it. But I'll be damned if any sort of human activity is going to make this nest fail.
I still invite those with opposing views to comment.
No excuse for it. Can't find the source now, but some time ago I read a discussion about "cat proof" fences- not to keep cats out of your yard, but to keep them in the owners' yards. The info might be useful in your discussions with neighbors, because it provides a viable solution. The cats can still go outside, but they can't leave their own yards. As I recall the fences are tall enough to prevent clear jumps (about 4' as I recall), but with rounded slick tops. In addition they lean inward so a cat can't get a purchase with its hind feet. No idea on price, but certainly cheaper for all than bad relations in a neighborhood. According to proponents (users rather than salesmen), they really work well. Best of both worlds for cats that "have to" be outside.
I would leave an anonymous letter requesting that the cat owner keep their cat indoors. Make it clear that the cat will be subject to animal control. Granted, it the moron who owns the cat is oblivious to the problem it is creating, they will probably not take the advice.
Assuming that the cat continues to roam free, the next step would be to request an animal trap from your local animal control. Once captured, it will no longer be your problem.
If you live in the country and do not have an animal control officer, then there is Bill Horn's solution from about 8 years ago.
I have five cats, none of which are allowed outside, period. Feral cats are one thing: they are not pets, and never will be, and they live pretty much the way their instincts tell them to do. But household pets such as mine are pets. They should not be let out unless there is a boundary around the owner's yard. Outdoor cats pick up diseases like feline leukemie and feline immunodeficiny virus, which are fatal, internal parasites, ticks, and fleas. It is far more druel to the cat to throw it out of the house because someone doesn't want to clean the litter box. I don't understand those people any more than I understanding the hoarders.
I would contact the neighbor and ask politely that he keep the cat indoors. If he won't, then get a live trap, catch the cat, and take it to a no-kill shelter. There also cat, deer and dog repellents that you should be able to get at a nursery.
I’ll stick my neck out. I have had outside cats for most of the 25 years I’ve lived in my current house. The only reason I don’t have any now is that I no longer keep horses.
Whether or not cats are a problem is probably dependent on the type of area you live in. I live in the country and barn cats are a way of life, particularly if you have horses. Barn cats are extremely useful in keeping down rodent populations, but they live outside and come and go as they wish. Yes they can become a problem, but they can be trained to stay away from certain areas. Also, if the area is rural, the population of barn cats is dispersed enough that they don't cause serious problems and other predators keep the population of cats down. A smart barn cat will probably live for about four years before he makes a mistake and something eats him (cougar, bob cat, fox, coyote, owl, etc.). A dumb barn cat tends to live a very short life.
A number of years ago one of my barn cats started coming to the house to stalk birds at our feeders. He didn't get the message when we chased him off repeatedly so I decided to try a new training method that proved immediately effective. I tied water balloons in the trees and bushes near where the cat liked to hide while watching the birds. When the cat showed up to hunt the birds I shot the water balloon closest to him with a .45. The result was a loud noise and a wet cat that didn’t seem to enjoy the experience. The cat stopped coming to the house.
If a cat were to become a nuisance to a neighbor, you wouldn’t be surprised if the problem cat wasn’t seen again.
I finally got a few free minutes and googled "cat fence." I was startled at the number of cat containment systems that popped up. Looks like there is one for every decor and two for every budget. No excuses for urban cat owners to let them out of their yard.
As for barn cats, we have them on our place in Colorado too, Dave. Your neighborhood must be pretty tame compared to ours however. I can only remember one that lasted more than a year. I love cats but can't even bring myself to name those down there. Feels as though we're running a feeding program for owls and coyotes, but the survivors do keep rodents in check.
"I shot the water balloon closest to him with a .45."
Now THAT is why I should live in the country. So many problems can include large caliber weapons in the solution.
This thread misses two thing. When I was a kid, most people let their cat outside. Now, I don't know anyone who does that. I don't have a cat, but if I did I wouldn't let him out. They just don't live very long if allowed outside. Second, feral cats are a huge problem, especially in more urban areas. Many of the cats you see in city and suburban areas are wild. There are many millions of these cats in the U.S.
Cats are prey animals, and they are gonna hunt birds if they can. You are never gonna stop it, it is how they are breed. I have a cat, and he has gotten 2 birds in the last 6 months, why, because the damn birds came through my window/open door, you know what, it did not last 20sec in my house. He does not go outside at all, never has, but if a bird happens to come through the window, it's gone. Animals run wild, and pet owners surely do not act with responsiblities at times, you can see that when an owner is walking their dog down the street, and it takes a dump, they keep on going. That is more disappointing to me than cats and birds. I go to the park, dog dookie in the grass, are their regulations, yes, do they follow, nope. We live in a society where we have an over-abundance of animals that are strays, left behind, or whatever else, we start fixing that, and the solution to the rest of our animal problems will come down.
If it is a stray, capture it, if someone owns it, and you know whom it is, ask them nicely to keep it in the house, or it may be picked up by animal control.
But remember one thing, all things are hunted, it is a cycle of life, I have seen hawks come down on my parents property and take out a bird, capture moles, etc. Cats capture mice, and they prey on birds, it is how they are, that will never change.
Since nobody has mentioned any statistics on cat kills, I'll add some. The studies that have been done have found that the average "outside" cat kills 14 wild animals per year, with rural cats killing far more than urban or suburban cats. 14 animals per cat per year adds up to a lot of dead animals, considering how many cats there are. In Wisconsin alone, cats are estimated to kill about 40 million birds every year (perhaps as many as 217 million) -- and that doesn't take into account small mammals. Cats kill billions of small animals and hundreds of millions of birds every year in the U.S., and they're the primary threat to at least one species (and almost certainly more) on the U.S. endangered species list, and undoubtedly more on the IUCN Red List of globally endangered species.
In short, domesticated cats are one of the most harmful invasive species in the world. Please keep your cats inside.
I would never try to make the argument that it is ok for domestic cats to be attacking wild birds. But every story has unique circumstances.
Humans have completely altered the natural world, especially in areas of population (from large cities to small towns). I understand Dave Gill's story well. My father has a ranch in Missouri. While he welcomes wildlife on his land (even coyotes and snakes), the neighboring ranchers do not have the same feelings. The predetor population has been thinned so much that the rodent population gets out of hand. Barn cats can be a much better solution than poison or traps. Yes, there will be some unwanted wildlife kill, but probably much less than there would be with poison.
I live in an urban area. It is single family houses with yards, but only a short distance from downtown. We don't have much in the way of wild birds. We do have house sparrows and starlings, neither of which are native, and both of which are destructive to native species. We have an out of control fox squirrel population, as well as hordes of pigeons. None of these species have any predators (other than the occasional car), and breed uncontrollably. My cats are the least of the problem.
I have two outside cats. One is a loving member of the family, who rarely strays outside our yard, the other is a feral that has made our yard and basement home. Both are fixed. Last year we had a pair of robins nest in our plum tree. Their nest was too low, and within reach of the cats, and the nest was wiped out. I do feel badly about it, and was disappointed that we would not be seeing the baby robins grow up. But guess what. They are back this year, and have made a nest in a different tree, out of reach of the cats. There are no other predators in my neighborhood. No raptors, no snakes, no weasels... Those animals are long gone.
I love it when I hear people say "by the hand of man." Everything at this point is by the hand of man. We build cities that destroy the natural environment, and then try to make our yards "bird friendly." The birds move into an area that no longer has natural predators, and yet we get upset when a cat kills a few. Many more nests are wiped out in the wild. We don't want "natural" in our yards, we want a sanctuaries were we can watch the birds live in total peace.
Before anyone gets the wrong idea, I am definitely an advocate of wildlife conservation. I am simply making the point that man has become so involved, that it has become wildlife mismanagement. "Conservationists" get so upset by prairie dog hunting, for example, but yet have no answers for what to do with the huge colonies that have stripped the land of vegetation, cause terrible erosion, spread the plague, and are a danger to livestock.
To answer your question... Shoot the cat. Ok, that is extreme, but after one, maybe two warnings to your neighbor, then it is time to call the authorities (animal control, 911, whatever works!) It is your property, and you have every right to protect it, and everything on it. People who have outside cats are never surprised when a cat doesn't come home anyway...
I have several cats that share my residence and yard (I hesitate to use the term 'own' when applied to other living things). The cats all split their time indoors (morning and evening mealtimes and general lounging) and outdoors (the rest of the time). They are basically 'employed' as mousers, even though I reside in a wooded suburban area, some farm animals (mostly chickens) are kept at some neighbors. The average life span is about 4-5 years, but we have a couple of 7-8 year olds now (the smart ones!). They stay primarily in our yard (its big for the area) and cover the neighbors on either side, where they are welcome - as mousers. I also maintain a series of bird feeders all year round and the yard is a popular stopping point for many birds. The cats only seem to get one or two birds a year, though, usually english sparrows, which we get by the dozens on any given day.
The trick is to apply a little thought to the location of the feeders. I place all of them in places inaccessible to the cats. The cats can see the birds, but any healthy bird can easily evade a cat with a little lead warning and the feeder placement gives them that lead at a minimum. In most cases, the cat literally cannot get to the feeder or the bird. I swear I've seen the birds taunting the cats on occasion.
The only weak link in this system is when a bird chooses to feed on the ground. Certain species seem to prefer this -cardinals, jays, mourning doves and junckos for instance, and go after the 'spillage'. I've only seen one mourning dove lose the contest over the years.
This system seems to achieve some balance without undue restrictions or pressure on either the birds or the cats, allowing both to exist in some approximation of their natural behavioral patterns.
Just thought I'd add my two cents to this discussion. Ever since my parent's cat ate their parakeet, cats have not been on my list of pets to have. There also seems to be a personality conflict, which is why I prefer dogs. I don't think most cat owners realize the havoc their pets wreak on the wildlife population. In this country cats can heavily inpact the upland bird population, as well as song birds. They can be detrimental to small mammals. Cats will become feral if left to themselves long enough. And they are prolific breeders if not "fixed." You can go to this link to see what happened in Australia because of their feral cat problem. http://www.environment.gov.au/biodiversity/invasive/publications/cat/index.html
Because of this I am a strong believer in spaying or neutering, declawing, and keeping them in the house at all times (or under close supervision when outdoors).
Hope I didn't step on too many toes.
My wife and I absolutely love our cat. However, he only goes outside with us and then on a leash. Yes, a cat on a leash!! We sit on the deck and he sits beside us. We go for a walk around the property and he joins us, but on the leash. We have several bird feeders and will not tolerate the cat going after the birds. Our area is fairly rural, with a number of feral cats, as well as a few bobcat and many coyote. Our little pedigree Himalayan Persian wouldn't last one night out on his own. Besides, the vets around our area want all cats kept in to keep the population down and help control some diseases like Feline Leukemia.
BTW, our cat, Yoda, seems to be adapted to this situation quite nicely.
Robins, especially fledglings, are vunerable to cats. The time comes when the young robin leaves its nest which it does so by tumbling to the ground where it stays for a short while. Cats know this and are waiting. Lately I have noticed a decline in the robin population here. I do not think a new by-law in place here which puts the same restrictions and rules on cats as there are for dogs is helping very much. I rarely see someone walking their cat on a leash; it is common to see someone walk their dog on a leash.
House sparrows are birds which seems to remain plentiful here, despite maurauding cats. My theory is that they protect themselves by keeping together in large numbers where many little eyes are always alert to dangers like cats. This flocking together is especially essential because they are ground feeders.
Nesting birds and their young are the most vunerable because they would not or could not fly away from danger as quickly.
I have five cats - all rescues, all spayed/nuetered - but they are strictly in the house (for their own good). If human beings were more responsible, it's likely I would have none
I wonder how many of you that complain about outside cats are feeding wild birds?
I reread my post, and want to clarify a couple of things.
It seems to me there are two issues here. First, the individual issue of an outside cat invading someone else's yard. That is a personal issue, and needs to be dealt with on a one on one basis. Just like if someone's dog is leaving presents in a neighbor's yard, someone else's cat can be a huge nusiance. If you are having a problem with it, talk with the neighbor. If nothing is done about it, the next step might have to be animal control (or a well placed projectile ) Everyone has the right to keep unwanted invaders out of their yards.
The second issue is the effect domestic cats have on the bird population. What got me wound up was the comment about "if any sort of human activity is going to make this nest fail." (No attack or offense meant, Dan, just using your quote for a point ) More often than not, it is human activity that is drawing the birds, especially in urban, suburban, and even populated rural areas. People put up bird houses, put out bird food, and plant shrubs and gardens to be bird friendly. This is not natural either. Yes, I understand, and agree, with the argument that since natural habitat has been destroyed, we should do what we can to create friendly habitats in areas that have been populated. But it is still not natural.
One study of nests in a natural area showed that over 50% of nests failed. Of nests depredated, most were caused by snakes. In fact, the top 4 were snakes, followed by raccoons, and then the deer mouse. How many of us have populations of snakes and raccoons living in our back yards, especially those of us in urban/suburban areas? This means that if you have birds successfully nesting in your yard every year, the nests are successful much higher than what would occur naturally.
Stefan mentioned the Wisconsin study, which is the one study that most of the cat kill statistics come from. It is a highly suspect, and probably flawed study, that involved a small number of cats in the study, which should not be used to draw national statistics on kills.
One estimate has windows killing upwards of a billion birds a year in the US. Another estimate has automobiles killing upwards of 100 million birds, which is, by the way, the same number of birds the National Audubon Society says are killed by cats. The U.S. Fish and Wildlife say that over 170 million are killed by power lines.
Migratory bird populations, on average, have been declining, but resident bird populations have been increasing, and in some cases, exploding. Studies have shown that the increase in cow bird population could be a factor in migratory bird nest failures. Migration lines have been impacted, and we all know what has been happening to the habitat in South America. Non native species which breed at higher rates push competition for food and nesting sites.
Ok, now let me finish with this. Particularly in rural areas, feral cats (and even domestic outdoor cats) have an impact on the environment. They can introduce disease, compete with native predators, and do kill beyond what hunger would dictate. But to try and lay the blame of the decline of migratory birds on cats is at best naive, and at worst damaging to attempts to control the worst offenders.
Do, though, spay or neuter your cats, and give them regular vaccinations. No need to add to the problem.
What a great post, David! I agree wholeheartedly. Still, the same note on your last line applied to keeping cats indoors - no need to add to the problem.
Guy, you have a good point! Is it hypocritical of me to say that outdoor cats in an urban area have less impact than in a rural area? My dogs have, as far as I know, had more kills than my cat. I say cat (singular) because the feral cat that sees our house as home could have a lot of kills, and I would never know, unless it brought them into the basement.
I know that between two dogs (one of which has passed on), we have had at least 6 fox squirrel kills (not breaking my heart ) and at least a couple of bird kills. All in our own backyard (or the backyard of houses they were staying).
As for our feral cat, what should be done? We managed to catch it once to have it spayed and given a round of shots, but to try and catch this cat is to take your life into your own hands. Should we kill it, is that fair? If we lived in an area that had a much higher native bird population, I might consider it, but in an urban area, where it is probably catching mice and european sparrows, it doesn't bother me as much. Is that a double standard?
If there is a decline in migratory birds because of predation then there is an imbalance of nature. We can't blame it all on cats but I still think cats are one of the prime culprits. I have read of a similar study for my area to the Wisconsin one and the figures are much the same. And it is not unreasonable for an average cat to catch and kill 14 birds a year in the city. Sometimes cats can have another prey as a diversion to birds, such as mice. There are no snakes here nor raccoons.
If snakes and raccoons are decimating the migratory bird population in some areas then I conclude there is too many of these predators. These creatures are preyed upon in turn. Question is what happened to those predators? Possibly snakes and raccoons adapt more readily to urban life while their predators do not. So they are out of reach.
Tall buildings with reflective glass windows also contribute to the demise of the migratory birds and is possibly the worst offender. Other culprits are crows and magpies which I see harassing smaller birds very often. I saw two small birds chase off a crow and then break off the chase to return to their nest. Immediately the crow followed them back.
Interesting to note that some feral cat populations cant be eliminated. All the cats can't be caught, and other cats fill the niche. Some areas neuter and release the feral cats. This seems to keep the population from growing. So cats aren't going away.
Coyotes returning to urban areas may eliminate some cats. But they certainly eliminate small yappy dogs.
Will, I did not say snakes or raccoons are having a negative impact on bird population. My point was that in one natural study area, less than half of nests were successful (meaning at least on fledged offspring) due to predation. In nature, odds are that an offspring (of any wild animal) will not survive due to predation, disease, or injury. You made my point by saying you don't have any snakes or raccoons in your area. Because we don't have these types of predators in our urban/suburban areas, we are artificially increasing the survival rate of fledglings. I am not saying it is bad, but it is far from natural. For some reason, it tends to get my dander up (just a little ) when people talk about "unnatural", but forget about the fact that bird houses, feeders, birdbaths, and the like are just as unnatural.
In one year, the World Trade Center killed (a physically known) 32 birds. (Of course, the number is probably much higher, given that there were probably many birds that died but the bodies could not be found.) Using the Wisconsin study as an example, we simply need to identify how many birds per square yard (meter for our Canadian contingency ) are killed, and multiply that by the amount of glass in all of the high rises across the nation. This is not a valid equation. Some buildings probably have more reflective glass than others. Some cities are along migration routes, which would probably raise the kill rate, while others are not, which would probably have lower rates. This is why a small study in one particular area cannot be multiplied across the board.
Your comment about rodents being a diversion is actually backwards. In almost all feral cats studied, rodents made up 70% or more of the animals killed, and in at least one, birds made up only 4% of the kill.
Really, the question becomes: Are cats pushing the predation limits beyond sustainable levels? If anybody tells me that cats are a burden on the bird population, I would want them to back that up with what the normal predation limits of the population are, and that the limits are now being pushed by cat predation.
As for natural predators and pests, there can be measurable impact on "natural" order by human cause. To use the cowbird example again: There are more open fields and edge habitat than before, due to the clearing of forests for agriculture. This is prime habitat for the cowbird, so it's population increases. Since they are a parasitic species, this leads to more pressure on other birds. The cowbird is a native species, and simply doing what it does. But a very convincing argument can be made that due to man's influence, "unnatural" pressures have been added to the songbird population.
This is why it is dangerous to try and simplify population declines with catch terms and pop issues. There are probably hundreds of reasons why the migratory bird population is declining, all of which add in complex ways.
After reading Don's post and Michael's reply, I do want to state that I am by no means advocating the release of cats (such as dumping unwanted or having unaltered animals). And yes, as Guy suggested, it might be best to keep cats inside. And just like any introduced animal, there can be impact the natural order. However, though it can be an irritation to those who work to attract birds to their yards, pet cats that are allowed outdoors (not feral or released cats) would have very little impact on the overall population of wild birds.
Don't get me wrong, I can completely understand people's irritation of someone’s pet interfering with the pleasure derived from the hard work that was put into a yard. Just as a barking dog, noisy motorcycle, or screaming kids can be a nuisance.
I would like to know how to build habitat and feed birds to maximize their chance or survival.
While I believe the case against house cats is probably exaggerated, I've seen what happened to my family's outside cats when I was a kid. Cats coming home to die after a bad fight, or being hit by a car. Not nice. My parents have kept their Cat indoors for probably twenty years. I'm extremely dubious that the decline of songbirds over the last twenty years has anything to do with cats owned by people. Roaming wild is just not the trend in how pets are treated these days.
Feral cats are a completely different story than house cats who are mostly fat and lazy. We live in an urban area where there is a natural woods park behind the house. That woods seem to be the dumping ground for all unwanted cats... and that is cruel and inexcusable. There are rescue projects for unwanted animals and, I agree, that that is where they should be brought.
My cat has been displaced by a very aggressive dog who, if allowed, would eat every other dog and cat in the neighborhood... he is the one who is chained and locked in the house. The cat has been forced to live upstairs and outside, while the dog rules the downstairs. Should I capture and release the dog into a different neighborhood? Once you adopt a child, dog, or cat, how do you dispose of it if it is not perfect and has some traits that you dislike. For this particular dog, since he was aggressive as a puppy, it would have been a death sentence.
All this reminds me of a children's book where the dog chases the cat, the cat chases the mouse, etc. Animals have natural instincts and if you have a "hunter" or "birder" you have to stop putting food in the bird feeders if you choose to let them out.
Yesterday a hawk took one of squirrels in my yard. Should they be all captive?
Posted by David A Bliss on June 19, 2007 at 11:18 AM
I realize that this thread is about outside cats, but since I have already hijacked the thread somewhat, I thought I would post this article I just came across.
Discussion
35 repliesGuy
Okay, enough of my griping, I'm curious how you'll handle your situation.
Nancy
Well, one day last summer the cat dissappeared.
I'm thinking that shortly this cat may also dissappear one day.
Note: No harm was done to the neighbors cat, it was just relocated.
I hope the neighbor doesn't read this.
I don't know why allowing that is any different than allowing dogs to roam free, but to these folks it seems to be. I've tried explaining things nicely, but that has not worked.
In my neighborhood, there is only one cat who roams. For a short period, he came into my yard, which, as an avian photographer and garden lover and former landscaper, I have turned into a bird haven. That period was short because I took measures. I was not proud of my measures, but I took them. Since, I have seen the cat looking into my yard with what seems to be longing in his eyes, but apparently even a cat can be conditioned, because he doesn't come in.
We have two cats. We love them. They only go outdoors on short, rare occasions, and are supervised every moment. I suspect, if it hasn't happened yet, that someone will document depredation by pet cats left to roam and will sue the cat owner for allowing their animal to curtail someone's pursuit of happiness.
I encourage everyone that owns a cat to make it an outdoor cat and get it neutered.
I do not understand why som cat owners do not care to listen.
Scott
http://www.nancywagnerphotography.com/catsvsbirds.html
Nancy
I still invite those with opposing views to comment.
Try googling "cat fence" or some such.
Assuming that the cat continues to roam free, the next step would be to request an animal trap from your local animal control. Once captured, it will no longer be your problem.
If you live in the country and do not have an animal control officer, then there is Bill Horn's solution from about 8 years ago.
I would contact the neighbor and ask politely that he keep the cat indoors. If he won't, then get a live trap, catch the cat, and take it to a no-kill shelter. There also cat, deer and dog repellents that you should be able to get at a nursery.
Whether or not cats are a problem is probably dependent on the type of area you live in. I live in the country and barn cats are a way of life, particularly if you have horses. Barn cats are extremely useful in keeping down rodent populations, but they live outside and come and go as they wish. Yes they can become a problem, but they can be trained to stay away from certain areas. Also, if the area is rural, the population of barn cats is dispersed enough that they don't cause serious problems and other predators keep the population of cats down. A smart barn cat will probably live for about four years before he makes a mistake and something eats him (cougar, bob cat, fox, coyote, owl, etc.). A dumb barn cat tends to live a very short life.
A number of years ago one of my barn cats started coming to the house to stalk birds at our feeders. He didn't get the message when we chased him off repeatedly so I decided to try a new training method that proved immediately effective. I tied water balloons in the trees and bushes near where the cat liked to hide while watching the birds. When the cat showed up to hunt the birds I shot the water balloon closest to him with a .45. The result was a loud noise and a wet cat that didn’t seem to enjoy the experience. The cat stopped coming to the house.
If a cat were to become a nuisance to a neighbor, you wouldn’t be surprised if the problem cat wasn’t seen again.
As for barn cats, we have them on our place in Colorado too, Dave. Your neighborhood must be pretty tame compared to ours however. I can only remember one that lasted more than a year. I love cats but can't even bring myself to name those down there. Feels as though we're running a feeding program for owls and coyotes, but the survivors do keep rodents in check.
Now THAT is why I should live in the country. So many problems can include large caliber weapons in the solution.
This thread misses two thing. When I was a kid, most people let their cat outside. Now, I don't know anyone who does that. I don't have a cat, but if I did I wouldn't let him out. They just don't live very long if allowed outside. Second, feral cats are a huge problem, especially in more urban areas. Many of the cats you see in city and suburban areas are wild. There are many millions of these cats in the U.S.
If it is a stray, capture it, if someone owns it, and you know whom it is, ask them nicely to keep it in the house, or it may be picked up by animal control.
But remember one thing, all things are hunted, it is a cycle of life, I have seen hawks come down on my parents property and take out a bird, capture moles, etc. Cats capture mice, and they prey on birds, it is how they are, that will never change.
In short, domesticated cats are one of the most harmful invasive species in the world. Please keep your cats inside.
Humans have completely altered the natural world, especially in areas of population (from large cities to small towns). I understand Dave Gill's story well. My father has a ranch in Missouri. While he welcomes wildlife on his land (even coyotes and snakes), the neighboring ranchers do not have the same feelings. The predetor population has been thinned so much that the rodent population gets out of hand. Barn cats can be a much better solution than poison or traps. Yes, there will be some unwanted wildlife kill, but probably much less than there would be with poison.
I live in an urban area. It is single family houses with yards, but only a short distance from downtown. We don't have much in the way of wild birds. We do have house sparrows and starlings, neither of which are native, and both of which are destructive to native species. We have an out of control fox squirrel population, as well as hordes of pigeons. None of these species have any predators (other than the occasional car), and breed uncontrollably. My cats are the least of the problem.
I have two outside cats. One is a loving member of the family, who rarely strays outside our yard, the other is a feral that has made our yard and basement home. Both are fixed. Last year we had a pair of robins nest in our plum tree. Their nest was too low, and within reach of the cats, and the nest was wiped out. I do feel badly about it, and was disappointed that we would not be seeing the baby robins grow up. But guess what. They are back this year, and have made a nest in a different tree, out of reach of the cats. There are no other predators in my neighborhood. No raptors, no snakes, no weasels... Those animals are long gone.
I love it when I hear people say "by the hand of man." Everything at this point is by the hand of man. We build cities that destroy the natural environment, and then try to make our yards "bird friendly." The birds move into an area that no longer has natural predators, and yet we get upset when a cat kills a few. Many more nests are wiped out in the wild. We don't want "natural" in our yards, we want a sanctuaries were we can watch the birds live in total peace.
Before anyone gets the wrong idea, I am definitely an advocate of wildlife conservation. I am simply making the point that man has become so involved, that it has become wildlife mismanagement. "Conservationists" get so upset by prairie dog hunting, for example, but yet have no answers for what to do with the huge colonies that have stripped the land of vegetation, cause terrible erosion, spread the plague, and are a danger to livestock.
To answer your question... Shoot the cat.
I have several cats that share my residence and yard (I hesitate to use the term 'own' when applied to other living things). The cats all split their time indoors (morning and evening mealtimes and general lounging) and outdoors (the rest of the time). They are basically 'employed' as mousers, even though I reside in a wooded suburban area, some farm animals (mostly chickens) are kept at some neighbors. The average life span is about 4-5 years, but we have a couple of 7-8 year olds now (the smart ones!). They stay primarily in our yard (its big for the area) and cover the neighbors on either side, where they are welcome - as mousers. I also maintain a series of bird feeders all year round and the yard is a popular stopping point for many birds. The cats only seem to get one or two birds a year, though, usually english sparrows, which we get by the dozens on any given day.
The trick is to apply a little thought to the location of the feeders. I place all of them in places inaccessible to the cats. The cats can see the birds, but any healthy bird can easily evade a cat with a little lead warning and the feeder placement gives them that lead at a minimum. In most cases, the cat literally cannot get to the feeder or the bird. I swear I've seen the birds taunting the cats on occasion.
The only weak link in this system is when a bird chooses to feed on the ground. Certain species seem to prefer this -cardinals, jays, mourning doves and junckos for instance, and go after the 'spillage'. I've only seen one mourning dove lose the contest over the years.
This system seems to achieve some balance without undue restrictions or pressure on either the birds or the cats, allowing both to exist in some approximation of their natural behavioral patterns.
Because of this I am a strong believer in spaying or neutering, declawing, and keeping them in the house at all times (or under close supervision when outdoors).
Hope I didn't step on too many toes.
BTW, our cat, Yoda, seems to be adapted to this situation quite nicely.
House sparrows are birds which seems to remain plentiful here, despite maurauding cats. My theory is that they protect themselves by keeping together in large numbers where many little eyes are always alert to dangers like cats. This flocking together is especially essential because they are ground feeders.
Nesting birds and their young are the most vunerable because they would not or could not fly away from danger as quickly.
Will
Edmonton, Alberta
Canada
I wonder how many of you that complain about outside cats are feeding wild birds?
It seems to me there are two issues here. First, the individual issue of an outside cat invading someone else's yard. That is a personal issue, and needs to be dealt with on a one on one basis. Just like if someone's dog is leaving presents in a neighbor's yard, someone else's cat can be a huge nusiance. If you are having a problem with it, talk with the neighbor. If nothing is done about it, the next step might have to be animal control (or a well placed projectile
The second issue is the effect domestic cats have on the bird population. What got me wound up was the comment about "if any sort of human activity is going to make this nest fail." (No attack or offense meant, Dan, just using your quote for a point
One study of nests in a natural area showed that over 50% of nests failed. Of nests depredated, most were caused by snakes. In fact, the top 4 were snakes, followed by raccoons, and then the deer mouse. How many of us have populations of snakes and raccoons living in our back yards, especially those of us in urban/suburban areas? This means that if you have birds successfully nesting in your yard every year, the nests are successful much higher than what would occur naturally.
Stefan mentioned the Wisconsin study, which is the one study that most of the cat kill statistics come from. It is a highly suspect, and probably flawed study, that involved a small number of cats in the study, which should not be used to draw national statistics on kills.
This article has some interesting statistics.
http://www.geocities.com/meowerpower_99.geo/aboutferals/predation.htm
One estimate has windows killing upwards of a billion birds a year in the US. Another estimate has automobiles killing upwards of 100 million birds, which is, by the way, the same number of birds the National Audubon Society says are killed by cats. The U.S. Fish and Wildlife say that over 170 million are killed by power lines.
Migratory bird populations, on average, have been declining, but resident bird populations have been increasing, and in some cases, exploding. Studies have shown that the increase in cow bird population could be a factor in migratory bird nest failures. Migration lines have been impacted, and we all know what has been happening to the habitat in South America. Non native species which breed at higher rates push competition for food and nesting sites.
Ok, now let me finish with this. Particularly in rural areas, feral cats (and even domestic outdoor cats) have an impact on the environment. They can introduce disease, compete with native predators, and do kill beyond what hunger would dictate. But to try and lay the blame of the decline of migratory birds on cats is at best naive, and at worst damaging to attempts to control the worst offenders.
Do, though, spay or neuter your cats, and give them regular vaccinations. No need to add to the problem.
Guy
I know that between two dogs (one of which has passed on), we have had at least 6 fox squirrel kills (not breaking my heart
As for our feral cat, what should be done? We managed to catch it once to have it spayed and given a round of shots, but to try and catch this cat is to take your life into your own hands. Should we kill it, is that fair? If we lived in an area that had a much higher native bird population, I might consider it, but in an urban area, where it is probably catching mice and european sparrows, it doesn't bother me as much. Is that a double standard?
If snakes and raccoons are decimating the migratory bird population in some areas then I conclude there is too many of these predators. These creatures are preyed upon in turn. Question is what happened to those predators? Possibly snakes and raccoons adapt more readily to urban life while their predators do not. So they are out of reach.
Tall buildings with reflective glass windows also contribute to the demise of the migratory birds and is possibly the worst offender. Other culprits are crows and magpies which I see harassing smaller birds very often. I saw two small birds chase off a crow and then break off the chase to return to their nest. Immediately the crow followed them back.
Will
Edmonton, Alberta
Canada
Coyotes returning to urban areas may eliminate some cats. But they certainly eliminate small yappy dogs.
And for every population that is successfully made infertile, you have ignorant/unconcerned humans releasing the next population around the corner
In one year, the World Trade Center killed (a physically known) 32 birds. (Of course, the number is probably much higher, given that there were probably many birds that died but the bodies could not be found.) Using the Wisconsin study as an example, we simply need to identify how many birds per square yard (meter for our Canadian contingency
Your comment about rodents being a diversion is actually backwards. In almost all feral cats studied, rodents made up 70% or more of the animals killed, and in at least one, birds made up only 4% of the kill.
Really, the question becomes: Are cats pushing the predation limits beyond sustainable levels? If anybody tells me that cats are a burden on the bird population, I would want them to back that up with what the normal predation limits of the population are, and that the limits are now being pushed by cat predation.
As for natural predators and pests, there can be measurable impact on "natural" order by human cause. To use the cowbird example again: There are more open fields and edge habitat than before, due to the clearing of forests for agriculture. This is prime habitat for the cowbird, so it's population increases. Since they are a parasitic species, this leads to more pressure on other birds. The cowbird is a native species, and simply doing what it does. But a very convincing argument can be made that due to man's influence, "unnatural" pressures have been added to the songbird population.
This is why it is dangerous to try and simplify population declines with catch terms and pop issues. There are probably hundreds of reasons why the migratory bird population is declining, all of which add in complex ways.
Don't get me wrong, I can completely understand people's irritation of someone’s pet interfering with the pleasure derived from the hard work that was put into a yard. Just as a barking dog, noisy motorcycle, or screaming kids can be a nuisance.
While I believe the case against house cats is probably exaggerated, I've seen what happened to my family's outside cats when I was a kid. Cats coming home to die after a bad fight, or being hit by a car. Not nice. My parents have kept their Cat indoors for probably twenty years. I'm extremely dubious that the decline of songbirds over the last twenty years has anything to do with cats owned by people. Roaming wild is just not the trend in how pets are treated these days.
Basil
This is definately not a new problem. Here is an article from '02 about the feral cat problem on the outer banks.
My cat has been displaced by a very aggressive dog who, if allowed, would eat every other dog and cat in the neighborhood... he is the one who is chained and locked in the house. The cat has been forced to live upstairs and outside, while the dog rules the downstairs. Should I capture and release the dog into a different neighborhood? Once you adopt a child, dog, or cat, how do you dispose of it if it is not perfect and has some traits that you dislike. For this particular dog, since he was aggressive as a puppy, it would have been a death sentence.
All this reminds me of a children's book where the dog chases the cat, the cat chases the mouse, etc. Animals have natural instincts and if you have a "hunter" or "birder" you have to stop putting food in the bird feeders if you choose to let them out.
Yesterday a hawk took one of squirrels in my yard. Should they be all captive?
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070615/ap_on_sc/bird_declines