I guess this is a common phenomenon, being in love and being frustrated at the same time. That's precisely is what's happening with me and my photography. I'm in love with photography and at the same time frustrated with my abilities. I'm looking for that 'ideal' picture in my collection and all I find is crap. I've lost sleep looking over photos taken by Charlie Waite, Art Wolfe nd the like, the emotion they carry and the mood they reflect. All my photos seem flat, without any emotions or mood and this is what is leading to my frustration. I can't live without taking pictures - I tried, but the inability to take good pictures , pictures I can be in love with - is leaving a big void. So I've sort of taken a little break. This summer will be spent in some introspection and will try to eliminate this frustration. I won't be posting often but will drop by regularly to enjoy the great pictures here. I'm tending towards a minimalist approach to photography and will eventually sell some of my equipment. This is a learning process and but for this forum and you guys I would've never learned anything.
Pradeep, boy do I feel your pain! Nothing wrong with taking a break, but don't give up on your passion. One thing I've gotten from this forum is that I have become at peace with simply enjoying the process of getting out in nature and taking pictures. I've learned to relax, and just enjoy the solitude and this helps me slow down enough to "see" photos before I take them. I don't often actually capture the photo that I see, but I sure do enjoy seeing them.
I don't know if this will help you, but it's worth a read IMHO. I wrote and posted this article on my website a couple years ago. It's helps explain what I'm talking about.
Also, don't be a stranger. I for one, value your input here, whether it's on my own photos, or those of others.
The fact of the matter is all but a small percentage of us produce images like Art Wolfe and the like. The important part is to continue learning and keep involved in nature and the environment.
If I were you, I would not sell off any of your gear. As Curtis said, you might try refocusing on just enjoying the experience and let the compositions happen. Read, learn, practice. Stay involved in your passion. You don't have to be published, camp solo in the winter, hike miles and miles, or anything extreme to enjoy photography or the community of photographers you've met here. It really is about the passion and enjoyment for most people, not always the product.
I think I know how you feel. The hobby I started with when I was 5 or 6 years old was keeping fish in aquariums - it was, and still is my passion. When I got to 25 or so, I really wanted to be counted among the top in the field, not for the fame (who are we kidding here... its fish keeping!), but for the skills, ability and knowledge those at the "top" had acquired. Now, here I am at 40+ and while I'm published, on the speaker circuit and enjoying a great career (in fish keeping and conservation), I can now look back a little and see what it took to get here. That gives me some perspective in my photography. I've been shooting landscapes with any effort for less than 5 years (and I've got the crappy snaps to prove it!) and while I look at many photographs people have taken that inspire me, I know what they have done to be able to get those photographs. So I'm able to take some comfort in that at least I'm on the same journey - albeit, a tad slower and weasing more than I should be!
Hope that helps.
Lee
Posted by Kevin McNeal on June 10, 2007 at 2:07 AM
Hello Pradeep,
I am in the exact boat as you and thinking about giving up and losing so much sleep lately its not funny. Some of the comments and mistakes I make on some of the images that I get back in critiques makes me feel like an idiot for not seeing that and I want to quit. I have only being doing just over two years and I think I can I love something so much and fear it too. The problem is that the good things that happen which are getting out in nature,travelling places, witnessing need to be the reasons that I do it . I dream of being something someday and when things are not going my way all I wanna do is quit and sell all my stuff. The forum here is the toughest thing I've had in photography so far as it seems that most people are doing so well and seeing their careers take off. This is hard and sometimes it feels like I am in the wrong field as my images seem to always lack what others have. I enjoy your images here as well as your input but I totally understand why you need a break.Keep in touch and dont give up ! P.S sorry for the sloppy writing
Hi folks, Maybe what's needed is a re-connecting with nature. It is nature that inspires me. It is in nature that I relax and refresh my mind and soul. Once I get the above I am able to "get" the images I ever so strongly desire.
Really DO leave the bag of toys at home and go out and re-discover nature. Stop forcing it and let it come to you. Ansel Adams once said that he comes home in an average year with maybe 8 portfolio quality images. And this was a guy who shot thousands of images a year. So don't get all wrapped up about success rates. Focus instead on why you are out there in the first place - to be in the moment with nature. Capturing an image comes AFTER that!!
This is the stuff I tell myself when I flounder in the doldrums. I head out without my camera bag and re-connect.
Going out to the forest without my camera? Man Rick... that's tall order!
Posted by David Bostock on June 10, 2007 at 11:33 AM
Pradeep,
This sounds like a normal part of the photographic maturing process. You've mastered the technicals of the camera. You know what lens to use, exposure, ISO, polarizer, tripod, etcÄand you can process your images with great success. But, they still seem flat and boring; they lack that power and vision that moves them from snapshot to artistic imagery.
We all go through this; it's part of the learning process. The fact that you see it in yourself is evidence that you're growing. Being dissatisfied with the images is the first step to improving.
The next step is to learn how to see like the camera so that you can design the image. The art of designing a photograph starts with an understanding of the "science" of design. Gaining an understanding of color, shape, line, texture, pattern, perspective, scale, form, volume will equip you with the design tools to create works of art. It's no coincident that these are the same design tools that come from the art world--paintings, drawings, etc--they're fundamental elements to our way of seeing.
There are several books that talk about photographic design. Here are a few that I recommend: Designing a Photograph by Bill Smith--covers the basic concepts and is an easy read. Design Basics by David A. Lauer and Stephen Pentak--for a more in-depth look at design principles. The Art of Photographing Nature by Martha Hill and Art Wolfe--great book that compares many of Art's images through the eye of an art editor. Photographing the Landscape: The art of Seeing by John Fielder--excellent read for nature and landscape photographers. Perception & Imaging by Richard D. Zakia--highly technical, but very comprehensive look at how the human mind perceives images.
There are many others, but this is a good start. One other thought is to take a stroll through the Portland Art Museum, or the Art Museum in Seattle. Study the master painters and how they created their works.
I used to find the PNWNP weekend events a great opportunity to get together and learn from each other. Particularly when we all posted variations of the same scene. Too bad we don't do that anymore.
Pradeep, and others, it's ok to be dissatisfied with your current work. It's what drives us to the next step.
So, take a break if you must, but don't give up. Take some time to understand design and your images will improve. Guaranteed.
Cheers,
David
Posted by Tom Kloster on June 10, 2007 at 11:34 AM
I would echo what Rick and Ryan said - there are only so many Art Wolfe's out there, and in the end, it's still a love of the outdoors, first -- certainly for Art Wolfe. He has said so much in explaining why he keeps going out for more.
I certainly continue to look at (and hopefully learn from) really great photographers, but another way to look at your growing piles/files of photos is to consider writers: you've got the John Steinbeck extreme, an author known for a steady stream of great books, and you've got J.D. Salinger and Harper Lee, authors who are really known for just one "great" book, despite a lot of lesser-known writing. This latter path is where most writers fall, in reality. So Art Wolfe is in the Steinbeck mold, and it can be pretty discouraging to look at his combined skill and productivity. It's helpful for me to remember most photographers are at the other end of the spectrum, and need to just keep working toward that "one great image" (..or three, or four... maybe six or eight...ten?)
Thank you everyone. All the inputs and suggestions are very valuable. I wont give up on photography - not at all as I said earlier I just cant :)
- pradeep
Posted by Mike Stovall on June 10, 2007 at 10:59 PM
Pradeep, there's some really good advice here, but especially Rick's. There's nothing to invigorate your photography like reconnecting with Nature.
I had been shooting for about six months with a 3.1 MP cheap camera when I finally bought my first DSLR. I took one "signature" type image in the first week then churned nothing but crap and kinda-nice photos for the next several months. Needless to say, I wondered what I had spent all that money for...
Several things that helped me were a few incredible sunsets that I enjoyed when I did not have my camera with me. And I came across an essay by Galen Rowell in which he said something to the effect that the pictures on film fade with time, but the pictures in our minds grow brighter and more beautiful as time goes by. It really put things into perspective. But on the practical side, I learned to give myself a better advantage by knowing what weather conditions were going to result in the best light for certain kinds of subjects. I usually won't even go shooting on a cloudless sunny day.
Posted by Jon Leibowitz on June 13, 2007 at 12:06 PM
I have not read through all of the responses here, but the few that did, I think Rick Lamb really nailed it. You need to sit back and remember why you love shooting in the first place. Hopefully, it's because you love nature and you love being in the outdoors. I don't pretend I'm a pro, and I find faults in all of my photos, but I have never quit because photography gets me outside. I did want to quit at once and even stopped shooting for 6 months or so, but I found during that time, I also stopped hiking and exploring the natural world. Once I realized photography was more of a means to ends, I have never looked back! I go to be surrounded by nature, the photography is just an extra present.
Sometimes I wonder if NPN does it to people. NPN is a depressing place to be, but for only good reasons. You get to see images of such great quality nowhere else in one place, and I(probably many of us) have aspired to make such photographs and have always found myself falling short.
I do remember my early days in photography five years ago when I had just bought my first SLR. I used to be proud of the pictures I made and was all pumped up when I got good feedback from friends. But over time when I really managed to see more of images of 'real' quality, I became more subdued. It is NPN that taught me what a good image really is. I went through feelings similar to yours many times in the last few years, but I persisted because there was no way I could escape from photography, just like you. Heading to the forest was something that I did even before I acquired a camera, and I continued to do that even when I had no hopes of making good images. Eventually over time, with continuous learning and re-learning, I can at least say I am getting better than before and find it satisfying enough. I have given up many aspirations in the last five years, like becoming a pro or making images like the best of the lot, but have continued the attempts to make good photos. There is a satisfaction in making an effort to capture the best possible frames even if they don't turn out the way I wanted them to.
Discussion
12 replies- pradeep
I don't know if this will help you, but it's worth a read IMHO. I wrote and posted this article on my website a couple years ago. It's helps explain what I'm talking about.
Also, don't be a stranger. I for one, value your input here, whether it's on my own photos, or those of others.
If I were you, I would not sell off any of your gear. As Curtis said, you might try refocusing on just enjoying the experience and let the compositions happen. Read, learn, practice. Stay involved in your passion. You don't have to be published, camp solo in the winter, hike miles and miles, or anything extreme to enjoy photography or the community of photographers you've met here. It really is about the passion and enjoyment for most people, not always the product.
I think I know how you feel. The hobby I started with when I was 5 or 6 years old was keeping fish in aquariums - it was, and still is my passion. When I got to 25 or so, I really wanted to be counted among the top in the field, not for the fame (who are we kidding here... its fish keeping!), but for the skills, ability and knowledge those at the "top" had acquired. Now, here I am at 40+ and while I'm published, on the speaker circuit and enjoying a great career (in fish keeping and conservation), I can now look back a little and see what it took to get here. That gives me some perspective in my photography. I've been shooting landscapes with any effort for less than 5 years (and I've got the crappy snaps to prove it!) and while I look at many photographs people have taken that inspire me, I know what they have done to be able to get those photographs. So I'm able to take some comfort in that at least I'm on the same journey - albeit, a tad slower and weasing more than I should be!
Hope that helps.
Lee
I am in the exact boat as you and thinking about giving up and losing so much sleep lately its not funny. Some of the comments and mistakes I make on some of the images that I get back in critiques makes me feel like an idiot for not seeing that and I want to quit. I have only being doing just over two years and I think I can I love something so much and fear it too. The problem is that the good things that happen which are getting out in nature,travelling places, witnessing need to be the reasons that I do it . I dream of being something someday and when things are not going my way all I wanna do is quit and sell all my stuff. The forum here is the toughest thing I've had in photography so far as it seems that most people are doing so well and seeing their careers take off. This is hard and sometimes it feels like I am in the wrong field as my images seem to always lack what others have. I enjoy your images here as well as your input but I totally understand why you need a break.Keep in touch and dont give up ! P.S sorry for the sloppy writing
Really DO leave the bag of toys at home and go out and re-discover nature. Stop forcing it and let it come to you. Ansel Adams once said that he comes home in an average year with maybe 8 portfolio quality images. And this was a guy who shot thousands of images a year. So don't get all wrapped up about success rates. Focus instead on why you are out there in the first place - to be in the moment with nature. Capturing an image comes AFTER that!!
This is the stuff I tell myself when I flounder in the doldrums. I head out without my camera bag and re-connect.
This sounds like a normal part of the photographic maturing process. You've mastered the technicals of the camera. You know what lens to use, exposure, ISO, polarizer, tripod, etcÄand you can process your images with great success. But, they still seem flat and boring; they lack that power and vision that moves them from snapshot to artistic imagery.
We all go through this; it's part of the learning process. The fact that you see it in yourself is evidence that you're growing. Being dissatisfied with the images is the first step to improving.
The next step is to learn how to see like the camera so that you can design the image. The art of designing a photograph starts with an understanding of the "science" of design. Gaining an understanding of color, shape, line, texture, pattern, perspective, scale, form, volume will equip you with the design tools to create works of art. It's no coincident that these are the same design tools that come from the art world--paintings, drawings, etc--they're fundamental elements to our way of seeing.
There are several books that talk about photographic design. Here are a few that I recommend:
Designing a Photograph by Bill Smith--covers the basic concepts and is an easy read.
Design Basics by David A. Lauer and Stephen Pentak--for a more in-depth look at design principles.
The Art of Photographing Nature by Martha Hill and Art Wolfe--great book that compares many of Art's images through the eye of an art editor.
Photographing the Landscape: The art of Seeing by John Fielder--excellent read for nature and landscape photographers.
Perception & Imaging by Richard D. Zakia--highly technical, but very comprehensive look at how the human mind perceives images.
There are many others, but this is a good start. One other thought is to take a stroll through the Portland Art Museum, or the Art Museum in Seattle. Study the master painters and how they created their works.
I used to find the PNWNP weekend events a great opportunity to get together and learn from each other. Particularly when we all posted variations of the same scene. Too bad we don't do that anymore.
Pradeep, and others, it's ok to be dissatisfied with your current work. It's what drives us to the next step.
So, take a break if you must, but don't give up. Take some time to understand design and your images will improve. Guaranteed.
Cheers,
David
I certainly continue to look at (and hopefully learn from) really great photographers, but another way to look at your growing piles/files of photos is to consider writers: you've got the John Steinbeck extreme, an author known for a steady stream of great books, and you've got J.D. Salinger and Harper Lee, authors who are really known for just one "great" book, despite a lot of lesser-known writing. This latter path is where most writers fall, in reality. So Art Wolfe is in the Steinbeck mold, and it can be pretty discouraging to look at his combined skill and productivity. It's helpful for me to remember most photographers are at the other end of the spectrum, and need to just keep working toward that "one great image" (..or three, or four... maybe six or eight...ten?)
Tom
- pradeep
I had been shooting for about six months with a 3.1 MP cheap camera when I finally bought my first DSLR. I took one "signature" type image in the first week then churned nothing but crap and kinda-nice photos for the next several months. Needless to say, I wondered what I had spent all that money for...
Several things that helped me were a few incredible sunsets that I enjoyed when I did not have my camera with me. And I came across an essay by Galen Rowell in which he said something to the effect that the pictures on film fade with time, but the pictures in our minds grow brighter and more beautiful as time goes by. It really put things into perspective. But on the practical side, I learned to give myself a better advantage by knowing what weather conditions were going to result in the best light for certain kinds of subjects. I usually won't even go shooting on a cloudless sunny day.
I do remember my early days in photography five years ago when I had just bought my first SLR. I used to be proud of the pictures I made and was all pumped up when I got good feedback from friends. But over time when I really managed to see more of images of 'real' quality, I became more subdued. It is NPN that taught me what a good image really is. I went through feelings similar to yours many times in the last few years, but I persisted because there was no way I could escape from photography, just like you. Heading to the forest was something that I did even before I acquired a camera, and I continued to do that even when I had no hopes of making good images. Eventually over time, with continuous learning and re-learning, I can at least say I am getting better than before and find it satisfying enough. I have given up many aspirations in the last five years, like becoming a pro or making images like the best of the lot, but have continued the attempts to make good photos. There is a satisfaction in making an effort to capture the best possible frames even if they don't turn out the way I wanted them to.