Canon 1D MkIII

Over the past couple of weeks there has been a lot of talk about problems surrounding the autofocus system of the new 1D MkIII and obviously such talk does sow seeds of doubt in your mind. Today I was directed to the following site (one which I hold in high regard) Rob Galbraith and it's findings were enough for me to hold fire on my purchase. In fact my preferred dealer contacted me today saying they had a new shipment and offered me one at a very good price - but I have said no for the time being.

I have no direct experience of this camera but if you are considering a purchase take a look at the site and make up your own mind.

If it is a problem I am sure Canon will put it right but what worries me is will it need more than a firmware update!

Regards
David

Rob Galibrath has now added more to this article

Thanks David... You have saved my bacon. Was about to order this today, but will definitely hold fire for now. Much appreciated

I had taken the decision to wait for the 1Ds Mk III (guessing October November perhaps), and not spend my money on a lower pixel count camera than my 1Ds MkII's, however I have had the use of a 1D MkIII for a few days, I was reasonably impressed with it, very clean images at high iso to 800, much better/easier access to control functions and such.
However one thing that bothered me was that when changing from a far to a distant object or vice versa the AF just gave up and on a moving object it needed to be egged on by manually focusing, even then it would not always track, then another time it would be fine.
Overall I was just a tad "underwhelmed" maybe I just expected a bit more.

I have recently blogged http://ngbdigital.blogspot.com/

It does make me laugh a little if it wasn't so annoying.

A few weeks ago, I posted on a couple of photographic forums that Canon had acknowledged there was a problem with the AF system. This came to me directly from a Canon Technician at a specialist 'use the camera' event being held for those pro snappers on what is known as the Royal Rota (the togs who are allowed to accompany the Royal Family on visits etc) - I am one of these guys.

I thought it fair to report this information and in response I seemed to get nothing but brick bats from people who had not been there and had never seen the camera let alone use one.

Now it seems I was right all along so to those people who took no notice of me "yah boo sucks to you"

I hate to say I told you so but........

I have also been told by a colleague 'close' to Canon in Japan that Canon are producing more of the 1D-III than any other dSLR they have ever produced so supply hopefully shouldn't be too much of a problem in a few motnhs time and of course you will soon be able to pick it up for less than £2300 (at a guess)

Barrie

Interesting it sounds much like some of the issues i've heard with the 20D and 30D. IE the AF sensor is big enough to not lock onto the item your after.

It is kind of worrying that the 1DIII has this focus fine tune, shouldn't all your lenses be in focus when the sensor says they are?

Hi David thanks for the information. There has been cricticism from people on the other side as well.
John
Aberdeen

What I fail to understand with Canon is how these problems are not picked up at the beta testing stage (if not before). After all, the camera has only been on the market for a very short period of time so they haven't been heavily used and yet these problems are manifesting themselves so why did this not get picked up and sorted much much sooner.

In fact, every digital body Canon has produced from the D30 onwards has had some problem to a greater or lesser degree (and the lenses too - remember the 24-105 coating problem?). Unfortunately, it smacks of "let the user find the bugs" which is an appalling state of affairs for what is supposed to be professional quality precision equipment.

Barrie

Well i have used mine for a few days so although i have one i havent given it anything fast to track which is where i believe the problem lies, The RG link mentions backfocusing on static objects and yesterday when i shot the grebes with young i was suprised to have a few more than expected very soft images-time will tell-when they get it sorted it will be one hell of a camera and for most people is already is,Rousey raves about it but i have no doubt that there are issues that need addressing
Dave

I am quite surprised at Canon getting in such a mess with their flagship camera. I would have thought this camera would have been beta-tested to death prior to release.

Having said that, it looks a superb camera once the AF issues are resolved.

Personally I am keeping my cash in the pocket, for the time being at least.

cheers

Sean

I got mine two days ago, and I must say that I'm very impressed. But I'm coming from a 20D, so I'm not used to miracles in autofocus. On stationary birds AF was perfect, and I got details in the image I would never have got with 20D. Y.day I shot swallows in fligth and got several keepers - which is much better than my usual ability with swallows!

cheers,

Helge

Whatever the outcome, many thanks David for drawing our attention to the relevant article.
Best wishes
Phil

There is also an extensive thread on the Other side , discussing the autofocus problems of this camera, specifically as it pertains to nature photographers. See: The Other Side .

Hi Jeremy

Yes I have been following this thread for about a week and my view is that it reinforces that there are issues with the autofocus system (particularly as relates to nature photographers) that require more than altering settings on the CF.

David

Wow! That's what you call a thread (the other side!). Glad I'm skint otherwise I would have bought one I reckon

I'll save up for the mark 8

Who changed my wording to "Other Side"?!
Aren`t we allowed to mention other websites now?
Seems a bit petty!

No problems for me! As far as I can make out the M3 users that have had problems messed with the Custom AF Settings. I purchased a MKIII guide which was very useful although I was not convinced that the custom AF settings the guide advised would work for me so I left them well alone. I know a lot of M3 users on various forums swear by this guide and most of them had AF problems

Hopefully I will be out at the weekend shooting bikes at Donington Motogp weather permitting so should be a good test to checkout the AF capabilities of the M3?

There are a few Bird in Flight shots here (nothing exotic unfortunately)

70-200mm f/2.8 IS + 1.4x
http://nickr.zenfolio.com/p344394880
300mm f/2.8 IS 10FPS shots
http://nickr.zenfolio.com/p162363799/

Earlier today I spoke with a senior member of Canon's marketing team who I have met on a number of occassions over the years and whose comments and opinions I trust and value. In brief he says the basic algorithms in the 1D MkIII are pretty much the same as in the 1D MkIIN's autofocus system and the major changes are in it's increased sensitivity and much greater control over this and other aspects of the AF system via the increased number of 'custom functions' which control the AF system. It is the latter which Canon feel is the cause of user concerns in as much as nature photography can be very demanding on the AF system and if you do not fine tune it (limited options on the 1D MkIIN) to it's specific use it may not perform as well as the 1D MkIIN. Canon still say that properly set up the ID MkIII AF system will outperform any of it's predecessors. Although Rob Galbraith does not agree with this, two well respected nature photographers in Arthur Morris and Andy Rouse both pretty much agree with Canon.

It was reassuring to hear Canon UK say that to date they had received no complaints about the cameras AF system and they had not closed their ears to what has been said by various forums and reviews - they take the matter very seriously and are looking into the various claims. Following my conversation I felt that 'if' there were any problems with the AF system these would be more likely to be corrected by a simple firmware update.

One thing I did not mention at the start of this thread is that almost everything else about this camera is outstanding from everything I have read especially the quality of the files.

Certainly hearing the other side of the story has made me feel better about the camera and at this time I would love to give one a test drive armed with sound advice on setting up the AF system.

It would be good to hear from any UK photographer (as all the negative reports appear to be coming from the US) who can honestly say they have given the camera's AF system a good but fair test as I for one recognises that with current technology every AF system will have it's limitations.

Regards
David


Addendum: Rob Galibrath has now added more to the article on his website suggesting how to deal with any problems you have, if any, so it's worth the revisiting - The Mods

David Kjaer said:

Earlier today I spoke with a senior member of Canon's marketing team who I have met on a number of occassions over the years and whose comments and opinions I trust and value. In brief he says the basic algorithms in the 1D MkIII are pretty much the same as in the 1D MkIIN's autofocus system

This isn't quite the impression one gets from Canon's 1D3 Whitepaper - p16.

I haven't experienced the range of problems encountered by RG. The only one I can relate to in any way is the first problem he describes - difficulty in acquiring initial focus under some conditions. I compared the focus acquisition of my 1Ds2 and 1D3 using centre point in AI Servo with focus on the * button (my usual set up), and if the focus target is small and static, the 1D3 doesn't always pick it up immediately. I'm not sure if this is problem, or if it is just a manifestation of the AF system in the 1D3 being different, which it most certainly is. It is my impression that from the way in which the AF behaves that the AF sensors in the 1D3 may be smaller than they are in the 1D2 models, if not physically, then at least functionally, and this may account for this specific behaviour (more speculation, just what need eh? ) It is documented in the literature that the AF sensors in the 1D2 models covered a larger area of the view finder than shown by the red rectangle.

I'm still quite happy with the camera. I am very pleased by the low light performance of the AF system, which is a definite improvement on earlier models, as is the colour and definition in the images. The only things that I don't like about the camera are the placement of the 19 user-selectable focus points and the fact that you cannot select the other assist points, like you can in previous cameras. In my opinion, the inner focus points are too close to the centre, the outer focus points (at least those along the central horizontal axis) are too close to the edge of the frame. I also dislike the wacky way that you have to select the points if you want one that is off-centre on the upper or lower part of the array.

I haven't shot enough frames in enough different circumstances to be completely satisfied that there are no problems; there are however differences and maybe we need to adapt our method of shooting to suit the camera, or stick with the mk2s.

David Kjaer said:
____________________________________________________________________________
It was reassuring to hear Canon UK say that to date they had received no complaints about the cameras AF system and they had not closed their ears to what has been said by various forums and reviews - they take the matter very seriously and are looking into the various claims. Following my conversation I felt that 'if' there were any problems with the AF system these would be more likely to be corrected by a simple firmware update.
____________________________________________________________________________

Well it is simply is not true for Canon UK to say they have no reported problems! I reported the problems I have had with AF on my MkIII to Canon at Elstree on 12th June and have been corresponding by email with them about since that date. Worryingly today I received another message, in it they said

"Thank you for your recent enquiry regarding your Canon product.

Please be advised your reported focusing issue has been discussed with our technicians at Canon RCC Elstree.

According to them there are no known issues and nothing has been reported by Canon Inc. "

So basically Canon UK are saying forget there are no problems.

The specfic issue I am having with AF is in AI Servo mode when trying to acquire focus on a subject against a fussy background. What happens is that on occasions the camera just refuses to focus on the subject which is under the central focus point, I have tried single focus point and the "ring of fire". I have made sure that CF III 5-0 is set so that the AF will hunt if needed, and also tried 5-1 makes no difference. On the occasions that I have managed to acquire focus in those situations the camera then tracks subject OK, even against a fussy background. So from my perspective the issue is to do with initial acquisition of the subject rather than tracking. The problem happens with both my 300 2.8 and my 600f4.

I have no issues with AF in One Shot mode, it is at least as good as my 1dsMkII and my old 1DMkII. I have not had any issues in AI Servo mode when taking BIF against a background of blue sky or clouds. It is not perfect, occasional frames are sometimes out, but I do not think it is reasonable to expect that it will be 100%. In a recent trip photographing Red Kites in flight at a feeding station around 85% of the shots I took were perfectly in focus.

In all respects other than AI Servo against a fussy background I am happy with the camera, Liveview is great for macro work. Guess I will have to give up trying to photograph Marsh Harriers and Bitterns in flight over reed beds.

Jack Levene
Suffolk
England

Rob Galbraiths has update his article on the 1D3 with his view on the new firmware V1.0.9. HERE