They built a community about 10 minutes drive from where I live in Mission Viejo, CA. This community backs up against the Cleavland National Forest. Now, the Forest Service Rangers are killing mountain lions that come within 20 feet of the houses.
Story here: http://www.knbc.com/news/13773142/detail.html?dl=headlineclick.
Then, some guy fishing decided to stab a seal to death because it stole his bait.
Story here: http://cbs2.com/topstories/local_story_209030418.html
What's going on in the world that we build against a forest and then get upset when wildlife gets too close to us? Or when we massacare a sea creature because it doesn't follow our rules.
I know that this insanity exists everywhere, but I can't stand to watch it anymore. I'm giving up the news.
Johnnie, I agree that the news seems to highlight the worst of human behavior. Many people like the idea of living near nature, but once real nature actually comes near they panic. In our neighborhood we have, for several years had black bear occasionally come and eat/destroy our bird feeders. Our reaction is to either take the feeders in a t night or just accept it as a 2-3 times a season reminder of our furry friend's presence. I tell my friends that living New York City (4 1/2 hours away) that it is much better than having drive by shootings.
When you live in the country you have expect to have wild animals visiting. We have at least one black bear visiting daily. Ed, we don't have any bird feeders anymore. We just place the seed on the ground. The only way a wild animal should be killed is when it is a direct threat ie: child.
One note Johnnie: The lion was not shot by "Forest Service Rangers", but by Fish and Game officers. There's a difference.
There have been a few Mountain Lion attacks in this area in the past few years, so they're a little worried up there. You may know that Casper's Wilderness just recently reopened because of past Lion attacks including one death. I have a very remote ranch in the Agua Tibia Wilderness, not too far from there. We have a lot of lions around, but I never see one. I hear them at night and find I their tracks. When you see a lion on a golf course there is something wrong. Lions stay away from people, they're not like bears in this way. That's why the only Lion photos you see on NPN are taken at zoos or game farms (unless you're extremely lucky). Sometimes what is happening is that people catch a lion kitten and raise it until it is too big for them to handle, then they let it go and expect it to be wild again, but it comes back looking for food. Another stupid people problem. The Cleveland National Forest is a huge area with a very healthy lion population.
The guy with the seal was just an idiot. We have those here too.
I remember the Whiting Ranch attack. They say that the bicylist that was killed was crouching down, fixing a broken chain and looking more like prey than a human. Once the lion got a tast for human, she went after another person, a woman walking with a friend. She was a freak exception to the lion population around here and obviously had to be destroyed. I often walk the Whiting Ranch Trail and I'm glad that particular lion is gone. I ocassionaly see deer on this trail and I'm sure that these are what draw the lions down to the trails. I've never seen a lion there, but I know that they exist all around us.
The lions around here do frequent the golf courses however. They come down for water whenever we are in a particularily dry year, like this one. My husband and his friends are golfers and have seen lions on the greens. It is my understanding that there is a golf course in San Clemente where the golfers warn new pople to "Watch out for the lion on the ? green."
They avoid the lion and the lion ignores them. I'm tempted to take up golf just to get the lion photo. A kid with a pretty nice SLR took a good shot of the Coto lion just before it was killed. Now, they are hunting down the lion that was with it.
New link to story: http://www.ocregister.com/ocregister/homepage/abox/article_1787830.php
I guess I just have issues with people who plop themselves down in the middle of wildlife territory and then freak out and call the police if they spot wildlife near them. I'm with Ed and John. We need to adapt to them if we're living in their environment, not the other way around.
I agree that the man with the seal was an idiot. I recently signed up as a volunteer at the Pacific Marine life Institute in Laguna Beach where that seal was taken to be euthanized. The Institute is filled with injured seals and a few sea lions who have had encounters with similar idiots.
I'm just glad that there are so many members of NPN that show so much respect for wildlife. I'm glad I found this place. It gives me hope.
A few years before the cyclist there was also a woman jogger attacked in the same area (Casper's Wilderness). Also, one woman was killed here in San Diego (Cuyamaca) and just recently in Northern California a person was attacked.
I notice that these two lions in the article are young lions "with no fear of humans". This tells me that they were probably captive as kittens and then released. It is not normal behavior for a lion. Even a small kitten in the wild will avoid people.
My wife is a wildlife biologist with Cleveland National Forest. She spends a good part of every week out in the field in places that are seldom visited, and in 15 years she's only seen a lion once, and it was a kitten. I've heard of Lions on Golf courses, and I've golfed here for many years (no more though, I stink at it). I've never seen a lion. Some big bobcats, but that's all. I'd really like to see a photo, but I don't think it will be so easy to get.
It's too bad what's happening here in Southern California. Like a lot of our wild areas all over the world, they are being bulldozed and built on. Then we complain when there's a snake in the yard. I agree with you there. And, yeah, the "News" always seems to have it's own slant on things.
Check this website for more info: http://www.dfg.ca.gov/news/issues/lion/attacks.html
Posted by Basil Greber on July 30, 2007 at 8:49 AM
Many people like the idea of living near nature, but once real nature actually comes near they panic.
Very true. I even remember some person who wanted to start some wildlife photography (don't know whether it was here or on another message board) posting funny things. Person said that he/she had a small pond in the garden, where some deer went to drink. But person didn't want the deer drinking there, so person chased it away. Next thing, a heron came and caught some fish in the pool. Person didn't like herons catching fish either, so this one was chased away too. And so on... Kind of funny when you want to take wildlife photographs, but whenever "wildlife" visits, you chase it away (before taking any photographs) because it disturbs the status quo...
Last week I had to step over a baby rattlesnake that decided to relax on my front step. No problem, he eventually move on. Last month when I put on my favorite pair of jeans, I didn't realize that a large scorpion had crawled inside. So when I sat down he stung me in the butt Unfortunately he died, not me. I removed a small colony of about 50 bats from my mountain cabin. First I built two huge bathouses and put them outside the cabin near where the bats normally would enter. Then I sealed up all of the entry points to the cabin and we chased all of the bats outside one fun evening. They were happy to move into their new home. I regularly have to remove scorpions, lizards, and poisonous spiders from inside my house. That's the only rule... no wildlife in the house. Oh, and keep your stupid cat out of my yard. That's the other rule
I am totally amazed ... no, amazed is not strong enough ... incredulous at how alienated man is to nature. I live in a large city only out of necessity because my profession is "full color journeyman pressman" on a 5 color Heidelberg but I'm far more "in my element" when I'm out in the middle of nowhere with just my canoe and my camera and my tent. I'll go out to the Frontenac or Algonquin wilderness for 2 weeks at a time and never see another human and love it But in the city I continually meet loads of people who are just as incredulous that I could do such a thing ... and they find it revolting !!! One lady on my morning bus said that the closest she ever wanted to get to anything nature was at the museum.
No wonder we see such idiotic stupidity and total moronic ignorance aimed at the natural world. It's the 1 thing over which I can come close to loosing self control. The moronic igorance of some people absolutely infuriates me. I don't think there is anything about which I feel so strongly. !!!
I am totally amazed ... no, amazed is not strong enough ... incredulous at how alienated man is to nature. I live in a large city only out of necessity because my profession is "full color journeyman pressman" on a 5 color Heidelberg but I'm far more "in my element" when I'm out in the middle of nowhere with just my canoe and my camera and my tent. I'll go out to the Frontenac or Algonquin wilderness for 2 weeks at a time and never see another human and love it But in the city I continually meet loads of people who are just as incredulous that I could do such a thing ... and they find it revolting !!! One lady on my morning bus said that the closest she ever wanted to get to anything nature was at the museum.
No wonder we see such idiotic stupidity and total moronic ignorance aimed at the natural world. It's the 1 thing over which I can come close to loosing self control. The moronic igorance of some people absolutely infuriates me. I don't think there is anything about which I feel so strongly. !!!
Discussion
10 repliesStory here: http://www.knbc.com/news/13773142/detail.html?dl=headlineclick.
Then, some guy fishing decided to stab a seal to death because it stole his bait.
Story here: http://cbs2.com/topstories/local_story_209030418.html
What's going on in the world that we build against a forest and then get upset when wildlife gets too close to us? Or when we massacare a sea creature because it doesn't follow our rules.
I know that this insanity exists everywhere, but I can't stand to watch it anymore. I'm giving up the news.
Johnnie
John
There have been a few Mountain Lion attacks in this area in the past few years, so they're a little worried up there. You may know that Casper's Wilderness just recently reopened because of past Lion attacks including one death. I have a very remote ranch in the Agua Tibia Wilderness, not too far from there. We have a lot of lions around, but I never see one. I hear them at night and find I their tracks. When you see a lion on a golf course there is something wrong. Lions stay away from people, they're not like bears in this way. That's why the only Lion photos you see on NPN are taken at zoos or game farms (unless you're extremely lucky). Sometimes what is happening is that people catch a lion kitten and raise it until it is too big for them to handle, then they let it go and expect it to be wild again, but it comes back looking for food. Another stupid people problem. The Cleveland National Forest is a huge area with a very healthy lion population.
The guy with the seal was just an idiot. We have those here too.
I remember the Whiting Ranch attack. They say that the bicylist that was killed was crouching down, fixing a broken chain and looking more like prey than a human. Once the lion got a tast for human, she went after another person, a woman walking with a friend. She was a freak exception to the lion population around here and obviously had to be destroyed. I often walk the Whiting Ranch Trail and I'm glad that particular lion is gone. I ocassionaly see deer on this trail and I'm sure that these are what draw the lions down to the trails. I've never seen a lion there, but I know that they exist all around us.
The lions around here do frequent the golf courses however. They come down for water whenever we are in a particularily dry year, like this one. My husband and his friends are golfers and have seen lions on the greens. It is my understanding that there is a golf course in San Clemente where the golfers warn new pople to "Watch out for the lion on the ? green."
They avoid the lion and the lion ignores them. I'm tempted to take up golf just to get the lion photo. A kid with a pretty nice SLR took a good shot of the Coto lion just before it was killed. Now, they are hunting down the lion that was with it.
New link to story: http://www.ocregister.com/ocregister/homepage/abox/article_1787830.php
I guess I just have issues with people who plop themselves down in the middle of wildlife territory and then freak out and call the police if they spot wildlife near them. I'm with Ed and John. We need to adapt to them if we're living in their environment, not the other way around.
I agree that the man with the seal was an idiot. I recently signed up as a volunteer at the Pacific Marine life Institute in Laguna Beach where that seal was taken to be euthanized. The Institute is filled with injured seals and a few sea lions who have had encounters with similar idiots.
I'm just glad that there are so many members of NPN that show so much respect for wildlife. I'm glad I found this place. It gives me hope.
And, I'm still swearing off the news.
Johnnie
A few years before the cyclist there was also a woman jogger attacked in the same area (Casper's Wilderness). Also, one woman was killed here in San Diego (Cuyamaca) and just recently in Northern California a person was attacked.
I notice that these two lions in the article are young lions "with no fear of humans". This tells me that they were probably captive as kittens and then released. It is not normal behavior for a lion. Even a small kitten in the wild will avoid people.
My wife is a wildlife biologist with Cleveland National Forest. She spends a good part of every week out in the field in places that are seldom visited, and in 15 years she's only seen a lion once, and it was a kitten. I've heard of Lions on Golf courses, and I've golfed here for many years (no more though, I stink at it). I've never seen a lion. Some big bobcats, but that's all. I'd really like to see a photo, but I don't think it will be so easy to get.
It's too bad what's happening here in Southern California. Like a lot of our wild areas all over the world, they are being bulldozed and built on. Then we complain when there's a snake in the yard. I agree with you there. And, yeah, the "News" always seems to have it's own slant on things.
Check this website for more info: http://www.dfg.ca.gov/news/issues/lion/attacks.html
Johnnie
Very true. I even remember some person who wanted to start some wildlife photography (don't know whether it was here or on another message board) posting funny things. Person said that he/she had a small pond in the garden, where some deer went to drink. But person didn't want the deer drinking there, so person chased it away. Next thing, a heron came and caught some fish in the pool. Person didn't like herons catching fish either, so this one was chased away too. And so on... Kind of funny when you want to take wildlife photographs, but whenever "wildlife" visits, you chase it away (before taking any photographs) because it disturbs the status quo...
Basil
No wonder we see such idiotic stupidity and total moronic ignorance aimed at the natural world. It's the 1 thing over which I can come close to loosing self control. The moronic igorance of some people absolutely infuriates me. I don't think there is anything about which I feel so strongly.
Bob
No wonder we see such idiotic stupidity and total moronic ignorance aimed at the natural world. It's the 1 thing over which I can come close to loosing self control. The moronic igorance of some people absolutely infuriates me. I don't think there is anything about which I feel so strongly.
Bob