Posted by Graeme Lee on August 17, 2007 at 5:09 AM
Hi,
It looks like I'm going for the 17-40mm for landscapes and wondered what the main accessories were needed for landscape work.
What would you recommend I buy with the lens? Things like filters I'm after. Which ones are vitally important and they seem to differ greatly in price.
I just need cheap but effective for now and don't want to waste money.
A UV filter is essential for that particular lens as it completes the sealing. I like the Hoya Pro 1's or the B+W slim UV filters (both available from Warehouse Express)
A polarizer is a must have IMHO but does need to be used with care on the 17-40mm to avoid uneven polarisation. (B+W Kasemann Slim Polariser from Robert White's). In fact 'must have' is probably a bit strong 'useful to have' would probably be a better term to use.
A set of neutral density graduated filters may be an item you may want to consider, although expect to pay quite a hefty price for a full set of quality filters,i.e. Lee,etc.
A cheaper option is to use one of the many exposure blending techniques in Photoshop.
Hot shoe spirit level is a worthwhile investment particularly if you do a lot of stitched panoramics, as is a grid focusing screen.
Remote release is a must have or the more expensive Canon TC-80NS Timer Remote Controller if you plan on doing a lot of long exposure night photography.
A dusbin liner. The most dramatic light is often before a downpour, Dusbin liner over the tripod mounted camera is a life saver.
Probably the most important item of all (after a flask of coffee) is a good quality pair of hiking boots
A compass to determine where the sun will rise and set.
A print out of hyperfocal distances for that particular lens or a good memory.
Posted by Andrew Stagg on August 17, 2007 at 5:33 AM
I agree with Justin on the Polariser and the ND's but I stopped using UV's a long time ago. The sealing on Canon L is fine as it stands - the addition of a UV only puts an inferior piece of glass in front of a seriously expensive (and good) glass.
Oh and one addition,
Good waterproof jacket. You can get wet trousers, feet , head etc etc but a good waterproof jacket often saves what would be a miserable wet day.
Totally agree with you on L lenses in general but on that particular lens (17-40mm) Canon do advise a filter is necesary to complete the sealing process.
Posted by Graeme Lee on August 17, 2007 at 5:41 AM
Thanks for the replies. My goodness, I thought bird photography was expensive!! This is mounting up to the cost of a lens and more!
Sorry for being a bit thick, but I've never looked into any of this stuff before, but there seems to be a lot of filters with similar names with subtle differences. Is a circular polariser un-necessary? I'm caught up in the jargon confusion state!!!
Don't suppose anyone on here has any second hand filters described going?
Circular polarisers come in two types, circular and linear, it's a circular one you would need.
A polariser isn't essential, in fact I certainly wouldn't buy one untill you've had the lens for a while and then definately decide you want/need one. The reason being, a screw-in 77mm filter is ideal if you don't use graduated filters, but if at a later stage you do decide to go with using grads then a more compatible one with whatever system you choose would be the order of the day, i.e. a Lee polariser with a Lee set of grads,etc.
A lot of the items I mentioned above are very useful to have and no doubt you'll probably end up buying them if you get into landscape photography but they're not essential initially.
For instance a good eye and a bit of rotational correction in Photoshop can be used instead of the focusing screen and spirit level.
The camera's self-timer can be used instead of a remote release.
A watch can be used instead of the Timer Remote Controller.
A comfy pair of trainers will do instead of hiking boots
A dash for cover instead of the dusbin liner may suffice.
If you ask me the single most important filter is the graduated neutral density filter. I use Lee but started out with really cheap Cokin ones which allowed me to get to get familiar with how to use them by just hand holding them in front of the lens. Hitech are mean to be a very good make also. Tristan
Posted by Sean Bolton on August 17, 2007 at 6:22 AM
Hi Graeme
I would also say the use of a UV filter is not necessary on the 17-40, It will increase the vignetting (but probably not noticeable of 1.3x crop) and degrade (very slightly) image quality. Interesting it is recommended by Canon for sealing, but is this lens sealing (i.e. dust into lens) or weather sealing?
A circular polarizer is a nice-to-have but only useful in a few circumstances (e.g. cutting water reflections, enhancing blue skies). But most of the colour/contrast/saturation effects a polarizer gives you can be done in Photoshop to a large extent. Again a nice-to-have but not necessary, you will only use it occasionally. I don't own one.
The Neutral Density graduated filters are the most useful for balancing sky and foreground exposure. I would go for the Lee Filter system. Start with a basic filter kit and a 2 stop graduated filter, this is probably the best allrounder, although sometimes a 3 stop is better.
Another option is to bracket your exposures and blend in Photoshop using HDR, or use a third party tool such as Photomatix. Needs a mainly static subject, usually the case for landscapes, but sea and rivers can be awkward due to waves/movement. Also allows blending of non-regular shaped outlines which a filter can't easily manage.
Personally I have got a bit fedup doing Photoshop merges of multiple exposures and I intend to use Lee Filters when suitable.
So my first suggestion is don't buy any filters. Learn to blend in Photoshop.
2nd suggestion is buy a minimal Lee Filter kit with a graduated 2 or 3 stop ND. Play with this a bit and then buy additional filters as needed.
Agree a hot-shoe spirit level is a MUST have. Thankfully only a few quid.
A cable release is useful, the basic one is fine unless you want to do lots of very long (>30 sec) exposures in which case use a stopwatch or buy the more expensive cable release with self timer.
Or you can use the camera self-timer which I often use. With mirror lock-up the self-timer allows 2 seconds before releasing the shutter.
Blokes, I disagree with all of you. The most important item for landscape photography is alarm clock. The louder the better and in my example few of them are better still .
Another essential thing to do is to click a link in my signature (ups, that will get me into troubles with moderators ).
Then it's a polarizer filter. You can blend exposures via Photoshop, if you would not like to pay for GND filters for a start, but for polarizer there is no substitution. Sean, you are forgetting that blue sky and water reflections are only few occasions that need polarizer. For me at least, being able to cut reflections from leaves and this way increasing green vegetation saturation is far more important and so is polarizer’s ability to cut in haze increasing local contrast in distant landscape. You only need to keep in mind, that polarizer is most effective in direction of 90 degrees to the sun and is useless directly into the sun and straight away from sun.
Hot shoe spirit level is nice to have, but till I bought mine, I used vertical trees (together with focus point marks) or horizon to keep my camera square.
Most important is your will to learn. With 17-40 and your 500 you have a decent set-up to start. If you'll look around you, you'll be surprised how useful 500 is for landscape. I use mine quite a bit when working with 35 mm. After all I paid a lot of euros for it and more I use it, more my purchase was reasonable.
Cheers,
Marko
Posted by John Chapman on August 17, 2007 at 7:30 AM
Hi Graeme once you get your Lens just get out their and start shooting then over a period of time you can decide which filters to buy. Sorry I have no spare filters now.
John
Aberdeen
Posted by Tom Perkins on August 17, 2007 at 7:58 AM
Get a really good tripod if you don't already have one! The tripod is just as important as the camera itself.
Also, nd grads are very useful. Yes you can combine exposures in PS, but its much quicker to just get it right in camera.
I guess it depends on your approach - light and fast, or slow and determined, or somewhere in the middle!
For me, the essentials are a set of ND Grads, a polariser and a tripod. The tripod depends what I'm doing. If I'm up in the mountains, I use a lightweight job that won't slow me down too much, otherwise I use the clunker that I have for wildlife photography (heavy but mroe stable)
Hi Graeme,
I would go for Hi-tech filters: as far as I am aware, they are optically as good as the more expensive brands, and as they scratch quite easily, and need replacing fairly regularly, there doesn`t seem any point spending more than you need to - at least for starters. They come in two types: soft (with a gradual transition between light and dark parts of the filter - good for uneven horizons), and hard (with a more abrupt dividing line - good for straight horizons, such as seascapes). Apparantly, Hi-tech`s `hard` are more like other brands` `soft` filters, and, personally, I find Hi-tec`s `soft` to be too soft to be much use. So, to start with, I would get a couple of hard edge filters, say a 2- and a 3-stop, and see how you go from there. Hope that makes sense! Filters can be bought HERE. (The 85mm ones, that fit a Cokin `P` holder, are only £12.77 each).
If your landscapes are as good as your bird shots, they should be worth seeing!
Posted by Andy Astbury on August 18, 2007 at 3:55 AM
Graeme - I know little about this landscape mularky, but with regard to polarizers I'll say this - all my photography would be done with one if there was enough light to let me get away with it, the increase in 'natural' colour saturation alone makes them worth their weight in gold
Posted by Tom Perkins on August 18, 2007 at 5:40 AM
Do remember that polarizers do tend to change the hue of some colours as well as the saturation though, I often find they leave images looking a bit cold. They are very good if you want to give clouds more definition, or take out reflections when shooting rock pools for example, but personally I wouldn't use one on every shot.
Posted by Graeme Lee on August 18, 2007 at 3:19 PM
Well thanks for all the responses. There's a lot to consider here. I think for the time being I am going to just have a bare lens and learn from my mistakes and what I need. I think my Dad may have some UV and polarisers so I'll tap him up
Again, many thanks. There's some great advice here
Discussion
16 repliesIt looks like I'm going for the 17-40mm for landscapes and wondered what the main accessories were needed for landscape work.
What would you recommend I buy with the lens? Things like filters I'm after. Which ones are vitally important and they seem to differ greatly in price.
I just need cheap but effective for now and don't want to waste money.
Thanks
Graeme
A UV filter is essential for that particular lens as it completes the sealing. I like the Hoya Pro 1's or the B+W slim UV filters (both available from Warehouse Express)
A polarizer is a must have IMHO but does need to be used with care on the 17-40mm to avoid uneven polarisation. (B+W Kasemann Slim Polariser from Robert White's). In fact 'must have' is probably a bit strong 'useful to have' would probably be a better term to use.
A set of neutral density graduated filters may be an item you may want to consider, although expect to pay quite a hefty price for a full set of quality filters,i.e. Lee,etc.
A cheaper option is to use one of the many exposure blending techniques in Photoshop.
Hot shoe spirit level is a worthwhile investment particularly if you do a lot of stitched panoramics, as is a grid focusing screen.
Remote release is a must have or the more expensive Canon TC-80NS Timer Remote Controller if you plan on doing a lot of long exposure night photography.
A dusbin liner. The most dramatic light is often before a downpour, Dusbin liner over the tripod mounted camera is a life saver.
Probably the most important item of all (after a flask of coffee) is a good quality pair of hiking boots
A compass to determine where the sun will rise and set.
A print out of hyperfocal distances for that particular lens or a good memory.
Oh and one addition,
Good waterproof jacket. You can get wet trousers, feet , head etc etc but a good waterproof jacket often saves what would be a miserable wet day.
(mine came from an army surplus store £12)
Andrew
Totally agree with you on L lenses in general but on that particular lens (17-40mm) Canon do advise a filter is necesary to complete the sealing process.
Sorry for being a bit thick, but I've never looked into any of this stuff before, but there seems to be a lot of filters with similar names with subtle differences. Is a circular polariser un-necessary? I'm caught up in the jargon confusion state!!!
Don't suppose anyone on here has any second hand filters described going?
A polariser isn't essential, in fact I certainly wouldn't buy one untill you've had the lens for a while and then definately decide you want/need one. The reason being, a screw-in 77mm filter is ideal if you don't use graduated filters, but if at a later stage you do decide to go with using grads then a more compatible one with whatever system you choose would be the order of the day, i.e. a Lee polariser with a Lee set of grads,etc.
A lot of the items I mentioned above are very useful to have and no doubt you'll probably end up buying them if you get into landscape photography but they're not essential initially.
For instance a good eye and a bit of rotational correction in Photoshop can be used instead of the focusing screen and spirit level.
The camera's self-timer can be used instead of a remote release.
A watch can be used instead of the Timer Remote Controller.
A comfy pair of trainers will do instead of hiking boots
A dash for cover instead of the dusbin liner may suffice.
The flask of coffee is however essential
I would also say the use of a UV filter is not necessary on the 17-40, It will increase the vignetting (but probably not noticeable of 1.3x crop) and degrade (very slightly) image quality. Interesting it is recommended by Canon for sealing, but is this lens sealing (i.e. dust into lens) or weather sealing?
A circular polarizer is a nice-to-have but only useful in a few circumstances (e.g. cutting water reflections, enhancing blue skies). But most of the colour/contrast/saturation effects a polarizer gives you can be done in Photoshop to a large extent. Again a nice-to-have but not necessary, you will only use it occasionally. I don't own one.
The Neutral Density graduated filters are the most useful for balancing sky and foreground exposure. I would go for the Lee Filter system. Start with a basic filter kit and a 2 stop graduated filter, this is probably the best allrounder, although sometimes a 3 stop is better.
Another option is to bracket your exposures and blend in Photoshop using HDR, or use a third party tool such as Photomatix. Needs a mainly static subject, usually the case for landscapes, but sea and rivers can be awkward due to waves/movement. Also allows blending of non-regular shaped outlines which a filter can't easily manage.
Personally I have got a bit fedup doing Photoshop merges of multiple exposures and I intend to use Lee Filters when suitable.
So my first suggestion is don't buy any filters. Learn to blend in Photoshop.
2nd suggestion is buy a minimal Lee Filter kit with a graduated 2 or 3 stop ND. Play with this a bit and then buy additional filters as needed.
Agree a hot-shoe spirit level is a MUST have. Thankfully only a few quid.
A cable release is useful, the basic one is fine unless you want to do lots of very long (>30 sec) exposures in which case use a stopwatch or buy the more expensive cable release with self timer.
Or you can use the camera self-timer which I often use. With mirror lock-up the self-timer allows 2 seconds before releasing the shutter.
cheers
Sean
"
I'm the same... I dug the filters back out of the bag...
Another essential thing to do is to click a link in my signature (ups, that will get me into troubles with moderators
Then it's a polarizer filter. You can blend exposures via Photoshop, if you would not like to pay for GND filters for a start, but for polarizer there is no substitution. Sean, you are forgetting that blue sky and water reflections are only few occasions that need polarizer. For me at least, being able to cut reflections from leaves and this way increasing green vegetation saturation is far more important and so is polarizer’s ability to cut in haze increasing local contrast in distant landscape. You only need to keep in mind, that polarizer is most effective in direction of 90 degrees to the sun and is useless directly into the sun and straight away from sun.
Hot shoe spirit level is nice to have, but till I bought mine, I used vertical trees (together with focus point marks) or horizon to keep my camera square.
Most important is your will to learn. With 17-40 and your 500 you have a decent set-up to start. If you'll look around you, you'll be surprised how useful 500 is for landscape. I use mine quite a bit when working with 35 mm. After all I paid a lot of euros for it and more I use it, more my purchase was reasonable.
Cheers,
Marko
John
Aberdeen
Also, nd grads are very useful. Yes you can combine exposures in PS, but its much quicker to just get it right in camera.
Polarizer is also nice, but not essential.
For me, the essentials are a set of ND Grads, a polariser and a tripod. The tripod depends what I'm doing. If I'm up in the mountains, I use a lightweight job that won't slow me down too much, otherwise I use the clunker that I have for wildlife photography (heavy but mroe stable)
HTH!
I would go for Hi-tech filters: as far as I am aware, they are optically as good as the more expensive brands, and as they scratch quite easily, and need replacing fairly regularly, there doesn`t seem any point spending more than you need to - at least for starters. They come in two types: soft (with a gradual transition between light and dark parts of the filter - good for uneven horizons), and hard (with a more abrupt dividing line - good for straight horizons, such as seascapes). Apparantly, Hi-tech`s `hard` are more like other brands` `soft` filters, and, personally, I find Hi-tec`s `soft` to be too soft to be much use. So, to start with, I would get a couple of hard edge filters, say a 2- and a 3-stop, and see how you go from there. Hope that makes sense! Filters can be bought HERE. (The 85mm ones, that fit a Cokin `P` holder, are only £12.77 each).
If your landscapes are as good as your bird shots, they should be worth seeing!
Again, many thanks. There's some great advice here