What constitutes "a subject" in a landscape photo? Or do I have a "special" talent for leaving the subject out altogther??
Please reference my "Helter Skelter" post in ES&S forum. (I don't know how to make a convenient link here. )
In my original post, the subject, to me, was that the boulders are all tumbled around. In the wider angle shot of the scene that the first post was part of, the subject, to me, was the red rock cliff and the subtle triangles in the land forms.
I'm very interested about what everyone has to say about this.
Catherine, the subject is what you want it to be, although there's no guarantees your viewers will pick the same one as you did. There's a lot you can do to help, with composition and presentation, to communicate what YOU think is the subject but ultimately those who have not been there or who may have other visual sensibilities may not see it the same way. Not much we can do there.
In your image the strongest element to my eye is the juniper. I find the jumbled boulders make a great background but when I look at the composition as a whole my eye immediately lands on the tree.
Guy
Posted by Hans Hibbard on August 26, 2007 at 7:56 PM
That's funny Guy, I initially considered the boulders to be the subject. Catherine, I only mentioned the non-subject topic because you had in another post on PNWNP. Personally, I think you're images tend to have entire scenes as subjects as opposed to a scene wich includes a subject. I do enjoy your perspective.
I see the boulders as the subject too Catherine. More specifically, the patterns that the boulders make in the landscape. I like your first crop, with the tree more off center. The others are good too, and they each show a different perspective of your subject. I agree with Guy, the subject is what you want it to be, and may not be perceived the same way by someone else. Sometimes the subject is more of a feeling, and not necessarily an object. The New York Institute of Photography has this as its main teaching: decide on your subject, focus attention on your subject, and eliminate all items that detract from your subject. I think you accomplished that!
Thanks! This is great. And thanks also to those who may be commenting in the ES&S thread mentioned above.
I have other photos of desert scenes from this trip that would fit into the "feeling" category: vast and open, stormy, serene, etc, yet without an ovbious "subject."
I hope others will join in and comment. The subject of "subject" is not so straightforward, then? Compositional "rules" help to define a subject within the frame; OTOH, an entire scene can be the subject as long as it has some kind of emotional impact.... Getting less confused, I think?
What a fun way to learn. We all have such a variety of experience and ways of seeing.
Posted by Lon Overacker on August 27, 2007 at 3:57 AM
Catherine,
I think I touched on this on my comment to your post, but I think there's a difference between a "subject" and something else such as a "focal point." Many times, comments will be made such as "the eye has a place to rest, or return to." IMHO, this is a focal point; an element in the image where there is "solid ground," a place that keeps the viewer's eye within the image. The subject, or the "main subject" could, and many times, is completely different. The "subject" could be a mood, a feeling, a story or a concept, etc.; it's the message that the photographer is attempting to communicate with the viewer. In the case of your image, I think the juniper/pine is a "focal point," where as your "subject" is the geology, the scene as a whole, telling a story. The "story" is always the most difficult to tell in a one-dimensional medium. The light, the compositon, the lines, graphics, etc., all help in communicating that message to the viewer.
Well, that's just my .02. Hope it makes sense.
Lon
Posted by Janet Bentley on August 28, 2007 at 5:23 PM
Catherine, interpretation and enjoyment are very individual.
I enjoy the fact that you often use your entire frame to portray your subject which I consider to be interesting or beautiful patterns or textures. i.e., your Nicotina photo - flowers beautifully spaced in a repeated pattern across the entire frame. Your water reflections photo with the shimmer of the surface reflections patterned across the entire frame. When the pattern is unbroken, your subject is generally obvious and enjoyable with light and shadow captured well.
My eye is also naturally drawn to where pattern is conspicuously interrupted. In your ES&S Helter Skelter rocks, my eye is quickly drawn to the large tree away from the pattern of stone layers and shrubby lower growth. The pattern interrupted, in this case by the big tree, creates diversion and makes the subject less important to me. I still think it's a neat photo but I feel the competing element causes the subject to have somewhat less impact.
I think you are developing an interesting look that's your own. Keep up your good work.
Discussion
7 repliesPlease reference my "Helter Skelter" post in ES&S forum. (I don't know how to make a convenient link here.
In my original post, the subject, to me, was that the boulders are all tumbled around. In the wider angle shot of the scene that the first post was part of, the subject, to me, was the red rock cliff and the subtle triangles in the land forms.
I'm very interested about what everyone has to say about this.
In your image the strongest element to my eye is the juniper. I find the jumbled boulders make a great background but when I look at the composition as a whole my eye immediately lands on the tree.
Guy
Alice, I think you said it perfectly!
Guy
I have other photos of desert scenes from this trip that would fit into the "feeling" category: vast and open, stormy, serene, etc, yet without an ovbious "subject."
I hope others will join in and comment. The subject of "subject" is not so straightforward, then? Compositional "rules" help to define a subject within the frame; OTOH, an entire scene can be the subject as long as it has some kind of emotional impact.... Getting less confused, I think?
What a fun way to learn. We all have such a variety of experience and ways of seeing.
I think I touched on this on my comment to your post, but I think there's a difference between a "subject" and something else such as a "focal point." Many times, comments will be made such as "the eye has a place to rest, or return to." IMHO, this is a focal point; an element in the image where there is "solid ground," a place that keeps the viewer's eye within the image. The subject, or the "main subject" could, and many times, is completely different. The "subject" could be a mood, a feeling, a story or a concept, etc.; it's the message that the photographer is attempting to communicate with the viewer. In the case of your image, I think the juniper/pine is a "focal point," where as your "subject" is the geology, the scene as a whole, telling a story. The "story" is always the most difficult to tell in a one-dimensional medium. The light, the compositon, the lines, graphics, etc., all help in communicating that message to the viewer.
Well, that's just my .02. Hope it makes sense.
Lon
I enjoy the fact that you often use your entire frame to portray your subject which I consider to be interesting or beautiful patterns or textures. i.e., your Nicotina photo - flowers beautifully spaced in a repeated pattern across the entire frame. Your water reflections photo with the shimmer of the surface reflections patterned across the entire frame. When the pattern is unbroken, your subject is generally obvious and enjoyable with light and shadow captured well.
My eye is also naturally drawn to where pattern is conspicuously interrupted. In your ES&S Helter Skelter rocks, my eye is quickly drawn to the large tree away from the pattern of stone layers and shrubby lower growth. The pattern interrupted, in this case by the big tree, creates diversion and makes the subject less important to me. I still think it's a neat photo but I feel the competing element causes the subject to have somewhat less impact.
I think you are developing an interesting look that's your own. Keep up your good work.