Posted by Lance Warley on September 15, 2007 at 5:02 PM
I'm looking for suggestions on whether or not to add a flash to my XTi/400mm 5.6L for taking bird photos. I know absolutely nothing about this.
Where I normally shoot, some of the experienced shooters use fill flash,some don't.
If your suggestion is "Yes," which unit do you recommend, because Canon seems to offer two main choices with a big price difference - the 430 at $240 in B&H, and the 580 at $410? Big price difference for a hobbyist, not a pro.
A diffuser? A bouncer? Anything else? Seriously, I have no idea.
If you're wondering what my goal is, it's simply to take photos that look better.
Thanks in advance.
Posted by Dan Borzynski on September 15, 2007 at 5:58 PM
Another possibility would be to get a used 550. That should put the price about halfway between those two flash units. You should get about about half stop of power over the 430, faster recycle times and the ability to use an external battery pack (with faster recycling).
In any case, for birds, a good piece of equipment would be a Better Beamer, or something equivalent. It effective increases the guide number by concentrating the flash output. With TTL flash compensation at say, -1.5, the flash will actually have to put out less power since more of it will be hitting the subject rather be scattered everywhere. Net result is even faster recycle times for any flash unit. The downside is that you will need to have effectively over 300 mm of lens. For bird photography, this focal length is essentially a non-issue but for larger critters such as deer or buffalo, it might be a consideration.
Posted by Steve Foss on September 15, 2007 at 7:39 PM
Lance, the answer to your basic question is yes. A flash is one more tool to put in your toolbox and take out when the situation calls for it (low light of any type). Dan's given you good advice.
Posted by Richard Ditch on September 15, 2007 at 9:47 PM
I only use fill flash on birds when I have no other choice - primarily to fill in deep shadows under the harsh Ariaonz desert sun. I do not consider flash as a tool for low light conditions - that's what higher ISO and tripods are for IMO. I have a better beemer but detest using it, so I don't even carry it with me in the field any more, although I do keep the flash in my fanny pack while I walk around.
I like nature images to look natural, and that is difficult to do with any added flash (even light fill). And most photographers use too much fill IMO, resulting in an overlit bird that might show nice detail but doesn't look natural.
With a lightweight 400/5.6 like you own I suspect you do a fair amount of hand held walkabout bird photography. For this you will find a mounted flash something of an inconvenience, and a flash with BB unworkable. If you primarily work on a tripod, then a flash with BB is less of an issue.
Posted by Mike Johnson on September 16, 2007 at 8:53 AM
580 with a Better Beamer is a good tool for birds with long lenses. Allows you to better balance the light. I find it essential in Florida. Here is some information: http://www.birdsasart.com/accs.html#BEAMER
Mike
Posted by Lance Warley on September 16, 2007 at 3:15 PM
Thanks very much, guys. Exactly the input I was hoping for.
Posted by Terry Sohl on September 17, 2007 at 9:58 AM
I have 20D and the 400 5.6L as my primary lens. This too is a hobby for me, I'm not a professional.
I bought the 430EX for the very reason you listed...there's a big (for me) price difference between it and the 580EX. I also bought a Better Beamer, a definite must have when shooting birds with this combo.
430EX and BB is a pretty cheap combo, but it is great for use with the 400 5.6l. Easy to use too. Depending on conditions, I'm normally shooting it as fill-flash at about -1 1/3 flash compensation. Does a wonderful job opening up shadows in a situation with sharp contrasts. I do also use it in low-light situations at times, especially for shaded forest birds, but do try to tame it down so the flash isn't so obvious.
Posted by John W. Wall on September 18, 2007 at 5:34 PM
My own $.02 since no one has mentioned it yet is that even though a beamer can improve a shot, it can also give you eye-shine problems even at a considerable distance. Maybe that's something people deal with in PS, but I've been amazed and bummed by this. Also, the beamer concentrates the beam in the center of the frame, so if your main subject is over on the left or right third, it won't get the main portion of the light.
Posted by John Mikes on September 24, 2007 at 3:07 PM
Another bad thing the Beamer can do is add vibration to your setup. Depending on its angle, it can be quite an effective sail, and cause a lot of camera movement. My first one was ripped off my strobe in a strong wind and resides in a wetland in Minnesota.
I am presently using a 40D with a 100-400 Canon and aa 580ex11 often with a better beamer.
I love it. I use it when the shadows need filling and also in some low light situations. My latest post in Avian is of a Flicker taken with a BB and Fill flash at -2 . I use 2nd curtain flash and am careful not to overpower the ambient light. I went with the 580 because I did not want to wish I had it somewhere down the line.
Rick T
Discussion
9 repliesWhere I normally shoot, some of the experienced shooters use fill flash,some don't.
If your suggestion is "Yes," which unit do you recommend, because Canon seems to offer two main choices with a big price difference - the 430 at $240 in B&H, and the 580 at $410? Big price difference for a hobbyist, not a pro.
A diffuser? A bouncer? Anything else? Seriously, I have no idea.
If you're wondering what my goal is, it's simply to take photos that look better.
Thanks in advance.
In any case, for birds, a good piece of equipment would be a Better Beamer, or something equivalent. It effective increases the guide number by concentrating the flash output. With TTL flash compensation at say, -1.5, the flash will actually have to put out less power since more of it will be hitting the subject rather be scattered everywhere. Net result is even faster recycle times for any flash unit. The downside is that you will need to have effectively over 300 mm of lens. For bird photography, this focal length is essentially a non-issue but for larger critters such as deer or buffalo, it might be a consideration.
I like nature images to look natural, and that is difficult to do with any added flash (even light fill). And most photographers use too much fill IMO, resulting in an overlit bird that might show nice detail but doesn't look natural.
With a lightweight 400/5.6 like you own I suspect you do a fair amount of hand held walkabout bird photography. For this you will find a mounted flash something of an inconvenience, and a flash with BB unworkable. If you primarily work on a tripod, then a flash with BB is less of an issue.
Mike
I bought the 430EX for the very reason you listed...there's a big (for me) price difference between it and the 580EX. I also bought a Better Beamer, a definite must have when shooting birds with this combo.
430EX and BB is a pretty cheap combo, but it is great for use with the 400 5.6l. Easy to use too. Depending on conditions, I'm normally shooting it as fill-flash at about -1 1/3 flash compensation. Does a wonderful job opening up shadows in a situation with sharp contrasts. I do also use it in low-light situations at times, especially for shaded forest birds, but do try to tame it down so the flash isn't so obvious.
I love it. I use it when the shadows need filling and also in some low light situations. My latest post in Avian is of a Flicker taken with a BB and Fill flash at -2 . I use 2nd curtain flash and am careful not to overpower the ambient light. I went with the 580 because I did not want to wish I had it somewhere down the line.
Rick T