This is a shot that I took yesterday morning in Chasm Meadow after a morning at Chasm Lake in RMNP. As you can tell, this is an HDR image since it was just too contrasty to make it work with a single exposure. I really don't like the look of HDR images in general but I'd like to use the tool for such situations without overdoing it. Any thoughts on what I can do to this to make it look a little bit more real and less "flat" on the rocks and grass? Thanks!
Posted by Paul Beiser on October 6, 2007 at 9:46 PM
Hey Erik,
Nice pic, it doesn't have the 'normal' look of an HDR image, I think it looks pretty good, and thanks for giving me an idea where to poke around next time I am up there
Some ideas: maybe (via a layer mask) take the exposure down on the rocks and grass, and then apply a very subtle 'S' curve.
I like the clouds and the way they reinforce other nice lines!
Going to look a lot different up there the next couple of days
Posted by Art Escobado on October 6, 2007 at 10:01 PM
Why not just layer the different exposed images and mask it till it suits your tastes?
As far as HDR images are concerned I think you did a decent job-they usually look worse than this.
Posted by Mark Stahlke on October 6, 2007 at 10:01 PM
If it was me, I'd play around with masks and the lightness curve in LAB mode. Then again, if it was me, I'd probably make a mess of it.
Posted by John Klotz on October 6, 2007 at 11:28 PM
Erik, This looks pretty darn good to me but I have never attempted HDR so I can't coment on that. I think what what bothers me is that bright patch of grasses in the lower left. Bright areas tend to catch the eye and in this case I am getting trapped in the lower left corner. If you burn in or otherwise darken that area somehow it will balance out then I think it will work.
It is a very nice comp though.
John
Posted by Nat Coalson on October 7, 2007 at 12:02 AM
Erik - I think this is a good composition and overall a decent composite; it looks to me like an image that could really benefit from localized dodging and burning to enhance the 3-dimensional forms in the scene. The best approach is using adjustment layers with masks.
An adjustment layer (of any kind) with no adjustment changes applied, set to Multiply blending mode, is equivalent to a -1 EV underexposure.
Using Screen mode on an adjustment layer is equivalent to a +1 overexposure.
You don't need to make any changes to the settings; just changing the blending mode will apply the change.
Then, invert the adjustment layer mask so it's black, and paint on the mask with a soft brush - using white - where you want to apply the dodge or burn. Then adjust the layer opacity to fine-tune the adjustment.
Mostly, this image would be a candidate for burning. This will bring out the depth/dimension of the features in the scene, such as the plants in the foreground and the rocks in the mid-ground. The clouds might also benefit from this technique.
Posted by Rick Dunn on October 7, 2007 at 10:24 AM
Erik - this looks great, HDR or no HDR. The grotesque HDR images that I see on occasion usually suffer from a lack of any deep shadows. Given that HDR is often used when deep shadows are beyond control using normal techniques, I'd expect to see some dark shadows still remain in the HDR version, as in your image here.
I agree that some localized burning would benefit the foreground. Actually, what I would do is alternate dodging and burning to increase the contrast a little in the rocks and reddish grasses. You could do curves as well, but I find the alternating dodge/burn approach gives me better control.
For the bright spot that John mentions, I agree that it's the one small distracting element in the scene. Not sure how well burning would get the desired effect; worth trying. Tony K.'s luminosity masks would be a good approach as well.
Thanks for the input guys! As some of you know, post processing isn't an area where I feel real confident yet. It may take a few more lessons with Nat before I get more comfortable with this. Here is a link to an attempted re-work of this image based on your input. Is this better or what else would you suggest? Thanks!
Posted by Tony Bouchard on October 7, 2007 at 6:00 PM
Erik,
In my experience there is no need to use automated HDR techniques for an image like this - just make sure you have enough exposures to capture the extremes of highlights and shadows, then blend with layers & masks.
In the re-worked image, you might want to condsider making the rock middle left a little darker. I would use a curves adjustment layer with a mask to do this.
Posted by Derek Sedillo on October 7, 2007 at 9:47 PM
I agree with Tony 100%. I would definately darken the big bright rock in the left center. It looks like it is clipping and losing detail.
Here is what I use in this case. Take your dark exposure and bring it into PS as a layer. Make sure when converting in RAW you use exposure comp. for the lower half only (ie - let the top go black). Then copy and paste it into PS. Use the selection tool and select from about the rock down>feather>inverse>cut. Then adjust opacity to taste. You can also select isolated parts and only work on that part of the image layer.
- Derek
Posted by Jesse Speer on October 8, 2007 at 4:34 PM
Erik, if you hadn't given any background info, I wouldn't have thought HDR. In fact, I like it as is. If it were mine, I'd only add a little contrast work to the right/center (I'm a big fan of dodging/burning - and Nat's suggestion sounds very useful and nondestructive), and then fix the hot boulder. Looks like some softer morning light diffused by clouds. I g uess it all depends upon your final image intent. The result is a very pleasing mix of soft autumn color and morning drama (great clouds, great comp, etc.). IMO, don't play around with it too much!
The rework seems to have actually lost global contrast.
Discussion
10 repliesNice pic, it doesn't have the 'normal' look of an HDR image, I think it looks pretty good, and thanks for giving me an idea where to poke around next time I am up there
Some ideas: maybe (via a layer mask) take the exposure down on the rocks and grass, and then apply a very subtle 'S' curve.
I like the clouds and the way they reinforce other nice lines!
Going to look a lot different up there the next couple of days
As far as HDR images are concerned I think you did a decent job-they usually look worse than this.
It is a very nice comp though.
John
An adjustment layer (of any kind) with no adjustment changes applied, set to Multiply blending mode, is equivalent to a -1 EV underexposure.
Using Screen mode on an adjustment layer is equivalent to a +1 overexposure.
You don't need to make any changes to the settings; just changing the blending mode will apply the change.
Then, invert the adjustment layer mask so it's black, and paint on the mask with a soft brush - using white - where you want to apply the dodge or burn. Then adjust the layer opacity to fine-tune the adjustment.
Mostly, this image would be a candidate for burning. This will bring out the depth/dimension of the features in the scene, such as the plants in the foreground and the rocks in the mid-ground. The clouds might also benefit from this technique.
I agree that some localized burning would benefit the foreground. Actually, what I would do is alternate dodging and burning to increase the contrast a little in the rocks and reddish grasses. You could do curves as well, but I find the alternating dodge/burn approach gives me better control.
For the bright spot that John mentions, I agree that it's the one small distracting element in the scene. Not sure how well burning would get the desired effect; worth trying. Tony K.'s luminosity masks would be a good approach as well.
In my experience there is no need to use automated HDR techniques for an image like this - just make sure you have enough exposures to capture the extremes of highlights and shadows, then blend with layers & masks.
In the re-worked image, you might want to condsider making the rock middle left a little darker. I would use a curves adjustment layer with a mask to do this.
Here is what I use in this case. Take your dark exposure and bring it into PS as a layer. Make sure when converting in RAW you use exposure comp. for the lower half only (ie - let the top go black). Then copy and paste it into PS. Use the selection tool and select from about the rock down>feather>inverse>cut. Then adjust opacity to taste. You can also select isolated parts and only work on that part of the image layer.
- Derek
The rework seems to have actually lost global contrast.