I'm on the verge of buying a printer and I've been looking at both the Epson 3800 or the Canon iPF5000. The Epson was my first choice, but the prices on the iPF5000 are really dropping right now so I'm starting to waffle.
I'm not printing on a regular basis (this will be my first "large" format printer) and I'm a little intimidated by all the issues the iPF5000 seems to have. Anything that gets a wiki devoted to it for troubleshooting is a bit of a red light.
For those using the Canon, do you have long term impressions? For a casual printer (that's me) is it a little overkill? It seems it can be difficult to get the papers settings to jive with 3rd-party papers, is this still a problem.
Next year will probably be 'new printer' year for me too. I currently am printing with an Epson 7600 & 9600 and have very good results. Rene has been having great results with the new HP self profiling printer. I know next year when I am shopping I will be considering that printer as well.
Rene - you wanna pipe in with your experiences?
RichieV
Posted by Mel Ladewig on December 7, 2007 at 2:36 PM
Kalin has the iPF 5000, perhaps he'll pop in about that. I was talking with him about it yesterday and didn't sound like he was having nearly the trouble some have experienced with the printer.
As it stands right now, the 3800 is the most appealing balance of ease of use, cost of purchase and operating cost for me.
But Kalin brought up a good point. For many papers, if they are available on a roll, the cost will be much less than cut sheets. That said, you can always buy roll paper and then cut it yourself before feeding it to the 3800.
Mel
Posted by Jack Garrett on December 7, 2007 at 2:46 PM
Gary Haines uses Epsons in his gallery up in Georgetown. He seems very pleased with them. I've seen the images and they really "pop".
Posted by Jesse Speer on December 7, 2007 at 3:25 PM
Posted by Merle Cook on December 7, 2007 at 3:58 PM
I have been using an Epson 2200 until converting to MAC. There are no drivers for the 2200 to the Leopard OS. I received input from Mel and a couple of others and have ordered the 3800. If you order prior to the 21st through B&H, the standard printer is normally $1295 but has a $100 instant reduction. then through Epson, if you order over $50 in paper, they will send you another $150. In the end I will buy the 3800 and $50 in paper plus shipping for $1153. Not a bad deal even with my lousy math skills.
Posted by Todd Caudle on December 7, 2007 at 4:19 PM
...I'm a little intimidated by all the issues the iPF5000 seems to have...
I think you answered your own question as to which printer to buy.
I have a positive Epson customer service story I'll be relating soon, but want to let the entire transaction play out before I mention it, lest I jinx myself.
Posted by Scott Bacon on December 7, 2007 at 5:30 PM
Kalin, Rene, Rich and I did an Epson 4000/7600, Canon iPF5000, HP Z3100 print comparison last year at the RMNP shindig. We used common digital files, similar papers, custom printer/paper profiles (provided by Rich) and created 2 color and 1 B&W 16"x20" prints from each printer.
While there were some slight differences, here and there, in tonal and color fidelity, I don't believe a clear "winner" emerged based purely on print quality. All the prints were of very high quality. Unfortunately the Epson 3800 had recently been released, so it wasn't included. But I think you, and others, raised important points when considering a serious printer purchase - cost of ink/paper/maintenance, reliability, customer service, etc., etc.
Seeing the prints, in person, generated considerable interest and anyone interested got to compare prints side-by-side and make their own judgments base on their own personal preferences. Maybe someone would be interested in coordinating a similar "print off" for the next shindig? It could be done with the Epson 3800 instead of my "RichieV-Hand-Me-Down-Outdated-Technology-But-Still-Prints-Great-For-Me" Epson 4000.
Thanks for the input. I'm thinking that the Epson is probably more my speed.
And thanks for the tip on the rebate Merle, that make a bit of a difference.
Cheers,
Alex
Posted by Nat Coalson on December 7, 2007 at 9:19 PM
I think the most important factor in choosing a new printer is one that has both matte and photo black inks at the same time. All the latest printers from Epson, Canon and HP are capable of producing exceptional prints if you know what you're doing. Custom profiles are a must.
Posted by Kalin Wilson on December 8, 2007 at 4:14 PM
Alex,
I've had the iPF5000 for almost a year and I LOVE it. I have not had ANY of the maintenance issues that the wiki discusses. The only minor frustration I've had is keeping the printer settings in sync with the driver settings but that never hampered my printing and that is non an issue anymore as the driver settings will override the printer. The driver and printer interface is different that Epson which I think caused most of the issues for other fine art printers. I've used Canon printers for years and the learning curve was not very steep for me.
When I made my decision it was based on being able to switch between gloss and matte media without incurring a $70+ ink swap and being able to print on roll-media. The 3800 and HP Z3100 were not out at the time. But based on some of what I've read on Luminous Landscape, I don't regret my decision at all.
Canon didn't do themselves any favors with some bad warranty and service policies issued early in the iPF5000's life. But as you see on the wiki, that seems to have been corrected. Again, I haven't had to deal with bad cartridges, heads, roll feed, etc.
The print quality I get is top-notch and I'd put it up against any other printer. I agree with Scott that the differences are minor between the various units if you use good color management, quality images, and top-end paper. I like the Canon 12-color ink system and I think I get an edge in greens and blues which plays into my landscape images. I also like the fact that Canon provides a 12-bit printing path which yeilds better gradations that when printing through the windows 8-bit driver path. If you're using Mac this may not be the same issue.
Since you're in Denver, I'd suggest trying to get a look at some of these printers. You're more than welcome to come see the 5000 at my place (just a short drive to the Springs area) and I'm sure some of the other guys would like to show off their epsons.
Really, it's hard to go wrong. I think the lack of roll-media really hurts the 3800 (I'd hate to have to cut roll stock to get its savings) but Epson has a long-standing reputation and the 3800 has a good print reputation. The new Canon series (5100,6100, etc) corrected some of the issues with the 5000 and added a new black ink formulation. They're getting good reviews. The price on the 5000 is pretty attractive. In fact I've thought about getting another 5000 just for the spare parts and ink if I had anywhere to store it. Ink, paper, other consumables are the real budget killers.
Good luck. Give me a call (email me for the number) if you'd like to get more details!
Posted by Rene Pirolt on December 8, 2007 at 5:03 PM
Alex - I have the HP Z3100 and have been very satisfied with the printer. If you want specific information on the machine feel free to shoot me an email.
Posted by Scott Bacon on December 8, 2007 at 6:51 PM
Rene wrote:
I have the HP Z3100 and have been very satisfied with the printer.
I knew that I probably got the model # of Rene's printer wrong in my previous post above - fixed now...
Posted by Bill Pelzmann on December 8, 2007 at 8:50 PM
Kalin Wriote:
I think the lack of roll-media really hurts the 3800 (I'd hate to have to cut roll stock to get its savings)
I use rolls for my Epson 3800. Although it would be nice not to have to manually cut the lengths, I don't find it a big problem.
I've been very happy with the 3800. Not a single clog since buying it last Feb.
Of course the Houston humidity might help with the clogging - nothing dries fast here.
The Epson service center was exceptional!
Mine arrived DOA - print head flopped lose during shipping and was trashed.
I called on a Friday afternoon & they had a replacement model sitting on my desk Monday morning!
Got a free set of ink cartridges in that deal !
Wow, thanks for all the info guys. I'm solidly back on the fence. Now I'm tempted to save a bit more and start considering the 5100 and the 3880. Darn, maybe this will need to wait for tax refund time. Now, about Christmas, I'm looking at these lens . . . . .
The Canon has much better specs but from what I hear their support is non-existent and if anything goes wrong you could be in a lot of pain. At one point even the maintainer of the iPF5000 wiki issued a "do not buy" recommendation for it until Canon addresses some issues. I'm not sure if Canon ever did though so it may be worth doing some more research.
After going through this process myself a while back, I ended up buying an Epson 4800.
Discussion
16 repliesI'm on the verge of buying a printer and I've been looking at both the Epson 3800 or the Canon iPF5000. The Epson was my first choice, but the prices on the iPF5000 are really dropping right now so I'm starting to waffle.
I'm not printing on a regular basis (this will be my first "large" format printer) and I'm a little intimidated by all the issues the iPF5000 seems to have. Anything that gets a wiki devoted to it for troubleshooting is a bit of a red light.
For those using the Canon, do you have long term impressions? For a casual printer (that's me) is it a little overkill? It seems it can be difficult to get the papers settings to jive with 3rd-party papers, is this still a problem.
Thanks for any help,
Alex
Next year will probably be 'new printer' year for me too. I currently am printing with an Epson 7600 & 9600 and have very good results. Rene has been having great results with the new HP self profiling printer. I know next year when I am shopping I will be considering that printer as well.
Rene - you wanna pipe in with your experiences?
RichieV
As it stands right now, the 3800 is the most appealing balance of ease of use, cost of purchase and operating cost for me.
But Kalin brought up a good point. For many papers, if they are available on a roll, the cost will be much less than cut sheets. That said, you can always buy roll paper and then cut it yourself before feeding it to the 3800.
Mel
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/printers/IPF5000-report.shtml
I think you answered your own question as to which printer to buy.
I have a positive Epson customer service story I'll be relating soon, but want to let the entire transaction play out before I mention it, lest I jinx myself.
While there were some slight differences, here and there, in tonal and color fidelity, I don't believe a clear "winner" emerged based purely on print quality. All the prints were of very high quality. Unfortunately the Epson 3800 had recently been released, so it wasn't included. But I think you, and others, raised important points when considering a serious printer purchase - cost of ink/paper/maintenance, reliability, customer service, etc., etc.
Seeing the prints, in person, generated considerable interest and anyone interested got to compare prints side-by-side and make their own judgments base on their own personal preferences. Maybe someone would be interested in coordinating a similar "print off" for the next shindig? It could be done with the Epson 3800 instead of my "RichieV-Hand-Me-Down-Outdated-Technology-But-Still-Prints-Great-For-Me" Epson 4000.
You ready for my 7600 yet?
RV
Thanks for the input. I'm thinking that the Epson is probably more my speed.
And thanks for the tip on the rebate Merle, that make a bit of a difference.
Cheers,
Alex
I've had the iPF5000 for almost a year and I LOVE it. I have not had ANY of the maintenance issues that the wiki discusses. The only minor frustration I've had is keeping the printer settings in sync with the driver settings but that never hampered my printing and that is non an issue anymore as the driver settings will override the printer. The driver and printer interface is different that Epson which I think caused most of the issues for other fine art printers. I've used Canon printers for years and the learning curve was not very steep for me.
When I made my decision it was based on being able to switch between gloss and matte media without incurring a $70+ ink swap and being able to print on roll-media. The 3800 and HP Z3100 were not out at the time. But based on some of what I've read on Luminous Landscape, I don't regret my decision at all.
Canon didn't do themselves any favors with some bad warranty and service policies issued early in the iPF5000's life. But as you see on the wiki, that seems to have been corrected. Again, I haven't had to deal with bad cartridges, heads, roll feed, etc.
The print quality I get is top-notch and I'd put it up against any other printer. I agree with Scott that the differences are minor between the various units if you use good color management, quality images, and top-end paper. I like the Canon 12-color ink system and I think I get an edge in greens and blues which plays into my landscape images. I also like the fact that Canon provides a 12-bit printing path which yeilds better gradations that when printing through the windows 8-bit driver path. If you're using Mac this may not be the same issue.
Since you're in Denver, I'd suggest trying to get a look at some of these printers. You're more than welcome to come see the 5000 at my place (just a short drive to the Springs area) and I'm sure some of the other guys would like to show off their epsons.
Really, it's hard to go wrong. I think the lack of roll-media really hurts the 3800 (I'd hate to have to cut roll stock to get its savings) but Epson has a long-standing reputation and the 3800 has a good print reputation. The new Canon series (5100,6100, etc) corrected some of the issues with the 5000 and added a new black ink formulation. They're getting good reviews. The price on the 5000 is pretty attractive. In fact I've thought about getting another 5000 just for the spare parts and ink if I had anywhere to store it. Ink, paper, other consumables are the real budget killers.
Good luck. Give me a call (email me for the number) if you'd like to get more details!
I use rolls for my Epson 3800. Although it would be nice not to have to manually cut the lengths, I don't find it a big problem.
I've been very happy with the 3800. Not a single clog since buying it last Feb.
Of course the Houston humidity might help with the clogging - nothing dries fast here.
The Epson service center was exceptional!
Mine arrived DOA - print head flopped lose during shipping and was trashed.
I called on a Friday afternoon & they had a replacement model sitting on my desk Monday morning!
Got a free set of ink cartridges in that deal !
Thanks again,
Alex
After going through this process myself a while back, I ended up buying an Epson 4800.
Guy