Hi,
I`ve had another request to use one of my pictures by a `not-for-profit` organisation, this time from the British Mountaineering Council, who want to use a Chough shot for a poster. Should I comply with their request, and look on it as free publicity, or send them to Alamy where they can buy it (or not) for a sensible price?
Do you folks who sell your pictures give them away to not-for-profits?
Interested in your thoughts.
Cheers,
Posted by David Kjaer on January 3, 2008 at 12:54 PM
Hi Jeremy
I am happy to reduce my fee to 'not for profit' organisations but I will no longer give images away. Depending on it's use for these organisations I will go as low as £25 per image but as a general rule no lower.
I'm willing to bet the person who contacted you is paid a salary by the organisation so why should a photographer be any different.
Will they let you on there courses for free, give you free instruction, or give you free membership? Probably not.
By all means reduce the price - but if they are not your 'pet' charity not by that far.
This type of approach by 'NFP's' is getting more and more common, it's a pity the camera aren't getting any cheaper nor is the petrol to get there.
Unless you can work out a 'barter', I would charge.
T
Posted by Nigel Blake on January 3, 2008 at 1:48 PM
I think that once you let people use images for free they will always expect them for free, charge a fee, picture credits and web links won't pay for a new camera (that 40D) or the mortgage!!
i think it depends very largely on whether or not you agree with the aims of the NFP. if you had just won a competition run by the magazine/body, and the prize was a front cover (i'm guessing some still do this), would you be chuffed because you won the competition and not worried about not getting a fee? or, maybe you are spearheading a "save the chough" campaign and this would bring recognition for their plight (i know nothing of choughs by the way) so a dontation for you would help the cause, and get you publicity. fair enough, if it's not something you are involved/interested in, then you should charge a fee, or let someone else lose money by donating an image.
mark
Posted by Peter Barritt on January 3, 2008 at 3:35 PM
BUPA is not for profit and public schools are the same if I remember rightly. Charities and wildlife rescue centres are a different matter.
Alamy charge much reduced fees for educational and charitable purchasers. Run it through the Alamy calculator and sell it with a 30% discount if they deal directly with you. Peter
Posted by Sean Bolton on January 3, 2008 at 4:28 PM
Hi Jeremy
It's up to you in my opinion. People do unpaid volunteer work all the time for charitable type organisations so you could view your donation of a photograph as effectively a contribution to the organisation.
I have 'given away' a few images to charitable organisations, and also done some 'free' commissioned work, although mainly because my wife tells me too.
Sometimes a freebie upfront can lead to further paid or commissioned work in the future. My experience is that it is a good way of developing contacts and they don't all just assume that any future images or work will be free.
Again, your call in my opinion. There is no right answer on this one.
Jeremy,
Go with the suggestion from Peter, it worked for me on two occasions, and they do have a budget for advertising no matter what they say.
Posted by Elliott Neep on January 4, 2008 at 3:35 AM
Hi Jeremy. When I started out, I was happy to give images away freely, believing I was doing myself a favour and getting publicity - but it doesn't really work like that. The reciprocal favour is quickly forgotten (sorry if I sound cynical). The majority of NPOs and NGOs have marketing budgets but they will still ask/expect a freebie as its the cheapest option for them - it is just business sense. Now, I have two pet charities, the EIA and The Wildlife Trusts, to which I offer big discounts. Everyone else pays. The more photographers that offer their images freely, the tougher it is for all of us to make a living in a very tough and competitive industry. If you don't feel comfortable asking for a full fee, then discount, but ask for something.
Posted by eric weight on January 4, 2008 at 7:19 AM
'Not for Profit' doesn't mean 'Not Having To Pay The Bills' does it?
You aren't a NPO and no mountaineering organisation is going to bail you out when you can't pay your council tax. Discount it as much as you like if it is something you would want to send money too anyway, but if you wouldn't give them cash, I wouldn't give them your pics.
I also don't think that a NPO is quite the same as a worthy cause. Didn't Richard Branson want to run the lottery as an NPO? Would you give them to Railtrack?
Just my opinion.
Give us it for free and you may get lots of future work - oldest one in the book I'm afraid. Eric.
Posted by Matt Doggett on January 4, 2008 at 11:40 AM
Hi Jeremy, I with most others on this - it really depends on how you view the organisation. I donate pictures to just a couple of organisations - the rest are for sale. If an NPO, charity etc came to me asking that I had no real affliation to or deep feeling for then I would be asking for money. If they really want your picture then the money will come from somewhere
I'd say if your wondering whether to charge them, charge them. If you want to help any charity charge them for the picture, then donate the money. This not only makes people remember that pictures are worth something it means they get more money if you donate it in the right way.
Thanks for your useful comments. I think I will ask the guy who has contacted me to go to Alamy (where the image is for sale) and see if they can negotiate a sensible fee with them. Failing that, I`ll offer him a slightly discounted rate, and see what he says. Will let you know what happens.
If you do give the image to the charity (as I sometimes do with a few that I support - I like their work, and I get the exposure) then I'd strongly suggest you send a proper invoice with the full realistic cost of your work detailed, then adding (subtracting) the appropriate % discount up to 100%. With this include precise and unambiguous usage instructions and full copyright and caption credit info.
This way they know the value of what you do. They will (should) respect you and your work. And if they subsequently misuse the work (which sometimes happens) then you have them over a barrel and will be able to extract a full fee and compensation from them.
Giving work for 'free' does not necessarily imply giving up all your rights, nor any reciprocal benefits.
Discussion
13 repliesI`ve had another request to use one of my pictures by a `not-for-profit` organisation, this time from the British Mountaineering Council, who want to use a Chough shot for a poster. Should I comply with their request, and look on it as free publicity, or send them to Alamy where they can buy it (or not) for a sensible price?
Do you folks who sell your pictures give them away to not-for-profits?
Interested in your thoughts.
Cheers,
I am happy to reduce my fee to 'not for profit' organisations but I will no longer give images away. Depending on it's use for these organisations I will go as low as £25 per image but as a general rule no lower.
I'm willing to bet the person who contacted you is paid a salary by the organisation so why should a photographer be any different.
David
Will they let you on there courses for free, give you free instruction, or give you free membership? Probably not.
By all means reduce the price - but if they are not your 'pet' charity not by that far.
This type of approach by 'NFP's' is getting more and more common, it's a pity the camera aren't getting any cheaper nor is the petrol to get there.
Unless you can work out a 'barter', I would charge.
T
i think it depends very largely on whether or not you agree with the aims of the NFP. if you had just won a competition run by the magazine/body, and the prize was a front cover (i'm guessing some still do this), would you be chuffed because you won the competition and not worried about not getting a fee? or, maybe you are spearheading a "save the chough" campaign and this would bring recognition for their plight (i know nothing of choughs by the way) so a dontation for you would help the cause, and get you publicity. fair enough, if it's not something you are involved/interested in, then you should charge a fee, or let someone else lose money by donating an image.
mark
Alamy charge much reduced fees for educational and charitable purchasers. Run it through the Alamy calculator and sell it with a 30% discount if they deal directly with you.
It's up to you in my opinion. People do unpaid volunteer work all the time for charitable type organisations so you could view your donation of a photograph as effectively a contribution to the organisation.
I have 'given away' a few images to charitable organisations, and also done some 'free' commissioned work, although mainly because my wife tells me too.
Sometimes a freebie upfront can lead to further paid or commissioned work in the future. My experience is that it is a good way of developing contacts and they don't all just assume that any future images or work will be free.
Again, your call in my opinion. There is no right answer on this one.
regards
Sean
Go with the suggestion from Peter, it worked for me on two occasions, and they do have a budget for advertising no matter what they say.
You aren't a NPO and no mountaineering organisation is going to bail you out when you can't pay your council tax. Discount it as much as you like if it is something you would want to send money too anyway, but if you wouldn't give them cash, I wouldn't give them your pics.
I also don't think that a NPO is quite the same as a worthy cause. Didn't Richard Branson want to run the lottery as an NPO? Would you give them to Railtrack?
Just my opinion.
Give us it for free and you may get lots of future work - oldest one in the book I'm afraid.
Cheers
Matt
This way they know the value of what you do. They will (should) respect you and your work. And if they subsequently misuse the work (which sometimes happens) then you have them over a barrel and will be able to extract a full fee and compensation from them.
Giving work for 'free' does not necessarily imply giving up all your rights, nor any reciprocal benefits.