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canon 40d + 1-400mm = sharpness problems

Discussion

14 replies
Posted by dan elster on February 12, 2008 at 5:27 PM
canon 40d + 1-400mm = sharpness problems
I'd love any opinions on this:

For several years, the only gear I ever used was a Canon 10D and a 1-400mm canon IS lense. My techniques have always been a bit on the "casual" side meaning I like to handhold when possible, but usually know when a tripod is in order. I shoot almost exclusively birds and wildlife. While I've taken plenty of soft images in my day, I've taken plenty of razor sharp ones too. Generally speaking, I'm confident handholding @ 1/250 of a second.
Enter my first real upgrade: a 40D

I bought one of these not long after they came out. I was pumped! After shooting a bunch, I started to notice some shots I was sure I "nailed" were way soft. I kept making excuses, tightened up my technique(even using a tripod here and there), but I was still not getting the % of keepers I was used to..

I sent both my 1-400mm and 40d back to Canon hoping they would calibrate both. In the mean time, I borrowed a 300f2.8 from my lab and used it w/ my 10D and got great results.

A month later I got my stuff back from Canon....They acknowledged problems with both.

W/ the 40D, the repair sheet said "the adjustment of the pcb assembly was incorrect causing soft focus. Electrical adjustments were carried out on the pcb assembly. Other adjustments and inspection and cleaning were carried out"

W/ the 1-400mm IS: the repair sheet said "The mechanical chasis had been modified. The part was damaged. The mechanical chassis was replaced. Other adjustments, cleaning and parts replacements were carried out."

I went out shooting and....

I'm still not convinced things are working properly. I've gotten a few sharp ones here and there, but still on several occasions, been dissappointed w/ the results. To further complicate matters, I tried the 40D w/ the 300mm f2.8 and for the first time ever the 40D made some sharp images-but even w/ this lense, I'm questioning this camera. I've also put the 1-400mm on a 10D(my original tried and trued combo) and things seemed great.

Questions:
The owner of my photo lab(same guy who sold me the 40D and lent me the 300mm 2.8 seems to think that the 40D much higher resolution is revealing flaws in the 1-400mm that were not revealed using the lower res 10D. I know the 1-400 has gotten mixed reviews for sharpness issues in the past, but not by me. Is this possible?
I'm posting one image here, unsharpened, slightly cropped and lightened up that came from the 40D, 1-400 combo. This redtail hawk sat still for a couple of minutes and I was able to refocus several times. If you can't tell by this post, trust me, no amoung of sharpening will fix ths. I was handholding w/ a shutter speed of 1/4000 of a second at 5.6. I can handhold that in my sleep.

Is my 40D useless w/ the 1-400?
Any thoughts greatly appreciated.



Posted by Ed Cordes on February 12, 2008 at 6:37 PM
I have not heard of any particular issues with this combination.
Posted by Patricia Brundage on February 12, 2008 at 7:04 PM
Have you accidently shifted the stablization mode to 2 on the 100-400, or the distance to 6.5m. Either one would make it focus in certain situations, but not in others.

As far as the Canon labs, when my 75-300 IS feature failed, their efforts were useless although they said it was fixed. Sent it back twice before they repaired it properly.
Posted by dan elster on February 12, 2008 at 7:09 PM
Thanks for the replies. As far as the settings on the IS and focus, I've been careful about both. Someone just sent me a link to another nature photography site with a long thread about the 40D not being sharp. It's starting to look like I'm on to something. Would still love any input anyone has.



Posted by Zack Schnepf on February 12, 2008 at 9:55 PM
I used to own the 100-400L and found the image quality to be pretty bad. I was using a 20D at the time. My biggest complaint was that I had to shoot between f/5.6-f/11 to get anything half decent, and even then I was not very impressed. Above f/11 or so the lens turned to absolute garbage.

I traded it in for a 70-200L instead, as a landscape photographer this was a great choice. I would highly recommend the 400mm f/5.6 prime, that is an awesome lens when it comes to cost and sharpness, no IS but an amazing value IMO.

The problem you're having may be unrelated to the lens quality, but that was my experience with that lens.
Posted by David Bostedo on February 12, 2008 at 11:35 PM
I don't have any specific advice on that equipment, but I'm assuming you saw the thread on NatureScapes? What I haven't seen there that might be worth trying is quickly grabbing focus as you would with a bird, but on something that would easily show you if it's front or back focusing. There was some speculation that missing focusing wasn't the problem as much as just not focusing - not even being close. Not sure if it's possible, but something that shows how close the focus is might help show exactly what kind of problem you're having. Good luck...
Posted by Grant Davey on February 13, 2008 at 3:16 AM
I use a 100-400 with a 350D for wildlife photography and when the bird or whatever is quite far away I can't get really sharp images - similar to your example, although maybe not quite as bad. When close, they are great (even when using 400mm) - is this the same with your camera? I have put this down to the I suppose rather primitive autofocus with the old camera. I was hoping upgrading to a 40D would fix this, but maybe not.
Posted by John Krepp on February 13, 2008 at 6:41 AM
I have a 40D and 100-400 lens. I also have a 20D and the lens is sharp on both bodies. I try to use a tripod when I can but my hand held shots are excellent. I also shoot aircraft hand held panning with no problems. If you are not happy then send it back to Canon again - it's a a pain being without the camera but it's worth the peace of mind.
Posted by Andy Mason on February 13, 2008 at 6:54 AM
Funny how comments can vary, I have the 100-400 and on my old 20D thought my images could have been sharper, I now have a 40D with the same lens, and I think my images are a lot sharper than with the 20D. I never use IS, shoot manual mode in less than idea conditions (almost always f6.3@1/250) otherwise aperture priority for brighter conditions. In general am happier with the 40D/100-400 combo than with the 20D with a lot more % keepers.
Maybe try staying away from f5.6 and if you can get reasonable shutter speeds turn off IS.
BTW, the 100-400 has probably been on a tripod 3 times in 4 years.
Regards...Andy
Posted by John Krepp on February 13, 2008 at 8:07 AM
Can you rule out technique? Andy, I don't understand why you wouldn't use IS for hand held shots? IS is the best feature of this lens. For birds hand held (static) I use IS mode 1, single shot AF, centre focus sensor. For moving targets like BIF or aircraft I use IS mode 2 and Servo, centre focus sensor. You must keep the shutter speed up at least the same as the focal length you are using ie if you are at 400mm then 1/400 sec. For moving objects you need much higher shutter speeds. You can shoot at lower shutter speeds with a tripod but I still use IS mode 1. You can use lower shutter speeds hand held but it is hit and miss. I use aperture priority f/8 is a good number (seems to be the sweet spot) and adjust the ISO to suit.
I also use a Kenko 1.5 T/C with the combo. The T/C works better with the 20D in low light situations if you want to use AF. With the 40D it needs to be in bright light for the AF to work. AF is better than my old eyes I'm afraid.
I hope this helps - just my 2 cents worth.
John
Posted by Kyle Quattromani on February 13, 2008 at 9:30 AM
My 100-400 puts out really sharp images. I've not been disappointed at all, and I'm shooting on a Rebel XT.

It is possible that you got a lemon I guess? Not everything that comes out of a factory will be spot on I'm sure. Maybe you should call Canon with your dilemma, see what they have to say? I don't see why your setup would cause soft images.
Posted by Rajesh Mohan on February 14, 2008 at 2:26 AM
my friend has the same issue - 40D with 70-200 2.8. I saw the same softness (as seen in the pic) when shooting birds. However, when he used manual focusing the pictures were sharp. I think a round trip to canon factory might help.

Posted by Rajesh Mohan on February 14, 2008 at 2:29 AM
your point about higher resolution exposing the weakness of the lens is an interesting thought. I will experiment a bit and see what I get.
Posted by Pat Watts on February 15, 2008 at 6:02 AM
I don't have the experience or the equipment most of you mention, but for a number of years I have had problems with soft shots, though I get some that are nice and sharp. I have used different cameras, on tripods, and have sent some back for repair. Now I have the Rebel XTi and a Canon 100-400 IS lens. Recently when I went back to the manual I realized that the camera does not come equipped to shoot sharp pictures right out of the box - there are some setting changes that must be made to improve the sharpness and saturation within the camera. I have no idea why the camera isn't set for the sharpest image, but they list the simple instructions under "advanced" features in the manual. I recently made the changes and have just started experimenting with them. I don't recall anyone ever mentioning this simple fix, but I'm anxious to see what happens! I would love to use manual focus, but as age creeps up, my eyes don't focus well enough (even with glasses) to be able to shoot birds without a little help.

I'd like to hear comments from anyone who has experimented with these internal settings. :smile:
Posted by dan elster on February 15, 2008 at 10:46 AM
Thanks for all of the input.

Pat, the 40D does come w/ a "sharpness setting and I've tried it at every different level of sharpnesss.

Rajesh: from what I've heard the 70-200mm is a really sharp lense, so to hear you have a friend having the same issues further convinces me it's the camera,not the lense.

Kyle, I'm w/ you...I think I got a lemon. As soon as I put 1-400 back on a 10D, I start getting really sharp images again.

John, I've gotten to the point I've over analyzed my technique. Cable releases, shutter lock, all sorts of things I shouldn't, a never had to do in the field before.

Grant, distant subjects are tough to get really sharp w/ 1-400 but I think that's a different story

David, thanks for sending me over to Naturescapes. That thread backs up everything I've thought, the same exact problems.

Where does this leave me? I flat out decided that Canon needs to replace this camera. My photo lab and Canon dealer backed me up and I should have a replacement next week. I'm not sure what I think about Canon right now, but I really like my local photo lab(Advanced Photo Imaging) in Ashland.