Hi All, I have just joined and put in a couple of images. What I really need is advise please. I have been looking at all your submissions and I must say envious, it looks like most of you guys go out most days but I have to go to work (Electrician) and only get to go weekends and then the weather is always well nearly always against me. Hopefully Spring and Summer will soon be here will get out in the evenings.How do you go about getting these pictures. Help please.
Posted by Major Gilbert on March 18, 2008 at 6:15 PM
I too normally only manage to get weekends to do my photography. Sometimes that is from Saturday lunch time onwards. It does seem at times that weekends are always bad weather wise. However I do have a very understanding wife and because we work together during the week I am able to give that day and a half my full attention.
I used to let the weather put me off but now I just go come rain or shine.
The other thing is that being out early is a must. The early bird catches the worm so to speak, and the other half of the day can also be very productive. Other thing is to get some sites or objectives ligned up. Going on the off chance is not going to fare very well most of the time. Talk to people and get to know what is about etc.
Major.
Posted by Chris Lloyd on March 18, 2008 at 6:19 PM
I think Major has covered most of my points. Many of the peeps here have full time jobs with only a few being able to devote their full attention to photography, either through it being their job or being retired.
I think knowing your local patch is invaluable as many of our best pics are taken close to home as you can revisit the location when the time is right.
Chris.
Posted by Paul Ashton on March 18, 2008 at 6:41 PM
Agree with all of the above. The early bird catches the worm in the best light.
Welcome to the forum . Agree with the above. The best thing you can do is search your local patch, even if you are based in a city, you will most likely have foxes, squirrels and a local park with waterfowl, if you are in a big city you may even have peregrine. I work full time mon-fri spend sat with my family then have sunday if i want to go out togging
Yeah it's a nightmare isn't it!!! Should do portrait photography in a studio
I too like you and many others struggle for time due to full time job and battle against the weather and I have very young children, so it's pretty hard at the moment. A bit discouraged all in all at the moment but I'm sure I'll get through it Agree with Major and Chris
Posted by John Robinson on March 18, 2008 at 7:25 PM
The other thing is you could get old like me and have all the time you need before you get the chest pains.
I would advise building a hide at a feeding station or some other spot and concentrating on it. You would be surprised at what turns up at one small spot if you go there regularly.
.
Cheers
JohnR
I agree with John, utilise all the time you can at a local patch develop a feeding station and concentrate, you realy do not know what will turn up. And early is the catch word here.
cheers
Posted by Simon Litten on March 18, 2008 at 8:55 PM
Hi Richard
Another idea is - if possible - make sure your route to work takes you past a wildlife friendly area and set off an hour earlier (with your camera of course!) and try again on your way home. Can prove fruitful somedays.
Also, if the weather isn't photographer friendly (which to be honest is most days!) it's still worth going out with just binoculars and scouting a few areas and seeing what's about. Learning how your target species behaves is half the battle.
At least from the responses so far you can take heart that most of us are in the same boat - from now until October I'll be working seven days a week and it's going to be hard dragging myself out of bed at half-four in the morning, getting camo'd up and going out to crouch in a hedge for three hours! But when the wildlife performs for you...there's no better feeling.
Simon
PS The guys on this forum post a lot of quality pictures, but every one, without exception, has days when, after spending hours in the field, return home without pressing the shutter button. But you've got to be stubborn and keep going out again and again...You'll only get results if you put the hours in.
Posted by eric weight on March 19, 2008 at 1:48 AM
Hi Richard,
There is no point in covering what everybody else has written, especially as I agree with it all and it is all sound advice; but you might be interested to know what it took me ages to realise.
A lot of small bird photography is studio standard because it is carried out in outdoor studio conditions. That is to say a feeder will probably be just out of shot, the perch is a lone, photogenic branch cut from somewhere else and positioned right next to it, so that the subject has nowhere else to sit and even the background may be a camo net hung up in the trees some distance behind. This is not a criticismn of any of these techniques, but coming into wildlife photography as a newbie, I had naievely believed that people just wandered about snapping whatever they saw and had never even considered this approach.
Some of the best images on here are from people who seem to specialise in certain subjects or techniques and accept anything else that comes along as a bonus. I don't think that this is a bad way to approach it either, there is no substitute for understanding your quarry. It is much more time consuming than sorting out the hardware and means that when you do get time, you can go straight to work rather than looking for a subject first. In short - PLANNING.
I think you might be surprised to know how many shots the best photographers on here put straight in the bin as well.
Hope this helps. Eric
Posted by Andy Astbury on March 19, 2008 at 5:01 AM
I wasn't going to comment on this thread because it's hardly my place - doing 'this thing' every day, but the last two posts sparked my to do so.
Simons PS firstly - I for one never return home without having something on a card. But there's plenty of times believe me when I have nothing of what I intended.
We all have to make every effort to make the most of our time in the field, and if that time is severely limited like a lot of guys 'n gals on the forum then efficiency of time management is more crucial to you than me.
The number of times I go out to specifically photograph a particular subject only to find the wind in the wrong direction for the sun angle, the subject in the one place where close approach is impossible, or the subject just plain bloody absent from the scene certainly make up a good 50% of my days.
But you need to be an 'opportunist' - if the big tele has 'no customers' then there WILL be a 'macro opportunity' or a glorious landscape to be had, but if you haven't got the gear with you then your time is wasted.
Local knowledge as has already been alluded to is of vital importance, as is the development of a feed station or two - these can come in very handy once established, not only can they be a chosen 'target for today' but they can also be an emergency card filler when you run the risk of a blank on other subjects.
Yesterday in fact, I went out purposefully to photograph GCG's but when I got to the venue the area which should have been in wind shadow WASN'T but the grebes were all there because that's where the food is. The wood that surrounds the lake was was making the wind swirl in a way I hadn't anticipated - the chop on the water would make the images look bad, so I imediately changed tack and dropped on to a feed station a few hundred yards away - which leads nicely to Erics observation.
I shot 2 and a half cards full - about 500 images with the D300 running in CH mode at 8fps. Do this and you stand a chance of capturing those great little poses that small birds do all the time but are gone in the blink of an eye.
Shooting at these frame rates it only takes 60 birds to turn up, and on a busy feeder that can happen in an hour, and you've got 500 images in the can.
Out of those 500, by 10pm last night that was down to 71 keepers - that to me is a result because it's 71 potentially saleable images that I didn't have when I woke up yesterday morning.
Richard - there is little difference in between those like yourself with little time and other who do it full-time, save for one thing - your time is more precious if anything, and you need to be more of an opportunist than they do.
Its all about applying yourself and making the best use of the available time... although I am a full time photographer I am studio based in London which means that I too am limited to mainly weekends.... I do not use feeding stations simply because of the time I have to leave for work and the time I get home means that I would not be able to maintain them over winter so if I am after small birds I will frequent a country park where they are fed on a regular basis and it is possible to exploit that with a small feeder set up....
I do find that planning is important, although since I lost my wife to cancer last year that hasn't been the easiest thing and I have often gone out on opportunist shoots... but I am now starting to get better at the planning and am working a couple of projects at the moment, I have even started to put together submissions that I should have been doing 6 months ago...
My advice would be to use the available time to best advantage, if it is pouring down and grey, go out and recce possible locations that you can return to when conditions are right, keep a notebook with sketches and light directions etc that you can refer to when the conditions are better....
It is very rare that I go home with nothing, but like Andy it may not have been my quarry for the day.....
All the best
Phil
(hope that made sense as I typed this rather rapidly, have an important job to do for the next few weeks.... )
Posted by Paul Inglis on March 19, 2008 at 6:50 AM
Hi Richard,
A lot of ground has already been covered here and I’ll try not to go over the same. For me I live in a more remote place and wildlife appears to be in abundance especially birds for which Ornithologists the world over have long come to recognise a reputation well deserved.
But photographing them is yet another story, for example;
It is common knowledge that the Isle of Man has one of the most successful population’s of Hen Harriers in the British Isles. This equates roughly to one bird for every square mile! The IOM is home to the largest winter roosting site in Europe, but to just turn up and start taking pictures isn’t possible. Even when located, many difficulties arise – time spent researching helps to increase the chances of success! Now I have plenty of local knowledge, especially with these birds but they haven’t be playing ball of late and I’m back to square one with one of the sites but with perseverance and sheer determination I’ll get the shots I’m after eventually. When I do nobody will know how much I’ve put into them.
In order to have nice images you need to grab every opportunity as they arise. So, since I’ve had little success with the Hen Harriers, rather than get disheartened I been spending time on two other projects of mine.
SHOOTING ON A LIMITED TIME SCALE
Below are two very simple projects that allow me too shoot when I’ve only got an hour to spare or the weather is awful and getting about is more problematic. I can’t drive so I either walk, catch the bus (which doesn't cover the places I often want to frequent) or the train everywhere (doesn’t run from October through to March, and when it does its steam!).
Project 1
I have over 12 feeding stations in my garden which attract numerous birds. I decide to place them so close to my home for three simple reasons;
1. Allows me to monitor and top-up regardless of the weather (and in the winter over here 100 mph winds and driving rain isn't uncommon!).
2. I don’t drive so it’s easy to commit to a project like this straight out of my front door.
3. Nobody can spoil the site for me nor disturb the birds.
With this set-up I can shoot most small birds with this set-up such as Coal Tits, Blue Tits, Willow Tits, Siskin’s, Dunnock’s, House & Tree Sparrows, Robins, Blackbirds, and so on… (They know me so well now I don’t need a hide to photograph them!)
Project 2
This is still work in process and will be up and running by autumn. I am cultivating a small wildlife pond in my garden in order to photograph, birds bathing, insects, butterflies, moths, spiders, amphibians, etc…
I'm in the same situation as many - full time job - and have found that having a feeding station a great way to allow me to make the most of a spare 2-3hrs at a weekend.
a very interesting thread this and some excellent points made. I'm another who struggles to fit in photography around a full-time job and a family (with young children). It can be frustrating at times, particularly when the weather is great but I can't get out in it. I suppose I'm luckier than some because my job is fairly flexible so I can sometimes take a day off midweek. This generally means locations are quieter as well with fewer visitors than would be the case at weekends.
It's good to know that many of us are in the same position - desperately looking out of a window wishing we were out there with our cameras!!
Matt
Posted by Simon Litten on March 19, 2008 at 9:06 AM
Andy wrote:
"Simons PS firstly - I for one never return home without having something on a card."
Hi All,
Well what can I say, I am overwhelmed by the response and appreciate all your coments and will certain start to take notice and plan ahead. I am luck to live near some woods so I could make a start there only trouble it used by all the local kids in the summer so may have to look farther out. Thanks again
Posted by Paula Graham on March 19, 2008 at 6:08 PM
I know, since getting into photography, I often wonder how I would manage to work as well!
Posted by John Robinson on March 20, 2008 at 6:26 PM
Andy says -
"that to me is a result because it's 71 potentially saleable images that I didn't have when I woke up yesterday morning. "
I personally have lost interest in selling stuff. After 40 years at it I have probably realised what a waste of time it is. That's not really what its all about for me anyway.
JohnR
Discussion
21 repliesI used to let the weather put me off but now I just go come rain or shine.
The other thing is that being out early is a must. The early bird catches the worm so to speak, and the other half of the day can also be very productive. Other thing is to get some sites or objectives ligned up. Going on the off chance is not going to fare very well most of the time. Talk to people and get to know what is about etc.
Major.
I think knowing your local patch is invaluable as many of our best pics are taken close to home as you can revisit the location when the time is right.
Chris.
Welcome to the forum
Regards
Rob
Some people on here are full time photograhers, some are pensioners or various other reasons off work.
Just make the best useage of the time you do get off.
I too like you and many others struggle for time due to full time job and battle against the weather and I have very young children, so it's pretty hard at the moment. A bit discouraged all in all at the moment but I'm sure I'll get through it
I would advise building a hide at a feeding station or some other spot and concentrating on it. You would be surprised at what turns up at one small spot if you go there regularly.
.
Cheers
JohnR
cheers
Another idea is - if possible - make sure your route to work takes you past a wildlife friendly area and set off an hour earlier (with your camera of course!) and try again on your way home. Can prove fruitful somedays.
Also, if the weather isn't photographer friendly (which to be honest is most days!) it's still worth going out with just binoculars and scouting a few areas and seeing what's about. Learning how your target species behaves is half the battle.
At least from the responses so far you can take heart that most of us are in the same boat - from now until October I'll be working seven days a week and it's going to be hard dragging myself out of bed at half-four in the morning, getting camo'd up and going out to crouch in a hedge for three hours! But when the wildlife performs for you...there's no better feeling.
Simon
PS The guys on this forum post a lot of quality pictures, but every one, without exception, has days when, after spending hours in the field, return home without pressing the shutter button. But you've got to be stubborn and keep going out again and again...You'll only get results if you put the hours in.
There is no point in covering what everybody else has written, especially as I agree with it all and it is all sound advice; but you might be interested to know what it took me ages to realise.
A lot of small bird photography is studio standard because it is carried out in outdoor studio conditions. That is to say a feeder will probably be just out of shot, the perch is a lone, photogenic branch cut from somewhere else and positioned right next to it, so that the subject has nowhere else to sit and even the background may be a camo net hung up in the trees some distance behind. This is not a criticismn of any of these techniques, but coming into wildlife photography as a newbie, I had naievely believed that people just wandered about snapping whatever they saw and had never even considered this approach.
Some of the best images on here are from people who seem to specialise in certain subjects or techniques and accept anything else that comes along as a bonus. I don't think that this is a bad way to approach it either, there is no substitute for understanding your quarry. It is much more time consuming than sorting out the hardware and means that when you do get time, you can go straight to work rather than looking for a subject first. In short - PLANNING.
I think you might be surprised to know how many shots the best photographers on here put straight in the bin as well.
Hope this helps.
Simons PS firstly - I for one never return home without having something on a card. But there's plenty of times believe me when I have nothing of what I intended.
We all have to make every effort to make the most of our time in the field, and if that time is severely limited like a lot of guys 'n gals on the forum then efficiency of time management is more crucial to you than me.
The number of times I go out to specifically photograph a particular subject only to find the wind in the wrong direction for the sun angle, the subject in the one place where close approach is impossible, or the subject just plain bloody absent from the scene certainly make up a good 50% of my days.
But you need to be an 'opportunist' - if the big tele has 'no customers' then there WILL be a 'macro opportunity' or a glorious landscape to be had, but if you haven't got the gear with you then your time is wasted.
Local knowledge as has already been alluded to is of vital importance, as is the development of a feed station or two - these can come in very handy once established, not only can they be a chosen 'target for today' but they can also be an emergency card filler when you run the risk of a blank on other subjects.
Yesterday in fact, I went out purposefully to photograph GCG's but when I got to the venue the area which should have been in wind shadow WASN'T but the grebes were all there because that's where the food is. The wood that surrounds the lake was was making the wind swirl in a way I hadn't anticipated - the chop on the water would make the images look bad, so I imediately changed tack and dropped on to a feed station a few hundred yards away - which leads nicely to Erics observation.
I shot 2 and a half cards full - about 500 images with the D300 running in CH mode at 8fps. Do this and you stand a chance of capturing those great little poses that small birds do all the time but are gone in the blink of an eye.
Shooting at these frame rates it only takes 60 birds to turn up, and on a busy feeder that can happen in an hour, and you've got 500 images in the can.
Out of those 500, by 10pm last night that was down to 71 keepers - that to me is a result because it's 71 potentially saleable images that I didn't have when I woke up yesterday morning.
Richard - there is little difference in between those like yourself with little time and other who do it full-time, save for one thing - your time is more precious if anything, and you need to be more of an opportunist than they do.
That's my advice for you anyway
I do find that planning is important, although since I lost my wife to cancer last year that hasn't been the easiest thing and I have often gone out on opportunist shoots... but I am now starting to get better at the planning and am working a couple of projects at the moment, I have even started to put together submissions that I should have been doing 6 months ago...
My advice would be to use the available time to best advantage, if it is pouring down and grey, go out and recce possible locations that you can return to when conditions are right, keep a notebook with sketches and light directions etc that you can refer to when the conditions are better....
It is very rare that I go home with nothing, but like Andy it may not have been my quarry for the day.....
All the best
Phil
(hope that made sense as I typed this rather rapidly, have an important job to do for the next few weeks.... )
A lot of ground has already been covered here and I’ll try not to go over the same. For me I live in a more remote place and wildlife appears to be in abundance especially birds for which Ornithologists the world over have long come to recognise a reputation well deserved.
But photographing them is yet another story, for example;
It is common knowledge that the Isle of Man has one of the most successful population’s of Hen Harriers in the British Isles. This equates roughly to one bird for every square mile! The IOM is home to the largest winter roosting site in Europe, but to just turn up and start taking pictures isn’t possible. Even when located, many difficulties arise – time spent researching helps to increase the chances of success! Now I have plenty of local knowledge, especially with these birds but they haven’t be playing ball of late and I’m back to square one with one of the sites but with perseverance and sheer determination I’ll get the shots I’m after eventually. When I do nobody will know how much I’ve put into them.
In order to have nice images you need to grab every opportunity as they arise. So, since I’ve had little success with the Hen Harriers, rather than get disheartened I been spending time on two other projects of mine.
SHOOTING ON A LIMITED TIME SCALE
Below are two very simple projects that allow me too shoot when I’ve only got an hour to spare or the weather is awful and getting about is more problematic. I can’t drive so I either walk, catch the bus (which doesn't cover the places I often want to frequent) or the train everywhere (doesn’t run from October through to March, and when it does its steam!).
Project 1
I have over 12 feeding stations in my garden which attract numerous birds. I decide to place them so close to my home for three simple reasons;
1. Allows me to monitor and top-up regardless of the weather (and in the winter over here 100 mph winds and driving rain isn't uncommon!).
2. I don’t drive so it’s easy to commit to a project like this straight out of my front door.
3. Nobody can spoil the site for me nor disturb the birds.
With this set-up I can shoot most small birds with this set-up such as Coal Tits, Blue Tits, Willow Tits, Siskin’s, Dunnock’s, House & Tree Sparrows, Robins, Blackbirds, and so on… (They know me so well now I don’t need a hide to photograph them!)
Project 2
This is still work in process and will be up and running by autumn. I am cultivating a small wildlife pond in my garden in order to photograph, birds bathing, insects, butterflies, moths, spiders, amphibians, etc…
Happy shooting,
I'm in the same situation as many - full time job - and have found that having a feeding station a great way to allow me to make the most of a spare 2-3hrs at a weekend.
Rob
ps. Good thread on feeding stations Feeding Station Info
It's good to know that many of us are in the same position - desperately looking out of a window wishing we were out there with our cameras!!
Matt
"Simons PS firstly - I for one never return home without having something on a card."
Maybe it's just me then!!
Great thread.
Well what can I say, I am overwhelmed by the response and appreciate all your coments and will certain start to take notice and plan ahead. I am luck to live near some woods so I could make a start there only trouble it used by all the local kids in the summer so may have to look farther out. Thanks again
"that to me is a result because it's 71 potentially saleable images that I didn't have when I woke up yesterday morning. "
I personally have lost interest in selling stuff. After 40 years at it I have probably realised what a waste of time it is. That's not really what its all about for me anyway.
JohnR