Hello, I've just purchase a complete large format system (Wista 45SP, Rodenstock Grandagon N 4,5/75mm, Apo-Sironar S 5,6/150mm, Apo-Sironar S 5,6/210mm) and I need a help for some accessory that I need, in particular mode a protection or UV filter in front of each lens, but I don't find anything about this.
I'm coming from small format and it's a habit to put a filter in front of every lens, but seems that in large format world it's not so, there are some contraindications?
Someone wrote that with a filter always mounted on the lens there is only a slight decreases in the image' quality, but nobody use that.
I posses a large kit of Lee Filter stuff, so all that I need are the adapter rings for my new lenses.
Can someone give me an advice.
Thank you very much.
Posted by Jerry Greer on December 10, 2008 at 8:31 AM
I never use a filter, especially a UV, on a lens unless there is a reason for that filter. Think about it, you have a $1000+ lens and one puts a $20 filter in front of it. When I was shooting large-format and still to this day only use the best filters, Singh-Ray or Lee, and I only use a polarizer and a full set of graduated neutral density filters. For large-format film, if you can find and want to shoot the old version of Velvia, you will need a 5m and 10m color correction filter for long exposures. This compensates for the shift to green with images over 30sec. The new films don;t really need much in the way of CC filters.
Posted by David Bostedo on December 10, 2008 at 9:14 AM
...and it's a habit to put a filter in front of every lens...
Gianluca - I think you'll find plenty of smaller format shooters who don't use protective filters, so I don't think it's a habit of all shooters at all. There are some good reasons not to use them, but ultimately it's up to you. Check out these threads on protective (UV) filters :
Posted by Kent Staubus on December 10, 2008 at 10:21 AM
I quit using so-called "protection filters" several years ago. They were causing problems. Really, they are no protection at all. Use the lens cap when not actively taking a photo--it's FAR tougher than a flimsy piece of glass. About the only time I'll use a UV type filter is if I'm taking photos at the base of a waterfall, where there is spray in the air, or around other places where there really is something floating in the air. I too use 4x5. I have a lot of expensive lenses and don't routinely use filters on any of them. All my lenses are perfect. I do use the lens caps though.
Gianluca, I'm a long time Medium & Large Format shooter using Velvia. I agree with all the information already supplied here. I have never used "protection" filters of any sort and only resort to use of any filter when the conditions demand it. If you have a Lee system and only need the adapter rings to accommodate size changes then I would basically run with that setup. For protection it is a matter of safeguarding the glass as best you can in the field and always use the protection caps when the lens is not in use.
Posted by Dan Borzynski on December 10, 2008 at 1:16 PM
The other problem with using filters with 4x5 equipment is that the lenses usually don't come with a lens hood. This will greatly increase your likelihood of flare over 35 mm based equipment. Also, as protection, you still have a 50-50 chance of the lens hitting on the rear element, to which you cannot attach a filter.
In 4x5, the main filters will be a center filter (which you may want to look at for the 75 mm lens, especially if you are shooting Velvia), polarizers, neutral grads and if you do black and white, various color filters. For a polarizer, you can use a linear polarizer since there is no autofocus to be interfered with. The linear polarizers are significantly cheaper too!
The other thing to keep in mind with a 4x5 or and other LF cameras is that the need for protection is nowhere near as great. You probably won't be walking around with the camera set up looking for images. If you move the camera with it on the tripod, it will be maybe a couple of feet. The search for LF compositions and the shooting process are significantly different from 35 based camera. When you take the LF camera out of the bag, you generally have 95% of the composition already in your head. With smaller formats, you can use the camera as a composition finding tool.
Posted by Jerry Greer on December 10, 2008 at 3:52 PM
If you choose your lenses correctly you shouldn't have to worry much about a center filter. I used a Calter (Rodenstock) 65mm f/4.5 with Copal 0 and only had to make minor vignetting changes in photoshop during the scans. Much easier than the issues of lost light from a center filter.
BTW, if you are going to scan film to digital, I'd recommend using Astia 100F and then going from there.
Posted by Lon Overacker on December 10, 2008 at 7:06 PM
Gianluca,
Another LF shooter here that doesn't routinely have a filter on my lenses. The only filters I carry are: polarizer, 81b, 3stopND(recent) and a 2stop-soft and 3stop-hard GND. I can understand the thought of having a uv protecting filter on smaller formats, when the camera is slung over your shoulder, hiking, on the tripod constantly, etc., to protect it from debris, sand, etc. But with the LF, then lens is usually only attached long enough to compose, focus and shoot - then it's back in the bag. The work is slower and personally, I only use a filter when the situation calls for it - not by default.
And another LFer who does not routinely use filters. My filter kit is very similar to Lon's; 3-stop hard GND, 3-stop soft GND, 2-stop soft GND, a linear polarizer and 81-b. I don't even own a UV filter. If I need a little protection, say for water spray. I'll use an 81-b for color film.
I agree with all the other comments; especially Paul's regarding the Lee system. You can purchase the adapter rings, and be good to go. Also, find out if your Lee holder will accept a compendium lens shade. This is the bellows type that is adjustable in length for various lens focal lengths and attaches to the front of the slotted Lee holder. B&H has them. Keep in mind though, that almost any lens shade on the 75 will likely cause vignetting. so you'll have to check carefully before laying out money on a shade for this lens.
A center filter for the 75mm will be very expensive, and, as Jerry says, the minor vignetting can be handled by careful camera work and later in post-processing.
Like the others, I use a filter only when its use is called for. Also, I prefer to get the best shot I can at exposure time. PhotoShop is a great tool, but it is no substitute for one's artistic vision coupled with exacting camera work.
Discussion
9 repliesI'm coming from small format and it's a habit to put a filter in front of every lens, but seems that in large format world it's not so, there are some contraindications?
Someone wrote that with a filter always mounted on the lens there is only a slight decreases in the image' quality, but nobody use that.
I posses a large kit of Lee Filter stuff, so all that I need are the adapter rings for my new lenses.
Can someone give me an advice.
Thank you very much.
Gianluca - I think you'll find plenty of smaller format shooters who don't use protective filters, so I don't think it's a habit of all shooters at all. There are some good reasons not to use them, but ultimately it's up to you. Check out these threads on protective (UV) filters :
Thread 1
Thread 2
Kent in SD
In 4x5, the main filters will be a center filter (which you may want to look at for the 75 mm lens, especially if you are shooting Velvia), polarizers, neutral grads and if you do black and white, various color filters. For a polarizer, you can use a linear polarizer since there is no autofocus to be interfered with. The linear polarizers are significantly cheaper too!
The other thing to keep in mind with a 4x5 or and other LF cameras is that the need for protection is nowhere near as great. You probably won't be walking around with the camera set up looking for images. If you move the camera with it on the tripod, it will be maybe a couple of feet. The search for LF compositions and the shooting process are significantly different from 35 based camera. When you take the LF camera out of the bag, you generally have 95% of the composition already in your head. With smaller formats, you can use the camera as a composition finding tool.
BTW, if you are going to scan film to digital, I'd recommend using Astia 100F and then going from there.
Another LF shooter here that doesn't routinely have a filter on my lenses. The only filters I carry are: polarizer, 81b, 3stopND(recent) and a 2stop-soft and 3stop-hard GND. I can understand the thought of having a uv protecting filter on smaller formats, when the camera is slung over your shoulder, hiking, on the tripod constantly, etc., to protect it from debris, sand, etc. But with the LF, then lens is usually only attached long enough to compose, focus and shoot - then it's back in the bag. The work is slower and personally, I only use a filter when the situation calls for it - not by default.
HOpe this helps.
Lon
I agree with all the other comments; especially Paul's regarding the Lee system. You can purchase the adapter rings, and be good to go. Also, find out if your Lee holder will accept a compendium lens shade. This is the bellows type that is adjustable in length for various lens focal lengths and attaches to the front of the slotted Lee holder. B&H has them. Keep in mind though, that almost any lens shade on the 75 will likely cause vignetting. so you'll have to check carefully before laying out money on a shade for this lens.
A center filter for the 75mm will be very expensive, and, as Jerry says, the minor vignetting can be handled by careful camera work and later in post-processing.
Like the others, I use a filter only when its use is called for. Also, I prefer to get the best shot I can at exposure time. PhotoShop is a great tool, but it is no substitute for one's artistic vision coupled with exacting camera work.
Cheers,
-P.
Even today I learn a lesson.
Thank you very much.
Best regards.