Canon 5D, Canon 500mm f4 & Canon 1.4X Extender, Manfrotto 501 video head bolted to hide, remote release.
1/200 sec @ f10, -1/3 exp. compensation, iso 400.
Levels, hue/saturation, small crop off the right and top for web presentation, Neatimage.
Hi,
Had a long day in the hide yesterday specifically after Nuthatch and Great-Spotted Woodpecker shots.
The Nuthatch proved a little tricky always heading straight for the feeder, irrespective of who was using it.
However, during the seven hours I was there he did actually perch where I wanted him to on all of two occasions
that's a beauty Justin, your 7 hours paid off! You're getting some lovely backgrounds from your hide.
Matt
Posted by John Robinson on January 4, 2009 at 3:03 PM
Hi Justin
Great Nuthatch in it'self but I,m affraid the perch doesn't quite work for me. I,m beginning to have second thoughts about the mossy perch idea. ( and I,ve done plenty myself! )
They seem to convey a studio effect which I suppose feeding stations are are really
That's just a personal view though.
Cheers
Posted by Vincent Jones on January 4, 2009 at 3:18 PM
That is an awesome shot Justin with masses amount of detail A shot to be very pleased with indeed
On reading John's comments about the perch & bg being very studio like, I tend to agree as it does take away the Nuthatches natural environment, I too have been guilty of this on many accounts. Still an awesome shot even though the Nuthatch landed there for the shot to be taken.
Might be worth .setting up a bg that doesn't look like one plain colour, just a suggestion.
The Nuthatch and perch are truly excellent, as is the background. But for me it is just too “nice/clinical”.
Whenever I do a set-up, I try and include a natural setting for the subject, in other words a reason for it being there, and I’m sorry to say, here I don’t see a reason.
Posted by John Robinson on January 4, 2009 at 3:29 PM
In response to a comment above - the only way to show why the bird was there would be to include the feeders which obviously defeats the object and I doubt if Justin would want to do that anyway . I may be a little thick but I fail to see how a "reason for being there " can be shown in the majority of wildlife shots. I suppose in the old days of nest photography though the nest was the reason !!
JohnR
Thanks for looking and for sharing some interesting opinions and ideas, certainly food for thought.
I can fully appreciate this style of image isn't everyone's cup of tea and I guess for me, on this occasion, half the fun and the challenge was trying to achieve a certain type of image.
I must say I particulary like fairly close-up portraits, be it birds, mammals, insects, etc and I particularly enjoy trying to get them in as colourful surroundings as possible, which is all this image is basically about. I set out to get a nice pose of a Nuthatch on as colourful a perch as I could find against as colourful a backdrop as I could get. It's just a type of image I particularly like and one I'll often try to get first of all before trying for different things.
I must say I also love, and try to achieve images of birds in their surroundings, natural behaviour, etc. etc. but on this particular occasion that wasn't the type of shot I was after.
I can fully appreciate this type of shot isn't how we see birds with our eyes but for me the fun was trying to work towards a pre-conceived image, hence the result
Ray,
I can totally see where you're coming from here but I'm not sure how I could show the reason for the bird being there in this instance. Does there have to be a visible reason ? It's not really that type of shot.
Justin: Re “does there have to be a visible reason”, it depends on what you are trying to depict, or why you took the shot.
It your original post, I think it would be fair to say, that it is presented as a N.H. shot, but in my experience a Nuthatch would rarely, if ever be on such a perch, as it makes for easy pickings for the local Sparrow Hawk, and the perch has little if potential as a food source. But many of those viewing the shot would take it at face value, and think this is true to nature.
The question to always ask is “Why is it there ?? “.
Nuthatches are in the main insectivorous, but will take anything with high nutrition, any creature will grab an easy meal if they can, for example peanuts/mealworms etc.. So a “perch” which is a decaying, which looks insect ridden, would be ideal. Now you want some pictorial content. If the “perch” is moss covered, so much the better, if not, add some, or Ivy etc..
If as you say, that this was a exercise in obtaining a pictorial shot, using a N.H. subject, then you have succeeded superbly.
Posted by eric weight on January 5, 2009 at 1:12 AM
Super Nuttie shot, Justin. I can see where John and Ray are coming from, but having spent a lot of time lately on these kind of studio shots myself, I have to say I find the end results very satisfying; but more importantly, I find them to be a very useful way of honing technique. using different focus points, f stops, ISOs, compositions - in fact just about every facet of nature photography is far easier to experiment with when the subject comes in every few minutes and you can rack up a lot of exposures. Hopefully then when you are out in the field chasing something different, the experience will stand the photographer in good stead. I must admit that it is never long before the need for something different in the perch line makes itself felt. Any road I like it. Eric
Nice shot, but agree with John re adding something to the BG, as the colour for me does not suit the environment/setting and does convey a studio shot. The only 'nit' for me is that it looks a tad over sharpened?
I also think it looks a bit clinical but still a lovely picture
Posted by Nigel Blake on January 5, 2009 at 5:36 AM
I'm not too sure about the background colour personally, I think it fights with the Nuthatch's breast and belly colour for attension; but its a stunning image of the bird and perch all the same.
Posted by Danny Green on January 5, 2009 at 6:13 AM
A cracker!!!!!!!
Danny
Posted by Paul Inglis on January 5, 2009 at 7:50 AM
Hi Justin,
WOW! Cracking nutty shot! Love the perch!
Posted by tony flashman on January 5, 2009 at 11:25 AM
Natural perch and surroundings or not, I think its a top drawer Nuthatch shot!
If someone needs "Nuthatch" detail they have got it here.
Many thanks for all the comments. Seems to be quite a mixed reaction on this one.
I guess the trouble with these type of completely diffused backgrounds is they just aren't what we naturally see withy our eyes so I guess they'll always have a bit of a studio type look about them. I guess a green or brown one may not be quite so bad as that's a colour we always associate with nature, but perhaps the colour here is just a bit more unusual, particularly when seen as just one complete wash of colour such as this. Perhaps be worth trying a couple of shots with the distant bracken slightly better defined instead of totally difuse like this.
Ray,
Many thanks for clarifying. Although I'd have to, respectfully, disagree with you about not really expecting to see a Nuthatch on this type of perch. The reason I say that is I've very recently spent a few hours in the New Forest watching and photographing lots of different woodland birds. In one particular area of mixed woodland in The Forest it is exceptionally rich in moss and lichen, with literally every single tree stump, fallen branch and all the living trees and branches literally covered with moss. It was a very common site to see many individual Nuthatches, large flocks of Chaffinch, flocks of tits, etc. etc. moving from branch to branch, each of which was literally dripping with moss.
Thanks for the idea for the old, decaying wood as a perch. That's one I shall look forward to trying in the near future. As you say, that will work particularly well with a Nuthatch, at least giving the impression that he's looking for his own food, as opposed to perched and waiting for my peanuts
Posted by Magnus Hird on January 5, 2009 at 5:59 PM
Simply beautiful nuthatch Justin, the detail is amazing in the large version. I have similar tastes to yourself but not the same execution!
Posted by Brett Lewis on January 5, 2009 at 8:08 PM
Such superb detail on both the bird and its perch.. I'm having to look at it several time to decide about the BG but still not sure.. However if the aim is to get the bird and show off it's fine colour then you have 'slam-dunked' that one..!
Any living creature needs certain things to survive, a ready and amply supply of food/water, a safe place to rear its young, and a secure place to live. If all these criteria are all met, then wildlife will move in.
Nuthatches are, as you know, woodland birds, where they feed on insects, seeds and nuts. We all have preconceived ideas, as to what is correct for any given species, and that includes publishers. If someone mentions Nuthatches, Treecreepers etc. to the majority of people, then Oak trees etc. dripping with moss doesn’t automatically spring to mind.
I have long thought, that it is a good idea to have at the back of your mind, the thought that the images you are taking, could one day be submitted for publication. If a publisher likes it, then you can reliably assume, that the majority of people will. Not a bad yard stick to bear in mind, so the earlier you start the better it can be.
Now to be brutally honest, I would have used your style of perch, once only, and not necessarily for the reasons you are thinking. Firstly, if you look at the perch you can see where other birds have landed in the same spot, the moss is flattened, dead give away for a feeding station, also you have effectively lost the subjects feet/claws in the moss. Selecting perches can be an art in itself, there can be quite a few factors to consider.
Reading all of the above comments, I think I shall have to be a little more circumspect with my own comments, in the future. It would perhaps have been better to have said something like “The Nuthatch is really top draw, resulting in a superb pictorial shot”, end of story.
Posted by Paul Gibbs on January 6, 2009 at 8:33 AM
Supurb lighting, and the bg is rather nice too, didnt you get a Jay shot ike this?
Many thanks for sharing your additional thoughts. I appreciate the time taken to share them.
That's a good point about the flattened moss, I would never have noticed that. Thanks for pointing it out.
Reading all of the above comments, I think I shall have to be a little more circumspect with my own comments, in the future. It would perhaps have been better to have said something like “The Nuthatch is really top draw, resulting in a superb pictorial shot”, end of story.
I'm not sure why you feel that way, I've found your comments particularly helpful and of great use. I was quite wrapped up in the idea of creating a pretty image that I probably overlooked the more natural looking style of image. Your's and other's comments have been particularly useful and quite an eye-opener. Instead of planning ahead for more of these types of images I've already began thinking of different approaches and ideas, thanks to the comments recieved in this particular thread.
I put at the end of my posts, All comments always welcomed and appreciated and that's what I mean. If I get lots of kind comments and people say they like my images and have enjoyed viewing them, then that gives me lots of satisfaction and encouragement. But by the same account, if you or anyone else sees obvious flaws with my shots and/or ways they could be improved upon in the future, then please say so.
I have a lot of respect for yourself and many others on this forum, there's a wealth of knowledge to be gleaned from UKNPN's members and at the end of the day, I'm here to learn and improve like many others. So please, certainly don't feel you have to be selective with your comments when replying to my posts, be as brutally honest as you like. I can take it All comments always welcomed and appreciated says it all really.
So thanks again for your input.
didnt you get a Jay shot ike this?
Hi Paul,
I wish.
I got a Jay on a mossy perch from years ago when shooting slide film but have been desperately trying to get another since using digital, but no such luck yet
It seems that every time I make a comment, I’m having to defend it.
I seem to have a sixth sense when this is going to happen, and invariably I just can’t be asked to participate. That even extends to explaining my own images, you will note that once I post an image I rarely, if ever, make any subsequent comments. I always think that such comments come across as trying to justify the image, where the image should stand or fall by its own merits.
I know that on this forum, I’m the exception rather than the rule, as I’m primarily interested in getting the image right, before I push the button, and I try and help others to see what could be done. But no one is really interested in this aspect of obtaining an image.
Unfortunately you have to be selective with your comments, I know you personally can take it, but many can’t, and take umbrage when they perceive an injustice is being done.
Now I have question for you ??
In Magnus’s thread “Getting closer” I have commented, and within that comment I have said, “What you do is, create a feeding station for the K’fisher”. I’ll bet dollars to doughnuts that no one will ask what I am thinking off, that is unless they read this.
I’ll send you a pm by return with the answer, if you contact me on 2ray@f2s.com.
By the way, this thread and yourself, have nothing to do with me making any generalising comments in the future.
Discussion
23 replies1/200 sec @ f10, -1/3 exp. compensation, iso 400.
Levels, hue/saturation, small crop off the right and top for web presentation, Neatimage.
Hi,
Had a long day in the hide yesterday specifically after Nuthatch and Great-Spotted Woodpecker shots.
The Nuthatch proved a little tricky always heading straight for the feeder, irrespective of who was using it.
However, during the seven hours I was there he did actually perch where I wanted him to on all of two occasions
All coments always welcome and appreciated.
LARGER VERSION
Matt
Great Nuthatch in it'self but I,m affraid the perch doesn't quite work for me. I,m beginning to have second thoughts about the mossy perch idea. ( and I,ve done plenty myself! )
They seem to convey a studio effect which I suppose feeding stations are are really
That's just a personal view though.
Cheers
On reading John's comments about the perch & bg being very studio like, I tend to agree as it does take away the Nuthatches natural environment, I too have been guilty of this on many accounts. Still an awesome shot even though the Nuthatch landed there for the shot to be taken.
Might be worth .setting up a bg that doesn't look like one plain colour, just a suggestion.
Keep em coming
Vince
Whenever I do a set-up, I try and include a natural setting for the subject, in other words a reason for it being there, and I’m sorry to say, here I don’t see a reason.
JohnR
Thanks for looking and for sharing some interesting opinions and ideas, certainly food for thought.
I can fully appreciate this style of image isn't everyone's cup of tea and I guess for me, on this occasion, half the fun and the challenge was trying to achieve a certain type of image.
I must say I particulary like fairly close-up portraits, be it birds, mammals, insects, etc and I particularly enjoy trying to get them in as colourful surroundings as possible, which is all this image is basically about. I set out to get a nice pose of a Nuthatch on as colourful a perch as I could find against as colourful a backdrop as I could get. It's just a type of image I particularly like and one I'll often try to get first of all before trying for different things.
I must say I also love, and try to achieve images of birds in their surroundings, natural behaviour, etc. etc. but on this particular occasion that wasn't the type of shot I was after.
I can fully appreciate this type of shot isn't how we see birds with our eyes but for me the fun was trying to work towards a pre-conceived image, hence the result
Ray,
I can totally see where you're coming from here but I'm not sure how I could show the reason for the bird being there in this instance. Does there have to be a visible reason ? It's not really that type of shot.
It your original post, I think it would be fair to say, that it is presented as a N.H. shot, but in my experience a Nuthatch would rarely, if ever be on such a perch, as it makes for easy pickings for the local Sparrow Hawk, and the perch has little if potential as a food source. But many of those viewing the shot would take it at face value, and think this is true to nature.
The question to always ask is “Why is it there ?? “.
Nuthatches are in the main insectivorous, but will take anything with high nutrition, any creature will grab an easy meal if they can, for example peanuts/mealworms etc.. So a “perch” which is a decaying, which looks insect ridden, would be ideal. Now you want some pictorial content. If the “perch” is moss covered, so much the better, if not, add some, or Ivy etc..
If as you say, that this was a exercise in obtaining a pictorial shot, using a N.H. subject, then you have succeeded superbly.
Steve
Danny
WOW! Cracking nutty shot! Love the perch!
If someone needs "Nuthatch" detail they have got it here.
Tony
Many thanks for all the comments. Seems to be quite a mixed reaction on this one.
I guess the trouble with these type of completely diffused backgrounds is they just aren't what we naturally see withy our eyes so I guess they'll always have a bit of a studio type look about them. I guess a green or brown one may not be quite so bad as that's a colour we always associate with nature, but perhaps the colour here is just a bit more unusual, particularly when seen as just one complete wash of colour such as this. Perhaps be worth trying a couple of shots with the distant bracken slightly better defined instead of totally difuse like this.
Ray,
Many thanks for clarifying. Although I'd have to, respectfully, disagree with you about not really expecting to see a Nuthatch on this type of perch. The reason I say that is I've very recently spent a few hours in the New Forest watching and photographing lots of different woodland birds. In one particular area of mixed woodland in The Forest it is exceptionally rich in moss and lichen, with literally every single tree stump, fallen branch and all the living trees and branches literally covered with moss. It was a very common site to see many individual Nuthatches, large flocks of Chaffinch, flocks of tits, etc. etc. moving from branch to branch, each of which was literally dripping with moss.
Thanks for the idea for the old, decaying wood as a perch. That's one I shall look forward to trying in the near future. As you say, that will work particularly well with a Nuthatch, at least giving the impression that he's looking for his own food, as opposed to perched and waiting for my peanuts
Brett
Phil.
Any living creature needs certain things to survive, a ready and amply supply of food/water, a safe place to rear its young, and a secure place to live. If all these criteria are all met, then wildlife will move in.
Nuthatches are, as you know, woodland birds, where they feed on insects, seeds and nuts. We all have preconceived ideas, as to what is correct for any given species, and that includes publishers. If someone mentions Nuthatches, Treecreepers etc. to the majority of people, then Oak trees etc. dripping with moss doesn’t automatically spring to mind.
I have long thought, that it is a good idea to have at the back of your mind, the thought that the images you are taking, could one day be submitted for publication. If a publisher likes it, then you can reliably assume, that the majority of people will. Not a bad yard stick to bear in mind, so the earlier you start the better it can be.
Now to be brutally honest, I would have used your style of perch, once only, and not necessarily for the reasons you are thinking. Firstly, if you look at the perch you can see where other birds have landed in the same spot, the moss is flattened, dead give away for a feeding station, also you have effectively lost the subjects feet/claws in the moss. Selecting perches can be an art in itself, there can be quite a few factors to consider.
Reading all of the above comments, I think I shall have to be a little more circumspect with my own comments, in the future. It would perhaps have been better to have said something like “The Nuthatch is really top draw, resulting in a superb pictorial shot”, end of story.
Many thanks for sharing your additional thoughts. I appreciate the time taken to share them.
That's a good point about the flattened moss, I would never have noticed that. Thanks for pointing it out.
I'm not sure why you feel that way, I've found your comments particularly helpful and of great use. I was quite wrapped up in the idea of creating a pretty image that I probably overlooked the more natural looking style of image. Your's and other's comments have been particularly useful and quite an eye-opener. Instead of planning ahead for more of these types of images I've already began thinking of different approaches and ideas, thanks to the comments recieved in this particular thread.
I put at the end of my posts, All comments always welcomed and appreciated and that's what I mean. If I get lots of kind comments and people say they like my images and have enjoyed viewing them, then that gives me lots of satisfaction and encouragement. But by the same account, if you or anyone else sees obvious flaws with my shots and/or ways they could be improved upon in the future, then please say so.
I have a lot of respect for yourself and many others on this forum, there's a wealth of knowledge to be gleaned from UKNPN's members and at the end of the day, I'm here to learn and improve like many others. So please, certainly don't feel you have to be selective with your comments when replying to my posts, be as brutally honest as you like. I can take it
All comments always welcomed and appreciated says it all really.
So thanks again for your input.
Hi Paul,
I wish.
I got a Jay on a mossy perch from years ago when shooting slide film but have been desperately trying to get another since using digital, but no such luck yet
It’s simple really.
It seems that every time I make a comment, I’m having to defend it.
I seem to have a sixth sense when this is going to happen, and invariably I just can’t be asked to participate. That even extends to explaining my own images, you will note that once I post an image I rarely, if ever, make any subsequent comments. I always think that such comments come across as trying to justify the image, where the image should stand or fall by its own merits.
I know that on this forum, I’m the exception rather than the rule, as I’m primarily interested in getting the image right, before I push the button, and I try and help others to see what could be done. But no one is really interested in this aspect of obtaining an image.
Unfortunately you have to be selective with your comments, I know you personally can take it, but many can’t, and take umbrage when they perceive an injustice is being done.
Now I have question for you ??
In Magnus’s thread “Getting closer” I have commented, and within that comment I have said, “What you do is, create a feeding station for the K’fisher”. I’ll bet dollars to doughnuts that no one will ask what I am thinking off, that is unless they read this.
I’ll send you a pm by return with the answer, if you contact me on 2ray@f2s.com.
By the way, this thread and yourself, have nothing to do with me making any generalising comments in the future.