Posted by Barry Southon on January 26, 2009 at 12:43 PM
Yet another effort from my last visit in December. Trying to get my head around a couple of points if I may. Milford in Kansas provided me with the sight of over twenty Bald Eagles at various stages of development but all doing what they do best. Latest reports suggest over 100 Eagles in the area at this time. Hope they are still there when I get back next month.
1/ To crop or not to crop and are there limits?
2/ To clone or not to clone (that's assuming I have the technique)?
If I can post the crop first then if I may I can show where it originates from.
Very poor light overcast day my settings were the result of a frozen thought process I think. Also frozen fingers.
From what I see on my monitor Barry there is a fair degree of camera shake evident in this image. An 800mm lens is one heck of a piece of kit to master and if I was to offer you just one piece of advise it would be to perfect your long lens technique. Every slightest movement is exaggerated with that kind of lens and it will take some getting used to. In this instance when the light levels were obviously low I would have upped the iso a bit (400 min) and (as your subject is stationary) used the mirror lock up facility. Keep trying, I'm sure you can improve on this one.
Robert
Posted by Barry Southon on January 26, 2009 at 1:33 PM
Robert thanks for the comments.
This is also a heavy crop which action seems to loose sharpness.
I did in fact re position in order to eliminate a dead branch.
This one gives a better perspective of where I'm coming from. Also the basis of the clone question.
If you crop or clone just say so, So that people know, The shot is very soft and is the result of camera shake, You can crop quite heavily and still have a sharp image if the image is sharp to start with, I would have used ISO 800 here to get a shutter speed of 1/1000,800mm is one hell of a long lens and you need a good shutter speed if you want consistantly good results, Did you have your tripod set high or low, Always try to keep it as low as possible to help with rigidity-a beanbag is better if you can shoot from a car or rest it on a fence,Great birds to have around,Not seen too many here at the moment
Dave
Posted by Barry Southon on January 26, 2009 at 1:47 PM
Dave
Sorry I thought I had stated the original was a heavy crop. I'm also thinking a cable release maybe would eliminate shake.
Tripod was low.
Barry
Posted by Barry Southon on January 26, 2009 at 1:51 PM
Dave
Sorry I thought I had stated the original was a heavy crop. I'm also thinking a cable release maybe would eliminate shake.
Tripod was low.
Barry
Posted by Graeme Lee on January 26, 2009 at 2:48 PM
Hi Barry. What great subjects you can play with!!! As a general rule of thumb, some say your shutter speed should be as long as your focal distance so at 800mm, your shutter should be around 1/800th. Obviously this isn't the case for all shots as people have superior long lens techniques and can operate at slower speeds etc, but it's helped me to think about it when using long lenses.
Yes, mirror-lock, release cord, tripod will all help. But also wind speeds will come into it! As if there wasn't enough to think about!!!!
Cropping is fine as long as it still looks fine, but you still need to get closer to get max quality. Your second shot is really nice, but would be improved by a more interesting sky...but that can't helped.
Posted by Simon Litten on January 26, 2009 at 7:19 PM
Well, Barry, you certainly get the birds!
I've noticed with a lot of your posts that they're quite often under-exposed - the second shot here by about 1.5 stops. Are you adding compensation when photographing dark subjects against a bright background? If you are then maybe your monitor needs calibrating.
Simon
Posted by Barry Southon on January 27, 2009 at 5:33 AM
Simon
Often I can miss the obvious when its right infront of my nose.
I think your spot on.
I have moved on to a sophisticated camera that I'm not in tune with as yet. Thus I have not attained the quality I did achieve with the 350D previously.
Barry
Posted by John Chapman on January 27, 2009 at 5:34 AM
Been thinking a little, about your camera shake problem. Firstly Graeme is right, when he says that with an 800 lens you should be looking at least 1/800, but with experience you can get that way down. I frequently shoot using my 600 at 1/60, I don’t use mirror lockup, but I do use an electrical cable release, and invariably I’m putting downward pressure on the lens at or near the lens collar. So 1/800, mirror lockup and a cable release could, and would, help, but I would go a little more basic than that.
1. Were you on firm ground, i.e. not marshy, or on a broad walk, these vibrate more than you think.
2. Can your tripod take at least 2x the combined weight of your head, lens and camera ??
3. What type of head are you using, if ball and socket, what is the diameter of the ball, it needs to be in the region of 75mm (3”). A Wimberley, or a fluid head is preferable, for this size of lens. A Wimberley is basically a gimbal, think of defence guns on a war ship, same principle.
4. Is your head firmly locked down on you tripod ??
5. Is the lens firmly locked in the head.
6. When taking your shot, is the collar firmly locked around the lens.
7. Now look at cable releases, mirror lockup and shutter speeds, etc..
If you still are having problems, then I’ve seen photographers put bean bags on top of the lens, hang their equipment bags from the tripod, and if they are shooting with the sun behind them, they even take off the lens hood, so that the effects of the wind is kept to a minimum. Some even use a support stay, fitted between a tripod leg and the camera body.
Before going out into the field, I would suggest that you try some of the above by testing your setup. A good firm base and a suitable wall should do it. Try different f stops, shutter speeds etc.. Also try out your setting using a grey “card”. I use a “Spudz 10x10 Microfibre Lens Cleaning Cloth 18% Grey”, you can get them on e-bay for sure, less than £10 incl. P&P, as it is a cloth it is a lot more manageable than an actual card.
Hope this helps, any questions you know where I am.
Oh yes, great subject, you have a great foundation to work from here, and an abundance of subject matter in your area.
I think it might be an idea to think of useing a car to shoot from, you might not then need such a large lens. Let me know and I'll show you how I setup a car for photography.
Discussion
10 replies1/ To crop or not to crop and are there limits?
2/ To clone or not to clone (that's assuming I have the technique)?
If I can post the crop first then if I may I can show where it originates from.
Very poor light overcast day my settings were the result of a frozen thought process I think. Also frozen fingers.
Canon 1D3 Canon 800mm 1/250sec f/5.6 ISO200? Tripod
Thanks for looking
Critique Advice Comment always welcome
Barry
Robert
This is also a heavy crop which action seems to loose sharpness.
I did in fact re position in order to eliminate a dead branch.
This one gives a better perspective of where I'm coming from. Also the basis of the clone question.
Barry
Dave
Sorry I thought I had stated the original was a heavy crop. I'm also thinking a cable release maybe would eliminate shake.
Tripod was low.
Barry
Sorry I thought I had stated the original was a heavy crop. I'm also thinking a cable release maybe would eliminate shake.
Tripod was low.
Barry
Yes, mirror-lock, release cord, tripod will all help. But also wind speeds will come into it! As if there wasn't enough to think about!!!!
Cropping is fine as long as it still looks fine, but you still need to get closer to get max quality. Your second shot is really nice, but would be improved by a more interesting sky...but that can't helped.
I've noticed with a lot of your posts that they're quite often under-exposed - the second shot here by about 1.5 stops. Are you adding compensation when photographing dark subjects against a bright background? If you are then maybe your monitor needs calibrating.
Simon
Often I can miss the obvious when its right infront of my nose.
I think your spot on.
I have moved on to a sophisticated camera that I'm not in tune with as yet. Thus I have not attained the quality I did achieve with the 350D previously.
Barry
Been thinking a little, about your camera shake problem. Firstly Graeme is right, when he says that with an 800 lens you should be looking at least 1/800, but with experience you can get that way down. I frequently shoot using my 600 at 1/60, I don’t use mirror lockup, but I do use an electrical cable release, and invariably I’m putting downward pressure on the lens at or near the lens collar. So 1/800, mirror lockup and a cable release could, and would, help, but I would go a little more basic than that.
1. Were you on firm ground, i.e. not marshy, or on a broad walk, these vibrate more than you think.
2. Can your tripod take at least 2x the combined weight of your head, lens and camera ??
3. What type of head are you using, if ball and socket, what is the diameter of the ball, it needs to be in the region of 75mm (3”). A Wimberley, or a fluid head is preferable, for this size of lens. A Wimberley is basically a gimbal, think of defence guns on a war ship, same principle.
4. Is your head firmly locked down on you tripod ??
5. Is the lens firmly locked in the head.
6. When taking your shot, is the collar firmly locked around the lens.
7. Now look at cable releases, mirror lockup and shutter speeds, etc..
If you still are having problems, then I’ve seen photographers put bean bags on top of the lens, hang their equipment bags from the tripod, and if they are shooting with the sun behind them, they even take off the lens hood, so that the effects of the wind is kept to a minimum. Some even use a support stay, fitted between a tripod leg and the camera body.
Before going out into the field, I would suggest that you try some of the above by testing your setup. A good firm base and a suitable wall should do it. Try different f stops, shutter speeds etc.. Also try out your setting using a grey “card”. I use a “Spudz 10x10 Microfibre Lens Cleaning Cloth 18% Grey”, you can get them on e-bay for sure, less than £10 incl. P&P, as it is a cloth it is a lot more manageable than an actual card.
Hope this helps, any questions you know where I am.
Oh yes, great subject, you have a great foundation to work from here, and an abundance of subject matter in your area.
I think it might be an idea to think of useing a car to shoot from, you might not then need such a large lens. Let me know and I'll show you how I setup a car for photography.