Posted by Jesse Speer on March 19, 2009 at 5:02 PM
This may be old news for many, but I was in the dark. I had recently switched over to Firefox, not realizing the color management disparity between the two (or that color management is turned off in Firefox 3 - while it's on in Safari). Long story short, don't use Firefox (default setup) to double check your web images - like I had been doing recently. Or rather, don't tweak your JPEGs based upon what you see in Firefox ... as I was also doing (like I have always done with Safari).
Anyway, my lack of knowledge just wasted a lot of my time. Just thought I'd point this out for others. Lesson learned ... trust your calibrated screen and Photoshop, or just use Safari if you want to preview. For us hippie-lovin' Mac dweebs anyway, right Todd?
Browser colors never have really been in synch, but this seems like a really step backwards in the area of still-developing color standards. The JPEG below shows how this is so critical for photographers ... same file, different browsers at default settings.
Posted by Jesse Speer on March 19, 2009 at 5:03 PM
screenshot
Posted by Kalin Wilson on March 19, 2009 at 5:33 PM
Jesse,
As you probably know, you can enable color management in Firefox but it's off by default, like you said. I can't remember the setting, but if you scan through the advanced setting it's pretty obvious. I think it has been mentioned in threads here before. This is mostly for anyone who doesn't realize that you can turn in on (both windows and mac)
I'm pretty bad about previewing my images in browsers before posting them (here or on my site). I pretty much get them where I want them in PS, then convert to sRGB and export, usually through LR. I should probably take more time to softproof in sRGB or preview in browsers but it's so time consuming - worth it though for that first impression. I need to figure out how to map the jpg file type on the mac to open in a browser vice preview to help force the issue.
Posted by Jesse Speer on March 19, 2009 at 5:39 PM
Kalin, do a right click and "get info" on any JPEG file. There's an option to change the default application.
Actually, I don't see any color settings in the Firefox prefs. Maybe I need to update. I'll have to find the thread too, but I remember it being a somewhat involved process - where you have to download/load files. What a pain.
Regardless, it's a relatively small percentage of web users, I'm sure. I'm just going to stop my longtime habit of double checking color in a browser.
Posted by Mark Stahlke on March 19, 2009 at 5:48 PM
To turn on color management in Firefox enter about:config in the URL bar. Look for gfx.color_management.enabled and gfx.color_management.display_profile. Double click to change the values.
A description for enabling color management with Firefox is at Rob Galbraith's site.
Posted by Brad Beeler on March 19, 2009 at 11:07 PM
So the big question becomes is IE 6, 7 or 8 have color management enabled or even the ability to manage color? Sure I could google this, but I thought it relevant to this topic.
Jesse I ran into somewhat of the same issue when using the "Save For The Web" feature in Photoshop, just after I switched to a Mac, spent hours researching, until I finally gave up (this was about three years ago).
Posted by John Mumaw on March 19, 2009 at 11:21 PM
So the big question becomes is IE 6, 7 or 8 have color management enabled or even the ability to manage color?
Thanks for bringing this to your attention---I had no idea. the link above is well worth reading.
Rod
Posted by Brad Beeler on March 21, 2009 at 12:18 AM
Jesse,
Thanks for the article it was a good read. So if IE does not support color management yet, and since they still have something like 70% of the market and FF with probably another 15% plus, would it not make sense to product images that look the best in these browsers?
Also if you don't embed a color profile would this cause the images to appear the same in Safari, FF, and IE?
As a web developer, I have to apply somewhat the same principal when creating websites that look / function the same across multiple browsers.
Just some thoughts from a web perspective.
Brad
Posted by Jesse Speer on March 21, 2009 at 11:29 PM
Probably a good idea Brad, if you don't mind redoing all your JPEGs when Windows/IE catches up with ICC standards. If you optimize photos right now for IE and Firefox default (which means desaturating photographs to make them look natural, I've found), you'll be redoing them all when IE falls in line with ICC standards. Because these "optimized" images look like absolute mud on browsers like Safari. I guess I've decided that a bit of oversaturation is the lesser of two evils. Or really, that I don't want to redo JPEGs down the road - despite the obvious user stats.
I've decided to stick with what I was doing ... making sRGB JPEGs in my calibrated environment and including the profile. Works OK for today, and most certainly for what comes down the road.
Of course, in two years, we'll probably all be making ProPhoto (or SuperExcellentMaster color space ... or whatever) JPEGs for web display.
Discussion
12 repliesAnyway, my lack of knowledge just wasted a lot of my time. Just thought I'd point this out for others. Lesson learned ... trust your calibrated screen and Photoshop, or just use Safari if you want to preview. For us hippie-lovin' Mac dweebs anyway, right Todd?
Browser colors never have really been in synch, but this seems like a really step backwards in the area of still-developing color standards. The JPEG below shows how this is so critical for photographers ... same file, different browsers at default settings.
As you probably know, you can enable color management in Firefox but it's off by default, like you said. I can't remember the setting, but if you scan through the advanced setting it's pretty obvious. I think it has been mentioned in threads here before. This is mostly for anyone who doesn't realize that you can turn in on (both windows and mac)
I'm pretty bad about previewing my images in browsers before posting them (here or on my site). I pretty much get them where I want them in PS, then convert to sRGB and export, usually through LR. I should probably take more time to softproof in sRGB or preview in browsers but it's so time consuming - worth it though for that first impression. I need to figure out how to map the jpg file type on the mac to open in a browser vice preview to help force the issue.
Actually, I don't see any color settings in the Firefox prefs. Maybe I need to update. I'll have to find the thread too, but I remember it being a somewhat involved process - where you have to download/load files. What a pain.
Regardless, it's a relatively small percentage of web users, I'm sure. I'm just going to stop my longtime habit of double checking color in a browser.
Cheers,
Jesse I ran into somewhat of the same issue when using the "Save For The Web" feature in Photoshop, just after I switched to a Mac, spent hours researching, until I finally gave up (this was about three years ago).
Nope.
http://colorcritical.blogspot.com/2008/01/browser-color-management.html
Thanks for bringing this to your attention---I had no idea. the link above is well worth reading.
Rod
Thanks for the article it was a good read. So if IE does not support color management yet, and since they still have something like 70% of the market and FF with probably another 15% plus, would it not make sense to product images that look the best in these browsers?
Also if you don't embed a color profile would this cause the images to appear the same in Safari, FF, and IE?
As a web developer, I have to apply somewhat the same principal when creating websites that look / function the same across multiple browsers.
Just some thoughts from a web perspective.
Brad
I've decided to stick with what I was doing ... making sRGB JPEGs in my calibrated environment and including the profile. Works OK for today, and most certainly for what comes down the road.
Of course, in two years, we'll probably all be making ProPhoto (or SuperExcellentMaster color space ... or whatever) JPEGs for web display.