Nice one Ray - must have been a bit of a thrill being that close to the business end! It's a pity about the blown highlights in the water, but not much really that you could do (other than recompose - but I think the impact of the shot would be less without including it). If you shot this in RAW, you might be able to recover some of the detail in there - may be worth fiddling a bit.
Posted by Major Gilbert on March 24, 2009 at 6:37 PM
Sorry Ray but I dont quite follow you at times. For all your rants and raves in the past your posting of this image seems to defy everything that you have preached in the past. I am not having ago but just dont understand it. I have no answer.
Major.
Posted by John Robinson on March 24, 2009 at 7:42 PM
Very impressive picture but on my monitor the colours look really over saturated, with a very strong blueish emphasis. I presume that as you were using a wide angle lens,the creature was in captivity.
JohnR
Hi Ray... again not having a go, but I'm with Major here, if you posted to show how close you got to an Alligator then fine, but did you look at this subjectively before posting? To be quite frank if someone offering me advice was to post an image like this I would run for cover.... I'm assuming it is scan but that IMO does not excuse the quality etc... Also it doesn't look to be a 28mm shot....
Posted by Brian Davis on March 25, 2009 at 9:28 AM
Ray, Not wanting to jump on the bandwagon but it just doesn't look right to me either. It looks overly blue, the depth of field is not great, the eye looks dead, but as i always say, if you liked it then thats all that matters. I spk merely as an observer, not as a professional.
Regards Brian
Posted by Barry Bland on March 25, 2009 at 9:59 AM
The grass to the left and in front of the mouth take the edge off the picture for me.
Also I have photographed a lot of alligators in the last year and all the ones in the wild I have come across have been extremely shy and wouldn't let you get within 6 feet before disappearing, let alone 6 inches.
Right now let’s tackle the comments generated by this post.
Major you made a comment and I replied saying, “Just what don’t you understand” and you subsequently e-mailed me privately, which I will reply too. But in your comment you wrote and I quote, “. For all your rants and raves in the past” you then went on to say “I am not having ago”. Now be devil’s advocate, and put yourself in my position of receiving your comment, and yes I do think you are having a “pop”, as you said absolutely nothing about the image or for that matter any other, so why post if not to have a pop.
There has been comment made about over saturation, well look at the grass’s and the habitat in general, this shot is exactly as it came out of the camera.
PhilH, you wrote: “To be quite frank if someone offering me advice was to post an image like this I would run for cover” that is your provocative.
But what you are really saying is that someone, who for example, pays £200+ daily to rent a hide, such as Bence Máté of Hungary, then sits there all day pressing the button with everything set on auto and comes away with card loads of images, none of which they have contributed too in any way, with either with time, field craft etc. in achieving. Then they post them on forums such as this, have praise heaped upon them, now you’re saying that this automatically ensures that they can give a clear and concise critique, on others work, bol**cks. You obviously have a very different set of criteria than myself. I just look at the comment made, and decide its relevance/usefulness.
Now I’ll ask a question now.
When does anyone on this forum make unsolicited suggestions in their comments as to how an image could be improved, taking Photoshop out of the equation ???
Oh, I forgot, that would be teaching people how to suck eggs, and we all know everything to do with N.H. photography, now don’t we, well perhaps not all, as I don’t, and I’ve been doing it for 30 + years.
Now this “Blue cast”, I personally don’t think it is, but it might be, and as such needs further investigation. I looked at other Alligator shots I have, and contrary to popular belief, Alligators aren’t just brown, they have white, black yellow and yes blue on their scales.
Now I think this is a bull, and as it was in Jan/Feb it is when I believe they start setting up territory, so it is surely within the realms of possibilities that the blue colouring is all part of a bull showing his fitness etc. for the ladies, it might also be due to algae growth, or even the lighting angle.
Now the “dead” eye, look at the lighting angle, it’s in shadow.
Right 28mm or not ??
It was a 28mm lens, I DON’T lie. And I resent the implication that I do, The same as when it was suggested that it was captive, and I hadn’t declared it as such, it WASN’T, captive.
Look at the sharpness of the foreground and how close it is to the edge, now look at how much vista is shown, that is a wide angle shot, NOT a 600.
This is a 12 foot + animal, just look at it width of mouth etc. It was taken on the Anhinga Trail in Florida, at the end of the broad walk, I laid on the decking, stuck both hands under the balustrade took a lot of shots with the mouth closed and it suddenly opened it mouth, as is shown here.
Barry I have an ariel shot of this beast which I took by climbing up the balustrade, and using what was it now, Oh yes, a 28mm lens. It is the same animal, as you can see the same bushes in the shot. I never found them to be over timid, just wary.
Barry, re the grass’s you take them out.
Now why did I post this image, well I honestly thought it would be of interest, as I think it is different to the norm. Wrong again, not chocolate boxy enough.
I also posted it, as I did my Spanish sparrow and Kentish Plover, to illustrate that you can take low angle shots, without including a OOF wash of colour in the foreground, commonly called “mush”.
I have no axe to grind re low angle shot, quite the contrary, when done well they can be truly excellent. I was doing this 15+ years ago and even then I was following in the footsteps of our american colleagues. They are the true exponents of this type of photography, and we in Europe are still on catch-up, and are years behind them. So when someone says that this is the latest thing, and they are pushing the boundaries of photography, they aren’t, they are just using new technology and applying it to an old procedure. Basically, they are bull shi**ng you, either that or talking out of their lower orifice.
Will reply more fully by PM in a few days time, not the right place here, just a little busy at the moment... however the colour of this image certainly doesn't seem right, the skin (they don't have scales... rather, scutes provide protection under a thick skin) of an adult Alligator is normally Olive/Grey Black and the interior of the mouth should be more of a pinkish hue... AFAIK there is no change of colour related to display...
Well done for getting this image Ray, I cant comment on the colour because I like 99 out of 100 other people have never seen one up close enough & often enough to say what colour they actually are. I happen to like this image minor nits aside its a good looking image & its a shame that people have used it to have a go at you, some without even giving any real comment about the image which i thought this forum to be about. Had someone else posted this image it would have been recieved much differently.
Discussion
12 replies28mm 1/125 sec @ f8, Hand held. “Stalked”.
Great shot none the less
Billy
Major.
JohnR
Just what don’t you understand
You presume wrong, if it had been captive, I would have declared it as such.
Regards Brian
Also I have photographed a lot of alligators in the last year and all the ones in the wild I have come across have been extremely shy and wouldn't let you get within 6 feet before disappearing, let alone 6 inches.
28mm?
Major you made a comment and I replied saying, “Just what don’t you understand” and you subsequently e-mailed me privately, which I will reply too. But in your comment you wrote and I quote, “. For all your rants and raves in the past” you then went on to say “I am not having ago”. Now be devil’s advocate, and put yourself in my position of receiving your comment, and yes I do think you are having a “pop”, as you said absolutely nothing about the image or for that matter any other, so why post if not to have a pop.
There has been comment made about over saturation, well look at the grass’s and the habitat in general, this shot is exactly as it came out of the camera.
PhilH, you wrote: “To be quite frank if someone offering me advice was to post an image like this I would run for cover” that is your provocative.
But what you are really saying is that someone, who for example, pays £200+ daily to rent a hide, such as Bence Máté of Hungary, then sits there all day pressing the button with everything set on auto and comes away with card loads of images, none of which they have contributed too in any way, with either with time, field craft etc. in achieving. Then they post them on forums such as this, have praise heaped upon them, now you’re saying that this automatically ensures that they can give a clear and concise critique, on others work, bol**cks. You obviously have a very different set of criteria than myself. I just look at the comment made, and decide its relevance/usefulness.
Now I’ll ask a question now.
When does anyone on this forum make unsolicited suggestions in their comments as to how an image could be improved, taking Photoshop out of the equation ???
Oh, I forgot, that would be teaching people how to suck eggs, and we all know everything to do with N.H. photography, now don’t we, well perhaps not all, as I don’t, and I’ve been doing it for 30 + years.
Now this “Blue cast”, I personally don’t think it is, but it might be, and as such needs further investigation. I looked at other Alligator shots I have, and contrary to popular belief, Alligators aren’t just brown, they have white, black yellow and yes blue on their scales.
Now I think this is a bull, and as it was in Jan/Feb it is when I believe they start setting up territory, so it is surely within the realms of possibilities that the blue colouring is all part of a bull showing his fitness etc. for the ladies, it might also be due to algae growth, or even the lighting angle.
Now the “dead” eye, look at the lighting angle, it’s in shadow.
Right 28mm or not ??
It was a 28mm lens, I DON’T lie. And I resent the implication that I do, The same as when it was suggested that it was captive, and I hadn’t declared it as such, it WASN’T, captive.
Look at the sharpness of the foreground and how close it is to the edge, now look at how much vista is shown, that is a wide angle shot, NOT a 600.
This is a 12 foot + animal, just look at it width of mouth etc. It was taken on the Anhinga Trail in Florida, at the end of the broad walk, I laid on the decking, stuck both hands under the balustrade took a lot of shots with the mouth closed and it suddenly opened it mouth, as is shown here.
Barry I have an ariel shot of this beast which I took by climbing up the balustrade, and using what was it now, Oh yes, a 28mm lens. It is the same animal, as you can see the same bushes in the shot. I never found them to be over timid, just wary.
Barry, re the grass’s you take them out.
Now why did I post this image, well I honestly thought it would be of interest, as I think it is different to the norm. Wrong again, not chocolate boxy enough.
I also posted it, as I did my Spanish sparrow and Kentish Plover, to illustrate that you can take low angle shots, without including a OOF wash of colour in the foreground, commonly called “mush”.
I have no axe to grind re low angle shot, quite the contrary, when done well they can be truly excellent. I was doing this 15+ years ago and even then I was following in the footsteps of our american colleagues. They are the true exponents of this type of photography, and we in Europe are still on catch-up, and are years behind them. So when someone says that this is the latest thing, and they are pushing the boundaries of photography, they aren’t, they are just using new technology and applying it to an old procedure. Basically, they are bull shi**ng you, either that or talking out of their lower orifice.
Right that’s it, so back on with the hard hat.
Will reply more fully by PM in a few days time, not the right place here, just a little busy at the moment... however the colour of this image certainly doesn't seem right, the skin (they don't have scales... rather, scutes provide protection under a thick skin) of an adult Alligator is normally Olive/Grey Black and the interior of the mouth should be more of a pinkish hue... AFAIK there is no change of colour related to display...
Phil
Lee