Posted by Todd Caudle on March 25, 2009 at 2:35 PM
WTF??? A friend of mine just called up there and Sam said they're closing the business this week. I know someone alluded to a plaque-mounting business closing soon, but I didn't think it would be them.
Posted by Neil Corman on March 25, 2009 at 2:51 PM
I was afraid that it would be them based on two items. The proximity of their location to Reed, in addition to this not being their core business model. I am sure the transition will be made smoothly.
Posted by Todd Caudle on March 25, 2009 at 2:57 PM
I am sure the transition will be made smoothly.
I hope those prices make the move, too...
Posted by Bill Pelzmann on March 25, 2009 at 3:46 PM
Yeah, I've been trying to get through to drop off a large print for mounting.
As on yesterday afternoon, their general phone number response: "Due to telephone company problems, your call can not be completed. Please try again later"
A real shame. Sam was a great guy to work with.
I hope he can make a comeback.
Posted by Pam Colander on March 25, 2009 at 3:49 PM
Guess I got mine done just in time. What a shame They had a TON of prints waiting for mounting when I took mine in so I can't see where it would be from lack of business. What is Reed?
Posted by Jack Garrett on March 25, 2009 at 4:02 PM
Reed is expensive, that is what..unfortunately. They are about 3 times more expensive than Artist Showcase. Sam told me a while back that he was phasing out of plaque mounts except for his primary customers so I don't know if that means Erik and some of the bigger guys still have a place or not. My framer may know of another place but she wants to check it out before recommending them...I'll keep you posted.
Jack
Posted by Jack Garrett on March 25, 2009 at 4:23 PM
I sent Rich an email requesting to post some information on the forum. If it is approved, I'll give out some info in a separate posting.
I'll be giving an official announcement from Sam later today as well as another plaque mounting option which I think may provide a good alternative to the other known mounting places. Check back later for the update.
Posted by Pam Colander on March 25, 2009 at 4:31 PM
Thanks Jack and Erik. I sure don't want to go back to matting and framing after experiencing plaque mounting.
This is directly from Sam Noyes a few minutes ago:
It has come to my attention that the word is out regarding Artist Showcase. We are having to change how we are doing business. We will no longer be offering plaque mounts. That is hard to say because it is a great product. I am very sad to lose the contact I had with the members of RMNP. I value the relationships that I have built. We will continue the art consulting side of the biz so I can still work with some of you. Plaques are a great product and I feel that they go well with photos. I have had a talk with Tim Emerson in Greeley and I would strongly recommend using him for all of your needs. His number is 970-381-3421. He is a great guy and does great work. Please know that I will still be in town so if there is anything I can do to help in the future you know I will do my best. Thanks again for your business but more importantly your friendships over the last few years.
Sam Noyes
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
As a side note (Erik speaking): I met last night with Tim Emerson of DuraPlaq for about an hour to look at his products and to discuss many details with him. I've been keeping an eye on his business for the last year. Everyone who knows him speaks very highly of his integrity, hard work and people skills. It seems like he has a very well thought through and effective plaque mounting system. The quality seems very high, the time-frame is extremely fast and the price is excellent. I just mailed four prints to him this afternoon.
It is very sad to see Artist Showcase close the doors to their plaque mounting division. Sam has been great to work with and I'm sure that many of us here, like me, are going to miss working with him. We wish everyone at Artist Showcase great success as they focus more clearly on their strength in art consulting.
I am really sad to see Artists Showcase leave the plaque mounting business. Greely is a long way away from Aurora and shipping large prints to and from Greely is not something I look forward to. I honestly dont know where I am going to go. Too bad since I have a 42x54 that I gotta get done right now.
Erik - Do you know if he plans on making somewhat regular(ish) delivery trips to and from Denver? I would be open to that option.
Use big thick tubes Rich. I ship them all over the place.
Posted by Brent Murphy on March 25, 2009 at 6:51 PM
Rich - I have used Picture This...Superior in the past, and they have done good work. However, once Artist Showcase started doing plaque mounting, I began to use them because they were closer (to my work) and cheaper. I may have to look back into using Picture This again.
If I remember correctly Reed Photo about 4-5 years ago would send there stuff out to Picture This in Superior because they would have once a week dropoff and pickup. I had 4 pieces done with them years ago and never had any issues.
I stopped in this afternoon and had a nice chat with Sam. It's truly sad, but Sam seems to be past the most difficult part. "He told me that there's just something about the RMNP group - a great bunch of people that I'll miss." Same here, Sam.
ps: Sam did say that the Greeley guy may make a weekly run to and from Boulder.
Posted by Bill Pelzmann on March 25, 2009 at 8:46 PM
Just to clarify - DuraPlaq is in Loveland - not Greeley.
At least that is a little bit closer to Denver.
With Erik's recommendation, I dropped off a 30x45 print for a plaque float mount today.
Tim was out of town, but Chris, their operations manager was very helpful.
They are very willing to work with the Artist's Showcase orphans.
Note they also provide print services, custom framing, and will drop ship. So, they can provide one stop service, if needed.
Chris actually lives in Westminster and offfered to drop-off my picture when it is finished, and the turn-around is 5 days.
I wonder if Bob (Reed) would be willing to drop his prices to a more reasonable level if he realized how much business he's missing out on. He has all the equipment to handle any job. Anyone heading down there in the next day or two?
Posted by Jody Grigg on March 25, 2009 at 10:20 PM
I have the latest price guide from Artist showcase and I just compared it to Reeds.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong but I believe the prices on the artist showcase site are retail. If you had a retail license, they'd cut the prices by 50%? If this is the case, Reed is basically double Artist showcase.
Of course I was going to head down to artist showcase after work today to use my $50 gift certificate that I won at the shindig!
Posted by Jody Grigg on March 25, 2009 at 10:35 PM
Tony, I don't want to get into words who is wrong or right but not all of us have a retail license, so for us mere mortals it is no real change, except for locations.
The new place that we've discussed has pricing which is actually even less than Artist Showcase which was already very good. I think Reed would have a very difficult time beating what they offer.
I have been using Tim in Greeley for over a year now. He does excellent work and his pricing is great. I live in Ft. Collins and he has picked up and delivered to me. He is located in Greeley on the east side of town just off of Highway 85. I am sure if someone in Denver needs stuff done Tim will figure out a way to get it picked up. He also offers other plaque options that no one else can do. (plexiglas, shapes, etc.) I would seriously give him a call and talk to him.
Posted by Jack Garrett on March 25, 2009 at 11:27 PM
I'll be posting some info tomorrow from my framer. I'm thinking that based on what I've seen in this thread, It may be for Picture This. However they will pick up and drop off to her in the Lakewood area...more to follow.
Jody, all that was required for discount at Artist Showcase was a tax ID number. If you have any inkling to sell your prints, you can get a tax number pretty quickly. I'd say it's worth it if you get a 50% discount.
Does Tim in Greeley (Loveland) have a web site that might answer some of these questions?
Also, does he give the 50% break for people with a retail license?
For those who don't have a retail license and would like to get the discount, it's not a question of right or wrong, it's a matter of cost justification.
The question: Is the cost savings justified by the time it takes you to fill out the first page of the CR100 and to quarterly send the Colorado DOR a piece of paper saying you didn't collect any retail taxes?
You don't have to be a high-sales-volume pro to have a retail sales license.
And if Tim (or anyone else) is willing to give a discount just for having a tax ID number, you can go to the IRS's website and fill out the Form SS-4 in about 5 minutes to get that. (Although the online application link can be a little hard to find.)
I've used Picture This as well and they did beautiful work. The only drawback for me was the remoteness of their location and the fact that they weren't making Denver pick-ups at that time.
Check this out - according to the price sheet Christopher attached, Picture This will negotiate special pricing for photo clubs. That sounds like us - especially with our volume. A solution for everyone - regardless of business status!
Since negotiating is a substantial part of my law practice, I would be willing to try to work something out for the group regarding pricing and pick-up if it can wait until I get back from next week's UT/AZ/NM trip.
According to the PTS website it says explicitly that they will NOT honor the wholesale discount for personal use. That isnt going to work for many of us.
I have used PTS in the past and am keeping all of my options open at this time.
RichieV
Posted by Bill Pelzmann on March 26, 2009 at 12:25 AM
Chris,
Does Picture This now deal with individuals?
A few years ago they implemented a new policy that would only allow individuals to place their orders through frame shops. The nearest frame shop on their list had people who were totally clueless about laminating photographs and the options available. I had to help them fill out the order forms, On top of that they charged additional "delivery" fees to the frame shop, and the turn around was extremely slow. At that point I gave up on PTS. A shame because I do not live very far from their shop.
Have they changed their policies? Given my past experience, I didn't even bother to call to find out, even though I now have a business license.
Next week I plan on dropping off a 42x54 with Tim and crew and seeing how well they perform. I'll make sure to let the crew here know what I think, thumbs up or down.
Bill (and others) please relay your experiences also.
In my experience REED is a Back stabber and NO ONE should use ANY of there services. But thats just my Two cents!
Posted by Dan Dietrich on March 26, 2009 at 1:08 AM
About a year ago I evaluated Artist Showcase and Duraplaq. I found the quality from Duraplaq to be better than Artist Showcase. Duraplaq also had slightly better pricing as well. I have been a satisfied customer of Tims since then.
Posted by Brent Murphy on March 26, 2009 at 1:19 AM
Regarding discounts at Artist Showcase, I got the 50% discount every time, and didn't need any kind of license. As long as it was for resale, and not for personal use, they gave me the discount. If I can't get another shop to give me a discount like that, I'm not sure I can keep offering plaque mounts.
As for Chris's comments about the secrecy of the process at PTS . . . granted, it's been a couple years since I've been there (since I've been using Artist Showcase), but they were very friendly when I was there, and took me on a full tour of their shop. Showed me all the machines and how everything worked. (An identical process to Artist Showcase, if I recall).
Posted by Pam Colander on March 26, 2009 at 1:39 AM
Hey Ryan...sorry to hear of A.S. quitting the plaque mounts. You guys did an incredible job on mine. Thanks for all you did for me. Do *you* have a recommendation for an alternate shop?
Posted by Neil Corman on March 26, 2009 at 2:23 AM
After watching the Avs play "quite fine" (they suck) this evening, it looks like I am late to the party here. I posted over the weekend about the change coming as was tipped off by Reed at the Create Denver Expo. When discussing pricing with Reed I was told that they give a 50% discount for individuals granted they have a Colorado business license, reselling the product and are collecting sales tax from their clients. I inquired if this across the board with their service and it only includes this type of work. It was mentioned earlier in this thread that Reed would be twice as high since they didn't discount however you need to inquire when you are a reseller of goods and let them know if you are reselling thus being sales tax exempt. Also keep in mind if you have a sales tax license and are using it to get products done for personal use only you are not only misleading the vendor you are buying services from but also using your sales tax license illegally as stated in the tax guidelines... but I will let you read DR0099 and the other items so you can determine your interpretation on your own since I am not qualified to give that information. Also covered in there should be what happens when you provide an item obtained tax free as a promotion item or something in a Colorado taxing jurisdiction and don't collect sales tax.
Back to the top of where to go. Yes there are options out there for the folks on this board, and people should find what is best for them. What I would recommend you do is take an 8x10 print and send it to multiple locations which we are lucky enough to have in our backyard. From this use what is going to be best for you whether you have a resale license or not and can get a wholesale discount, where you live and what the cost is for the product as well as how the customer service is in your own opinion. What works for one person may not be the solution for someone else which is why multiple places exist. We have already covered there are at least three options at this time along the front range, but if you just don't use someone since you heard something from someone about a bad experience then as a business person you aren't ensuring your customer is getting the best option available for your work. Due diligience is the best choice at this time, but I also believe the board should not endorse one location and tell people to only use this provider.
Thanks for the heads up Neil about Reed. I guess I need to have a discussion with Bob since he never gave me a 50% discount or even mentioned it and he clearly knows all the work I have him do is for resale. Any idea when they started the 50% discount?
Posted by Bill Pelzmann on March 26, 2009 at 9:57 AM
I had the same experience with Reed. I also specifically asked a few years ago about a resale discount for their lamination services and was told that full retail was their policy for everyone. So, their policy must have changed - or talking to people at the counter gives a different answer? Good news, for some, at least.
Neil, I agree this board should not "endorse" any one place, but it is very helpful to understand the current options, store policies, and people's experiences. Obviously, all of those have changed drastically over time. "Due dilligence" is tough on a moving target.
Posted by Neil Corman on March 26, 2009 at 11:06 AM
I don't know when they started doing a discount for this type of service, but it was mentioned this past weekend when I inquired. I am sure they are careful on giving out this option but I would expect it only makes sense what has been done by AS in the past as well as currently by PTS. As I have two sales tax licenses, one for the my photography and online sales as well as one for the gallery most places don't have an issue of considering myself a resale person. However at this time I don't have an account Reed and am just going by the information provided by word of mouth.
Posted by Tim Zandee on March 26, 2009 at 12:14 PM
I am one of the biggest clients for Picture This... A lot of artists have been leaving Artists Showcase and others and going to Picture this..they were experiencing quality problems and were leaving before they went out of business. I can assure you they have the best quality and their pricing is very comparable and they offer more. Rick is also willing to work with pricing if you become a top-producer. It is a place where I can do over the shoulder editing, get my prints done from their 30inch wide (I out source my bigger prints for now) and it goes straight into mounting - I just shoot, sign it and sell it. They have my highest recommendation.
Posted by Jack Garrett on March 26, 2009 at 5:04 PM
Hi everyone,
I sent an email to Rich before posting this message for approvaI.
I have some potentially good news. I just got off the phone with my framer, Lana Phillips and she was on the phone with the owner of Picture This last night. They have agreed that she will be a dropoff/pickup pickup point for images to be plaque mounted in the Denver area for those who dont want to travel to Superior. Her location is in Arvada, near Wadsworth and Hampden Avenue. Since we would be potentially going through her, we would ALL qualify for the 50% wholesale discount..similar to Artist Showcase. There is a $12.00 charge for the pickup and deliver...a small price to pay for local service. You can contact Lana through her framing business, RCF at 303-985-2644 for more information. She makes no profit on this..it is just a service she is willing to provide.
Lana has been framing for me for the past several months and she also does framing for some of the others who use this forum. She has years of experience and has several large volume customers but also works with us small guys. I would HIGHLY recommend her if you have any matting or framing needs. She does an excellent job and always has my work done in a timely manner.
Hope this helps those who have plaque and framing needs.
Jack
Posted by Bill Pelzmann on March 26, 2009 at 5:13 PM
That's great news Jack. I love working with Lana.
Posted by Nat Coalson on March 26, 2009 at 6:57 PM
I'll second what Bill said - working with Lana is always a pleasure, and to know that she will tie in her services with Picture This is great news indeed.
One minor correction - she's in south Lakewood, not Arvada.
Posted by Jack Garrett on March 26, 2009 at 7:15 PM
I gotta be honest here. I consider local pickup and dropoff to just be a 'service' that should be offered and consider a $12.00 fee nickel and diming. Kinda like paying for airlines to carry bags or to use the bathroom. What's a reasonable fee to use the bathroom on the plane?
It depends on how bad you need to use the bathroom
Posted by Neil Corman on March 26, 2009 at 7:59 PM
We know you have a choice when selecting airlines...
Posted by Jack Garrett on March 26, 2009 at 8:47 PM
The fee is from Picture This, not Lana. I would assume this covers cost of fuel and time for labor for two trips. And I need to use the bathroom bad!!!
Jack
Posted by Les Barstow on March 27, 2009 at 2:33 PM
Not reading my forums much as RL business is keeping me occupied, but I have to say this is really sad news. Sam was always a pleasure to work with and the shop was conveniently located.
I'll have to look at what Lana's offering, and also take a peek at Tim's business up in Greeley to see where I need to go next. I've got a few largish prints and some smallish ones that I'll be needing for a display at my local library next month.
Discussion
49 repliesI hope those prices make the move, too...
As on yesterday afternoon, their general phone number response: "Due to telephone company problems, your call can not be completed. Please try again later"
A real shame. Sam was a great guy to work with.
I hope he can make a comeback.
Jack
Jack
It has come to my attention that the word is out regarding Artist Showcase. We are having to change how we are doing business. We will no longer be offering plaque mounts. That is hard to say because it is a great product. I am very sad to lose the contact I had with the members of RMNP. I value the relationships that I have built. We will continue the art consulting side of the biz so I can still work with some of you. Plaques are a great product and I feel that they go well with photos. I have had a talk with Tim Emerson in Greeley and I would strongly recommend using him for all of your needs. His number is 970-381-3421. He is a great guy and does great work. Please know that I will still be in town so if there is anything I can do to help in the future you know I will do my best. Thanks again for your business but more importantly your friendships over the last few years.
Sam Noyes
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
As a side note (Erik speaking): I met last night with Tim Emerson of DuraPlaq for about an hour to look at his products and to discuss many details with him. I've been keeping an eye on his business for the last year. Everyone who knows him speaks very highly of his integrity, hard work and people skills. It seems like he has a very well thought through and effective plaque mounting system. The quality seems very high, the time-frame is extremely fast and the price is excellent. I just mailed four prints to him this afternoon.
It is very sad to see Artist Showcase close the doors to their plaque mounting division. Sam has been great to work with and I'm sure that many of us here, like me, are going to miss working with him. We wish everyone at Artist Showcase great success as they focus more clearly on their strength in art consulting.
Erik - Do you know if he plans on making somewhat regular(ish) delivery trips to and from Denver? I would be open to that option.
RichieV
I am hoping that the guy in Greely will make some delivery trips to Denver. If anyone talks with him ask him about it. Otherwise I'll call next week.
RichieV
ps: Sam did say that the Greeley guy may make a weekly run to and from Boulder.
At least that is a little bit closer to Denver.
With Erik's recommendation, I dropped off a 30x45 print for a plaque float mount today.
Tim was out of town, but Chris, their operations manager was very helpful.
They are very willing to work with the Artist's Showcase orphans.
Note they also provide print services, custom framing, and will drop ship. So, they can provide one stop service, if needed.
Chris actually lives in Westminster and offfered to drop-off my picture when it is finished, and the turn-around is 5 days.
Thanks Erik.
This is based on floats.
Size Reed Artist
11x14 56.20 55.06
16x20 91.10 81.80
20x30 119.20 119.55
30x40 223.15 235.95
Of course I was going to head down to artist showcase after work today to use my $50 gift certificate that I won at the shindig!
Jody, all that was required for discount at Artist Showcase was a tax ID number. If you have any inkling to sell your prints, you can get a tax number pretty quickly. I'd say it's worth it if you get a 50% discount.
Jack
Also, does he give the 50% break for people with a retail license?
For those who don't have a retail license and would like to get the discount, it's not a question of right or wrong, it's a matter of cost justification.
The question: Is the cost savings justified by the time it takes you to fill out the first page of the CR100 and to quarterly send the Colorado DOR a piece of paper saying you didn't collect any retail taxes?
You don't have to be a high-sales-volume pro to have a retail sales license.
And if Tim (or anyone else) is willing to give a discount just for having a tax ID number, you can go to the IRS's website and fill out the Form SS-4 in about 5 minutes to get that. (Although the online application link can be a little hard to find.)
Doh!
I've used Picture This as well and they did beautiful work. The only drawback for me was the remoteness of their location and the fact that they weren't making Denver pick-ups at that time.
Since negotiating is a substantial part of my law practice, I would be willing to try to work something out for the group regarding pricing and pick-up if it can wait until I get back from next week's UT/AZ/NM trip.
I have used PTS in the past and am keeping all of my options open at this time.
RichieV
Does Picture This now deal with individuals?
A few years ago they implemented a new policy that would only allow individuals to place their orders through frame shops. The nearest frame shop on their list had people who were totally clueless about laminating photographs and the options available. I had to help them fill out the order forms, On top of that they charged additional "delivery" fees to the frame shop, and the turn around was extremely slow. At that point I gave up on PTS. A shame because I do not live very far from their shop.
Have they changed their policies? Given my past experience, I didn't even bother to call to find out, even though I now have a business license.
Bill (and others) please relay your experiences also.
RichieV
RichieV
////////\\\\\\\\\
EOF
As for Chris's comments about the secrecy of the process at PTS . . . granted, it's been a couple years since I've been there (since I've been using Artist Showcase), but they were very friendly when I was there, and took me on a full tour of their shop. Showed me all the machines and how everything worked. (An identical process to Artist Showcase, if I recall).
Back to the top of where to go. Yes there are options out there for the folks on this board, and people should find what is best for them. What I would recommend you do is take an 8x10 print and send it to multiple locations which we are lucky enough to have in our backyard. From this use what is going to be best for you whether you have a resale license or not and can get a wholesale discount, where you live and what the cost is for the product as well as how the customer service is in your own opinion. What works for one person may not be the solution for someone else which is why multiple places exist. We have already covered there are at least three options at this time along the front range, but if you just don't use someone since you heard something from someone about a bad experience then as a business person you aren't ensuring your customer is getting the best option available for your work. Due diligience is the best choice at this time, but I also believe the board should not endorse one location and tell people to only use this provider.
Neil, I agree this board should not "endorse" any one place, but it is very helpful to understand the current options, store policies, and people's experiences. Obviously, all of those have changed drastically over time. "Due dilligence" is tough on a moving target.
I sent an email to Rich before posting this message for approvaI.
I have some potentially good news. I just got off the phone with my framer, Lana Phillips and she was on the phone with the owner of Picture This last night. They have agreed that she will be a dropoff/pickup pickup point for images to be plaque mounted in the Denver area for those who dont want to travel to Superior. Her location is in Arvada, near Wadsworth and Hampden Avenue. Since we would be potentially going through her, we would ALL qualify for the 50% wholesale discount..similar to Artist Showcase. There is a $12.00 charge for the pickup and deliver...a small price to pay for local service. You can contact Lana through her framing business, RCF at 303-985-2644 for more information. She makes no profit on this..it is just a service she is willing to provide.
Lana has been framing for me for the past several months and she also does framing for some of the others who use this forum. She has years of experience and has several large volume customers but also works with us small guys. I would HIGHLY recommend her if you have any matting or framing needs. She does an excellent job and always has my work done in a timely manner.
Hope this helps those who have plaque and framing needs.
Jack
One minor correction - she's in south Lakewood, not Arvada.
Jack
RichieV
Jack
I'll have to look at what Lana's offering, and also take a peek at Tim's business up in Greeley to see where I need to go next. I've got a few largish prints and some smallish ones that I'll be needing for a display at my local library next month.