Hi everyone,
- given that, after more than 25 years of honourable and spotless carrier as a mountaineer, four days ago I finally joined the club of those who got lost in the woods
- and given also that I'm in a strong need of a new mobile phone, since mine is agonizing;
I therefore started considering to purchase some kind of "smartphone" with gps capability. I surfed the net the last few days and I must admit I'm even more confused than when I started my researches. I learnt a lot about blackberries, nokias navigators, "chinaphones" with all sort of gadgets in, etc. What is just not clear to me is whether these phones with gps capabilities are of any use for trekking or not. I learnt also I can install dedicated softwares for gps-assisted trekking (i.e. oziexplorer), but I still have two main concerns: first, are they really useful for trekking, or they're just designed for driving? (for example, you don't need a small scale in your maps for driving, but that's vital for trekking - and I fear that the antenna sensibility might be different, for the two kind of uses);
Second, how about batteries life? I assume that, even if such device would work in assisting me in my hiking, its battery consumption would be high, and of course what use could it be of, if batteries let me down at half way?
Does anyone out there ever owned and used such devices for the use I mentioned? I would be grateful of any help you could offer, thanks in advance.
Paolo
Posted by Luke Ormand on August 10, 2009 at 10:25 PM
I have an iPhone and find it excellent with GPS capabilities. It comes standard with Google Maps, but you can download Google Earth and type in lat/long coordinates as well as following where you are. While battery consumption is quite high (especially if you have it tracking your every step) if you use it to spot check where you are (that is, take it out, turn it on, load it up and get your bearings) it will last plenty long. In addition, if you are doing some serious trekking, you could purchase one of those backpacks with the solar panels on it which can charge a connected device (such as an iPhone) then you wouldn't have anything to worry about it. The biggest negative with it, is the lack of a removable battery, so you can't just buy an extra one to carry around - but I've found extremely helpful when out in the woods. Btw, glad you were able to get unlost without making the international news :-)
Thank you Luke, that's really helpful. I must say I initially discarded iPhones mainly for two reasons: first, just because you can't have additional batteries, and second, to be honest, because here in EU they costs like a Ferrari...
However, I find encouraging what you say about their usefulness for us hikers, at least I feel I am not on the wrong way.
About me getting lost, it was just embarassing, to say the least... I was just at 15 minutes from my car, and still couldn't find my way back. I kept hiking up and down in the hope to cross the main track again, but no way. I finally realized I was in a sort of "cul de sac", with a 15 m deep canyon on the left, a 50 m deep canyon on the right, a vertical slope upward, and an impenetrable bush downward. I was already prepared to stay in the woods overnight , (at least, I have always warm clothes in my backpack and the night wasn't cold, although I was at almost 2000 meters of altitude).
However, at the end, well after midnight, I was able to find the way back with the help of two nice guys who came to rescue me. Never felt so much an idiot before... but they say there's a first time for everything, right?
Thanks again,
Paolo
Posted by Jim DeWitt on August 11, 2009 at 1:03 AM
I also have an iPhone; they aren't so expensive in the states because the price is subsidized by the very high monthly service fees. The iPhone's GPS as shipped has limited GPS utility; no tracking feature or trackback. Far fewer storable points than my old Garmin 60CX. I suspect there is an iPhone app or three that greatly add to the built-in functionality, but I really haven't had time to investigate.
Glad you were found promptly, and that you did the sensible thing when you realized you were confused. I used to volunteer for search and rescue here, and the outcomes weren't always as happy as yours.
My hesitation has to do with batteries. Can you change batteries in any of the phones? I continue to lug my handheld GPS (coincidentally a 60CX, too), rather than figure out how to keep a phone charged for many-day trips.
Posted by Steve Sieren on August 11, 2009 at 4:53 AM
I would discard the I phone for GPS because it doesn't even work for crap in the mountains. Unless there are cell towers in the middle of nowhere. I was on top of an almost 14K ft peak and could see the lights of Fresno, Bishop and Big Pine and no service not even enough for a text message. The GPS works great most of the time in and around cities but the battery only lasts a day or so. Even my Garmin Treker GPS doesn't work very well in the mountains. I would recommend a GPS that has good antenna not the models that cost under $150.00 US.
Hadn't thought about the coverage issues Steve, but you're right. They'd be useless for most of my wanderings, which seldom bring me within reach of cell towers. My trusty old 60CX is loaded with both topo maps for use on land and marine charts for use offshore in small boats. And it works flawlessly in most locations except in deep, wet timber.
Posted by Scott Fricke on August 11, 2009 at 12:27 PM
I have an iphone with a couple GPS programs but I don't really use them . The one I have used was a free application called aPhotoGPS. It basically uses the camera on the iphone and puts the GPS coordinate on the photo. You do not have to have cell service for it to work. I was out in the desert at the Utah/Arizona border and parked my FJ in a depression in the terrain that I thought may be difficult to see on my way back. So I took a photo by the vehicle in the direction that I was heading to. That gave me both the GPS coordinate of the vehicle and a visual reference of the area by the vehicle. I made it back without needing to reference the GPS, but if I would have needed to, I could have shot another photo, checked the coordinates and adjusted my route and recheck as needed. The benefit of this is you can do spot checks and not use the GPS continuously and wear down the battery.
Posted by Scott Fricke on August 11, 2009 at 12:32 PM
Another trick I have used in the past is to hike for awhile, turn around, take a photo and repeat as necessary. With digital cameras this gives you a free visual "bread crumb" trail that can lead you back to your vehicle.
Posted by Jim DeWitt on August 11, 2009 at 1:32 PM
The battery issue on the iPhone is a real consideration. There's are external batteries available from third parties, but they double the weight or the iPhone. However, the cell tower issue is not a problem; current models have GPS receivers built in, and don't rely on cell phone towers for locations.
I checked my iPhone 3G S against my Garmin 60csx recently at Eagle Summit, 100 miles ENE of Fairbanks on the Steese Highway, and 80 miles from the nearest cell phone tower. They agreed on my location to within 50 feet. That said, I still carry the Garmin for the superior data management, despite Garmin's obsession with copy protection (at the expense of usability).
Hey, thank you all for the great advices so far, this community is really a fantastic place to be. I think I will keep the two devices separated. Speaking frankly, I just need a tiny fraction of the features offered by a smartphone - essentially: riiiing, riiiing...
and for the GPS, I think I will end up with buying one by Garmin, probably of the Etrex series.
That's very good feedback, Jim. I think the day is coming when "all in ones" will be a reality, probably sooner rather than later. I'm going to be a harsh critic however, and probably slow in deciding when it's time to put all my potatoes into one egg basket.
My biggest and most sincere need for GPS occurs when visual references are suddenly lost, whether due to fog or nightfall. I just don't seem to have enough respect for darkness and distance when hiking, or is it that the best light on the best location occurs at dusk 5 miles from my truck? Or is the best fishing to be found when the only part of Kodiak Island still visible is the peak of one mountaintop low on the horizon, and the bite doesn't start till the fog bank is looming? Too many times I've found myself navigating back (on foot or afloat) via the stars, or with fog, via compass. And yeah, that's happened twice now because I forgot the blinking spare batteries for my GPS.
It's one thing to be a decent visual navigator or fool yourself into thinking that you are, but another altogether when you lose the reference points.
Posted by Rick Lundh on August 18, 2009 at 4:51 PM
I have the Samsung Omnia and just enabled the GPS to function without Verizon's proprietary software. It can triangulate your position using cell towers OR utilize the built in GPS. I would actually wait for the OMNIA II to come out in a couple of months. It's screen resolution will be a whopping 800x480.
There are a good amount of freeware and shareware topo programs that will work with a windows mobile device...do a little google-ing and look at what you might find to be the best fit for what you want out of it.
Hey, thank you Rick, I knew nothing about the Omnia. I will certainly look at it, the huge display is a great feature, when looking for a GPS enabled phone.
I fi you still read this topic, how about the battery life of such device? Did you ever use it to track your path?
Discussion
13 replies- given that, after more than 25 years of honourable and spotless carrier as a mountaineer, four days ago I finally joined the club of those who got lost in the woods
- and given also that I'm in a strong need of a new mobile phone, since mine is agonizing;
I therefore started considering to purchase some kind of "smartphone" with gps capability. I surfed the net the last few days and I must admit I'm even more confused than when I started my researches. I learnt a lot about blackberries, nokias navigators, "chinaphones" with all sort of gadgets in, etc. What is just not clear to me is whether these phones with gps capabilities are of any use for trekking or not. I learnt also I can install dedicated softwares for gps-assisted trekking (i.e. oziexplorer), but I still have two main concerns: first, are they really useful for trekking, or they're just designed for driving? (for example, you don't need a small scale in your maps for driving, but that's vital for trekking - and I fear that the antenna sensibility might be different, for the two kind of uses);
Second, how about batteries life? I assume that, even if such device would work in assisting me in my hiking, its battery consumption would be high, and of course what use could it be of, if batteries let me down at half way?
Does anyone out there ever owned and used such devices for the use I mentioned? I would be grateful of any help you could offer, thanks in advance.
Paolo
- Luke
However, I find encouraging what you say about their usefulness for us hikers, at least I feel I am not on the wrong way.
About me getting lost, it was just embarassing, to say the least... I was just at 15 minutes from my car, and still couldn't find my way back. I kept hiking up and down in the hope to cross the main track again, but no way. I finally realized I was in a sort of "cul de sac", with a 15 m deep canyon on the left, a 50 m deep canyon on the right, a vertical slope upward, and an impenetrable bush downward. I was already prepared to stay in the woods overnight , (at least, I have always warm clothes in my backpack and the night wasn't cold, although I was at almost 2000 meters of altitude).
However, at the end, well after midnight, I was able to find the way back with the help of two nice guys who came to rescue me. Never felt so much an idiot before... but they say there's a first time for everything, right?
Thanks again,
Paolo
Glad you were found promptly, and that you did the sensible thing when you realized you were confused. I used to volunteer for search and rescue here, and the outcomes weren't always as happy as yours.
Besides that I love my I phone.
I checked my iPhone 3G S against my Garmin 60csx recently at Eagle Summit, 100 miles ENE of Fairbanks on the Steese Highway, and 80 miles from the nearest cell phone tower. They agreed on my location to within 50 feet. That said, I still carry the Garmin for the superior data management, despite Garmin's obsession with copy protection (at the expense of usability).
and for the GPS, I think I will end up with buying one by Garmin, probably of the Etrex series.
Thanks again,
Paolo
My biggest and most sincere need for GPS occurs when visual references are suddenly lost, whether due to fog or nightfall. I just don't seem to have enough respect for darkness and distance when hiking, or is it that the best light on the best location occurs at dusk 5 miles from my truck? Or is the best fishing to be found when the only part of Kodiak Island still visible is the peak of one mountaintop low on the horizon, and the bite doesn't start till the fog bank is looming? Too many times I've found myself navigating back (on foot or afloat) via the stars, or with fog, via compass. And yeah, that's happened twice now because I forgot the blinking spare batteries for my GPS.
It's one thing to be a decent visual navigator or fool yourself into thinking that you are, but another altogether when you lose the reference points.
There are a good amount of freeware and shareware topo programs that will work with a windows mobile device...do a little google-ing and look at what you might find to be the best fit for what you want out of it.
I fi you still read this topic, how about the battery life of such device? Did you ever use it to track your path?
Cheers,
Paolo