Posted by Peter Cairns on December 10, 2009 at 3:56 AM
OK, OK, I've deceived you, I'm sorry. This post has nothing to do with the futile discussion over which system is best - I apologise mods but bear with me...
If you didn't see David Attenborough on Horizon last night, you just have to. And then when you've watched it, see if you still have the stomach for arguing about camera manufacturers.
Posted by Andy Astbury on December 10, 2009 at 10:37 AM
I certainly found it a bit of an eye-opener that's for sure Pete.
To think that the worlds population has grown from 2 billion to 6.8 billion in his lifetime is quiet scary - we all know what happens to most other animals when they undergo a population explosion, but who is going to be the person to stand up and say who can and cannot indulge in 'personal freedom'; and who's going to make (no disrespect intended) Captain America trim down his 9.4 global hectares.
This is a totally impossible problem - impossible because the meaningful solutions can only mean, at best, a huge infringement of personal liberty; or at worst, genocide on a massive scale.
Either way someone's going to be really upset...
As I've always said, who ever or what ever created Adam and Eve was actually having a laugh...
The words "So long folks and thanks for all the fish" spring to mind...
Posted by Chris O'Reilly on December 10, 2009 at 12:21 PM
Pete
Sounds like you've had the sort of apiphiny I had when I saw the documentary True Stories: End of the Line - a film about the looming collapse of world-wide fish stocks.
I'll bat back your question to me: what are YOU going to do about it?
Cheers,
Chris
Posted by jack chapman on December 10, 2009 at 12:52 PM
very interesting, i had understood that the world's population would stabilise in the not too distant future based on the demogaphic transition model from my geography lessons, the film seems to suggest this won't happen before it's too late. Interesting given the worry in some european countries (and possibly this one soon) of moving into population decline and the economic consequences. A falling birth will lead to a heavier pension burden, and the potential transition to a lower but stable population for these countries is likely to cost them dearly.
Know what you mean seeing End of the Line too Chris couldn't think of anything else for a week after seeing it
Posted by Nigel Blake on December 10, 2009 at 2:41 PM
Yes I saw it, it is an issue I have had concerns about for a long time; I think this is a far bigger issue than "Climate change" because in essence population growth drives all the "man made" aspects that are claimed to cause climate change!
Posted by eric weight on December 10, 2009 at 3:08 PM
The world is just a big fish tank. Overstock the tank all the fish die. Simple. I can't understand why people are surprised.
Posted by JMACTAVISH on December 10, 2009 at 3:25 PM
Hang, draw and 1/4 me if you like, but I really don't get why we should be worried about this.
It's out with our control and when we get a leader who takes decisions on population control we cast him in the same mould as satin.
Modern man has been brought up on a moral code that says go forth and multiply and do not kill. To change that moral code will take longer than we, as a species on this planet, have time for.
If so many folks are so worried by the impending doom maybe we as a society should make suicide legal and help those who are really worried to help the planet by no longer taking part on it
Maybe we should stop research into cures for cancers, AIDS and other mass killers
I don't get why we should worry about the inevitable, and I really don't mind being part of the problem when being part of the solution means being dead.
Johnies, it's the way of the future they have come a long way from a sheep's pancreas. I think Singapore had a only have one child program that worked then they thought oh F***k who's going to pay our pensions.
I haven't stopped the discussion, I just failed to see any implied direct relevance of the subject to this forum's stated goal i.e. the forum is ...
"dedicated to the art and technique of nature, wildlife and landscape photography. This is this forums only purpose."
Given the number, and nature, of the responses on such an important topic I suspect I am not the only one.
That said, but not to understate the aboves importance from a simple forum governance perspective;
Population dynamics and Malthus theories are part of economics (political) and are well understood in this arena - mass education and, possibly, motivation is the key for the mass adoption of any required behavioural alteration to our (global) daily lives.
Please, sincerely, if you have a way in which the art and technique of Nature Photography can help change human reproduction behaviour please post up otherwise this will just be another lot of hot air/type and all that will happen is a fleeting memory of a Horizon Program that we will all forget when tomorrows challenges and demands motivate us more.
T
Posted by Peter Barritt on December 11, 2009 at 1:24 PM
only thing I'd say from travelling round the world taking wildlife photos is that this is the number one problem for survival of what we all treasure so much. Suspect unless we address this problem there may not be much wildlife to photograph.
overpopulation has been the elephant sitting in the corner of the room for as long as I can remember. Politicans like to ignore it because population is power and consumers. Wildlife is seen as an expensive luxury that will always have to be sacrificed if humans need the land more.
Even Rwanda has decided that the genocide was probably down to overpopulation, and the genocide hangover is still costing the mountain gorillas dear.
Discussion
13 repliesIf you didn't see David Attenborough on Horizon last night, you just have to. And then when you've watched it, see if you still have the stomach for arguing about camera manufacturers.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00pdjmk/Horizon_20092010_How_Many_People_Can_Live_on_Planet_Earth/
Craig
www.craigchurchill.co.uk
To think that the worlds population has grown from 2 billion to 6.8 billion in his lifetime is quiet scary - we all know what happens to most other animals when they undergo a population explosion, but who is going to be the person to stand up and say who can and cannot indulge in 'personal freedom'; and who's going to make (no disrespect intended) Captain America trim down his 9.4 global hectares.
This is a totally impossible problem - impossible because the meaningful solutions can only mean, at best, a huge infringement of personal liberty; or at worst, genocide on a massive scale.
Either way someone's going to be really upset...
As I've always said, who ever or what ever created Adam and Eve was actually having a laugh...
The words "So long folks and thanks for all the fish" spring to mind...
Sounds like you've had the sort of apiphiny I had when I saw the documentary True Stories: End of the Line - a film about the looming collapse of world-wide fish stocks.
I'll bat back your question to me: what are YOU going to do about it?
Cheers,
Chris
Know what you mean seeing End of the Line too Chris couldn't think of anything else for a week after seeing it
It's out with our control and when we get a leader who takes decisions on population control we cast him in the same mould as satin.
Modern man has been brought up on a moral code that says go forth and multiply and do not kill. To change that moral code will take longer than we, as a species on this planet, have time for.
If so many folks are so worried by the impending doom maybe we as a society should make suicide legal and help those who are really worried to help the planet by no longer taking part on it
Maybe we should stop research into cures for cancers, AIDS and other mass killers
I don't get why we should worry about the inevitable, and I really don't mind being part of the problem when being part of the solution means being dead.
In the mean time, I prefer Canon; how about you?
Hmmm, I'm not sure I agree with you here Tom but you're in charge!
Pete
I haven't stopped the discussion, I just failed to see any implied direct relevance of the subject to this forum's stated goal i.e. the forum is ...
"dedicated to the art and technique of nature, wildlife and landscape photography. This is this forums only purpose."
Given the number, and nature, of the responses on such an important topic I suspect I am not the only one.
That said, but not to understate the aboves importance from a simple forum governance perspective;
Population dynamics and Malthus theories are part of economics (political) and are well understood in this arena - mass education and, possibly, motivation is the key for the mass adoption of any required behavioural alteration to our (global) daily lives.
Please, sincerely, if you have a way in which the art and technique of Nature Photography can help change human reproduction behaviour please post up otherwise this will just be another lot of hot air/type and all that will happen is a fleeting memory of a Horizon Program that we will all forget when tomorrows challenges and demands motivate us more.
T
overpopulation has been the elephant sitting in the corner of the room for as long as I can remember. Politicans like to ignore it because population is power and consumers. Wildlife is seen as an expensive luxury that will always have to be sacrificed if humans need the land more.
Even Rwanda has decided that the genocide was probably down to overpopulation, and the genocide hangover is still costing the mountain gorillas dear.
Pete Barritt