7D focus problems

I got my 7D a couple weeks ago, and have some serious focus problems that I do not think are operator error.

When the camera hits the focus point, the detail in the shots is wonderful. But frequently, the camera "misses." I think that I have the AF settings in the right place. I'm using AI Servo, with single point AF (center point manually selected). I've set the tracking sensitivity to slow (and also tried medium). C.Fn III.2 is set to AF priority/tracking priority.

I have not microadjusted, as some shots are perfect, others (whole series) are off, so I think it is an AF problem, not a lens microadjust issue.

I'll post a couple examples. These are the same bird, on the same perch, taken less than a minute apart.

The out-of-focus shot is the third in a series of three (all bad). The in-focus is the first one from the very next series. Techs on each are the same (500mm f/4 at 1/800, f/8, ISO 800, well-braced). To ensure the best possible quality, I stopped down to f/8 and I had already removed my 1.4x TC to make sure it was not a TC problem. Focus point showed that it was centered right on the bird, pretty much where these crops are centered.

I'm pretty sure I need to send this back and get it fixed or get a new one, but if anyone can think of anyway this might be operator error, please let me know.

100% crop of the bad:

and a 100% crop of when it is good.

I'm not a Canon user, but this sounds like a similar problem I had with my Nikon D300 and a Sigma 150-500mm lens. My photos all looked out of focus. I programmed the D300 to recognize the Sigma Lens' characteristics. That helped a bit but it still was not perfect. Does your 500mm lens have stabilization and do you use it with a tripod. I assume you do because if that lens is anything like Nikon's 500mm F/4, it's a monster lens and shooting handheld with that is almost impossible. My Sigma weighs much less and I still need a tripod. If you are using a tripod and your lens does have the IS, try turning the IS off. After doing that all my photos were coming out in focus and sharper.

Using IS on a tripod you are asking for damage to the lens which will not be cover under normal terms.
Using IS on a lens for best results, set the camera on continual setting and fire of 4 or 5 frames at a time i find this works for me .

Brian:
I'm not a Cannon user either. On the D300 in continuous shooting mode you have the option of selecting when the shutter will activate: when you push the button, after focus is achieved, and something else I can't remember. I have mine set to activate when I activate the shutter release. Sometimes I activate before acquiring focus and the first or several in a burst will be OOF, but it's because of the settings and my lack of patience. I could simulate your problem on my camera, but I don't know if that is your problem.

Good luck.

Why are you using Al Servo for a bird on a perch?
I use Al Servo for tracking a moving target only..
You then engage Al Servo briefly by pushing that shutter button before shuttering as you track.
In other words, I believe it's operator error.
Using your one shot function in this case would eliminate the problem IMHO. Make sure your "focus search" function is "on" as well.

I use AI Servo for a bird on a perch because they tend not to stay on the perch for long! Tracking from perch to perch, AI Servo is key, and has never been a problem when they stop long enough to snap off a couple shots. I couldn't imagine switching to One Shot as soon as it stopped, then switching again as soon as it was on the move again? I assume that AI Servo is the default for most folks here, especially for songbirds?

I have my preferences set to give priority to the focusing, not the shutter release (see C.Fn III.2 above). For all the shots, I allowed the lens to find focus before shooting. Furthermore, I understand that when you are in Single Point AF (manual selection), the actual focus point is larger than the visible square you select in the viewfinder. Nevertheless, the point was centered right on the bird, and the adjacent focus points were touching the bird also. To me, this means that the focus was entirely on the bird and not anywhere else. The lens had stopped searching and locked on the subject when I hit the shutter.

The shots above are just a single example of many instances where I've had this problem...

Regarding tripods and IS, it is my understanding that turning off the IS is only recommended with older canon lenses (e.g., 100-400), not newer ones like the 500. In any case, these were not shot off a tripod, they were handheld in a sitting, fully braced position.

All of this is no different than what I've always done, the only difference is the camera body. I do think that I have my settings chosen appropriately but could still be wrong. I'd most appreciate hearing from 7D users, as I do understand that this camera can take some extra learning.

You asked for my opinion, and if it was operator error. I gave you my opinion. I use a Canon 1D M3, very similar to yours in its capabilities..I also use a bright prime lens.
I've shot small birds inflight for the last 6 years. I can use Al Servo for larger birds like a dove inflight etc. But I've had the most success with SMALL birds gaining as much DOF as possible and using one shot and continous shooting mode. Usually they will be caught in flight near a branch or feeder..
IMO, the AL Servo function can't grab small songbirds fast enough for accurate focusing. And if all you're doing is trying to acquire focus as the bird moves from branch to branch, Al Servo is not helping but hurting..Again, this is my opinion based on my personal experience.
Don't know anything about it being the default setting. Every situation is different..
Take what you can use, please dis-regard the rest.
Happy New Year!

Brian, I use a 7D and have very occasionally noticed it struggle to lock on focus on a static subject but it has always been in relatively low light, low contrast situations. I haven't been particularly concerned about it because it happens rarely (always under those conditions) and I nearly always have the 1.4 tc attached which would be part of the cause.

I typically use AI Servo with perched birds for similar reasons as you - I want to increase my chances for quality take-off shots and to follow them after lift-off. Gotta have servo on for that.

Lots of things can cause focus problems, wind, low light, mist, camera shake, camera settings, bird movement, shutter speed, etc etc. Maybe you need to try a test shot on tripod with a cable release and AI off, static subject, (I always use my car licence plate) and see if you can reduce the possible causes. Good luck with it Brian.

I agree with Bill, the most important factors are the heretofore mentioned..
Good luck as well Brian.

Brian, I personally would send the camera back for a repair. Send a storage card with the images on it that your concerned about.. I don't have a 7D but, I do have the 1DMklll that had some serious issues with it. They were resolved and were across the board with that model.
Another option is to set up a test target as you would in making a micro adjustment test and run your own test in different camera modes, IS on IS off etc hi speed shooting and one shot. You may be able to narrow down the problem to help the repair shop find the issue. I agree with you you have a focus problem but a shutter speed of 800 might not give you all razor sharp images in a rapid fire mode. So test it at higher shutter speeds as well, it may be the shutter shaking the camera. Long lens really magnify any shake at all, The I S helps but is not a cure all for camera shake.
If you still think it's the camera, let canon repair deal with it. You loose the camera for a few weeks but piece of mind is worth it if you have any doubt, and it's free, you will also get a cleaning job from them. Cheers, Jack

I feel your pain. There's nothing more frustrating than new, top of the line equipment and inconsistnent results. It happened to me when I first got my 500mm and I was convinced I'd gotten a bad copy until practice proved it was my technique.

I agree that it is critical to very systematically try to isolate the problem, using a tripod and target subject to eliminate as many variables as possible. Also, a comment on the use of AI Servo vs single shot. I've been experimenting with "rear focus" with AI Servo, which has been touted by a number of professionals (and a few of my photography friends as well). You can program your camera to focus off a back of camera button instead of the shutter release button. With that and continuous AI servo you can focus on a stationary subject like a small perched bird and then take your thumb off the button giving you the equivalent of single shot focus. If the bird hops around or takes flight you just hit the focus button and you're back to AI Servo. It takes some getting used to, but seems to work quite well. Something to consider and you might add this to the mix as you try to eliminate all the variables already mentioned. Good luck.

I have to say whole-heartily that I have never used AI Servo for perching birds . Providing I'm 'on' the bird and have focused locked on to the eye , using either partial, or spot metering and one-shot , things usually go to plan.
Actually, come to think of it, I've only used AI Servo a couple of times, even for BIF shots too..but hey, that's just me.

I hope you can resolve those issues Brian. Its an expensive piece of kit that is no good if it doesn't do what you want it to.

Thanks everyone--lots of good advice here. Keith, your rear focus sounds intriguing--I'll have to experiment with that.

Hope to be posting razor sharp 7D photos in the near future,
Brian

Brian, sorry to hear and see you are having an issue. Fortunatelymy 7D does not have this problem. FWIW, I use AI Servo on almost all of my bird/wildlife images for the reason you stated - they dont stay still. I switch to one shot for flowers etc. You are also correct that the 500 can be used on a tripod with IS on.

I believe there is some issue with your camera. I am posting an image I made with my 7D and 500 f4 at f 4.5 using AI Servo on tripod with IS on. This is what should occur. If it were me I would send the body in for calibration. Of course I would ensure you have the latest firmware which I believe is 1.1

Brian, I have a 7D and have been putting it through its paces on all sorts of bird images, but heavy on BIF shots. I could not be happier with the AF performance with the 500mm f/4. It is steller even on BIF against very busy BGs. However, I believe this camera is so sensitive when it comes to its AF points that you really need to make sure the focus point is on the target or it will search a bit and even a bit will cause the OOF images you are seeing. I use Al Servo exclusively for all my shots, but I use the "rear focus" set up Keith mentioned and suggest you try it. It maximizes the flexibility of AI Servo mode making it "one shot" when you want it for static subjects and "continuous" when you want it for any moving subject. You just assign AF start to one of the buttons on the back of the body that your thumb naturally falls on when in shooting position. That button controls AF and the Shutter button only controls the shutter release. Switching to this set up changed my world and that suggestion came from Rich Ettlinger and David Hemmings to top notch BIF photographers IMO. I cannot say that it is user error or a body issue, but I would set up some static tests like have been recommended and if you still have issues send it back to Canon. You will never fully enjoy your new body if you have lingering doubts that it is not as good as it can be. Also, I believe a read somewhere a while back that you can do a hard reset of the entire camera and that has solved focus issues. You might be able to find a write up on this if you do a Google search. Good luck.

Thanks for the hard reset idea--I tried it and it seems to have resolved the issue. To do a hard reset of the 7D, all you do is take out the battery and the clock battery for a few minutes. Whatever that does, I shot about 150 pics this morning, and the level of detail and sharpness of focus is what I'd hoped for from the 7D.

As a lot of people probably know, the hard reset only worked for about a day and the problems picked up again. I sent the camera to Canon, and received it back yesterday.

Their comments: "Your product has been examined and it was found that the adjustment of the AF assembly was incorrect causing the auto focus to operate improperly. Electrical adjustments were carried out on the AF assembly and product functions were confirmed. Other electrical adjustments and inspection and cleaning were carried out."

Hope that this resolves things once and for all. I should be able to test things out in a few days.