I have only been in NPN less than a year, but find it very enjoyable and helpfull. But, I do find it disturbing to see posted images with manny views but no comments. I feel somewhat obligated to make comments, even if it is just "nice shot" when viewing a photo I like. I am not an expert on photo composition, lighting, or digital processing, but still feel I can make a resonable comment, even if it does not agree with the majority of the comments. My point which I am rambling around is: speak up, comment, suggest, pat on the back, or what were you thinking when you shot this! It is part of the process of being a better photographer, don't be shy, make a comment!!
10% is actually a good rate of comments for my images. When they get immortalized by winning an EP, the views will rack up, but the comments, on a relative basis will drop off dramatically. I wish it were different. I wish every viewer would make a comment, but it just won't happen.
Pete D.
You raise a valid point, but there are some things to keep in mind.
A good # of people viewing the photos on NPN aren't members and aren't going to comment - I lurked around the site for a good 6 months before commenting.
You can only comment so much... I spend (probably too much) time on NPN and look at virtually every photo in avian/fauna/macro-closeup as well as a handful of others. There's no way I can post a comment on all of these - especially not a thoughtful critique.
Lastly, once you have been on NPN for awhile, you tend to get "a following" of a certain # of people that make a point to comment on your images (fair or otherwise) and once this happens the comments will increase.
Oh, and you have to ignore the # of comments in ESS that's a completely different animal (no pun intended!)
The photographer wins because he/she benefits from reactions provoked in others. The audience's response will tell if you have touched a nerve. That can be affirming or alarming. Few comments and few views means you just hit the blahs and may need to go fly a kite for a while. Comments also help cure your bias of 'being' there. Bias ...is wicked ... needs to be thumped...and it cannot be corrected w/o the help of others.
I win by commenting because it hones my analytical skills. I scrutinize the elements that make a winning photo. I use the findings of my analysis to assist my own compositions, dof, and light. And I hope to encourage others.. occasionally throw in a hint here and there of what I might do differently... which is always a personal-thang.
All in all...comments and critiques are the heart of this great web site....I appreciate those who contribute!!
I feel an obligation to comment if I post an image. I think a ten to one ratio is a good target. I have trouble finding the time to post ten thoughtful critiques or comments and the unfortunate unintended consequence is that I seldom post an image, and I only view the image critique galleries when I feel an abundance of time.
The luxury of the discussion forums is that there is no obligation to respond and I can post one or two responses whenever I have a few moments, and my response rate is unrelated to the number of posts I have viewed or the number of topics I may start.
This is and has been an ongoing topic - comes up at least twice a year. And I agree that it would sure be great if everyone got a fair number of comments. I feel badly when someone who takes the time to post and seeks a critique doesn't get very many comments. Unfortunately there isn't much that is going to change human behavior.
I would be willing to make a wager that if you hung 100 prints in a gallery and gave patrons a means of voting for their favorites... after a short period of time you would begin to see patterns and there will be a select number of prints that will be getting all the votes, a large number of prints that got a lot of votes and then those prints that hardly got any recognition. It just goes without saying. You can't compel or even incent everyone to like or choose everything equally.
However, I think one can maximize what they get out of this site, or any other venture in life for that matter and I think Ken's comments just posted are right on that track.
Here's a few common phrases:
- Pay it forward
- what goes around comes around
- treat others as you would want to be treated
- you get out what you put in
- yada, yada, yada....
We all as individuals have different situations and outlooks so it's almost pointless to generalize. But for me, I've been fortunate to be on the receiving end most of the time of a fair number of comments. I attribute that to 3 things: 1. Moderator - got to be some sort of kick back simply by being one the moderators. How much, who knows, but I'm guessing it counts for something. 2. Decent photography. Ok, I'm proud of my work as most folks should be and I think I produce pretty good images and lastly, 3. Participation. I'm that guy that likes to comment on everyone's images... but many of you have figured out that I'm usually commenting on all those images while I'm actively posting. And by posting lots of comments, you will get many reciprocal comments.
Personally, I think participation is the key. I think if you're one that posts a lot of images, you should be posting lots of comments as well. The more you're involved, the more and better responses you'll get. If you're an infrequent poster, then I don't think those folks expect much to start with. But it all boils down to your participation AND contribution in making other members better photographers.
John, back to your original post here. Kudos to you for ending it with encouraging others to stand up and participate. Getting involved and helping others is the best way to improve those numbers - it becomes contagious.
John: As the Flora moderator I do make it a point to comment on every post but there are several folks in Flora who are almost as diligent. You're right that some galleries are better about comments than others and I'm not sure why. I suspect that in some galleries folks post but don't comment. I do think galleries take on a character over time so you'll see more comments in ES&S, Avian and Flora. I think you will find that as you comment more yourself you'll receive more feedback yourself.
It is something that has long gone on. IMO, it is all who you are. Even if you post an original shot, from an often photographed place, then still nothing. Before my last post, I posted 2 shots, that have not been shot at all, both original shots, yet it gets 400 views, and 13 comments, the other, over 400 views, 17 comments, and 5 were mine. I think those pros who receive 40+ comments, should try to help or critique those whom, you almost never see there name in the comment section of a particular persons photo. Yet, if your name is big, they surely comment on their imagery. I take it with a grain of salt, and those who do comment on my work, I thank them greatly and appreciate it.
Discussion
12 repliesPete D.
A good # of people viewing the photos on NPN aren't members and aren't going to comment - I lurked around the site for a good 6 months before commenting.
You can only comment so much... I spend (probably too much) time on NPN and look at virtually every photo in avian/fauna/macro-closeup as well as a handful of others. There's no way I can post a comment on all of these - especially not a thoughtful critique.
Lastly, once you have been on NPN for awhile, you tend to get "a following" of a certain # of people that make a point to comment on your images (fair or otherwise) and once this happens the comments will increase.
Oh, and you have to ignore the # of comments in ESS that's a completely different animal (no pun intended!)
- Luke
The photographer wins because he/she benefits from reactions provoked in others. The audience's response will tell if you have touched a nerve. That can be affirming or alarming. Few comments and few views means you just hit the blahs and may need to go fly a kite for a while. Comments also help cure your bias of 'being' there. Bias ...is wicked ... needs to be thumped...and it cannot be corrected w/o the help of others.
I win by commenting because it hones my analytical skills. I scrutinize the elements that make a winning photo. I use the findings of my analysis to assist my own compositions, dof, and light. And I hope to encourage others.. occasionally throw in a hint here and there of what I might do differently... which is always a personal-thang.
All in all...comments and critiques are the heart of this great web site....I appreciate those who contribute!!
The luxury of the discussion forums is that there is no obligation to respond and I can post one or two responses whenever I have a few moments, and my response rate is unrelated to the number of posts I have viewed or the number of topics I may start.
I would be willing to make a wager that if you hung 100 prints in a gallery and gave patrons a means of voting for their favorites... after a short period of time you would begin to see patterns and there will be a select number of prints that will be getting all the votes, a large number of prints that got a lot of votes and then those prints that hardly got any recognition. It just goes without saying. You can't compel or even incent everyone to like or choose everything equally.
However, I think one can maximize what they get out of this site, or any other venture in life for that matter and I think Ken's comments just posted are right on that track.
Here's a few common phrases:
- Pay it forward
- what goes around comes around
- treat others as you would want to be treated
- you get out what you put in
- yada, yada, yada....
We all as individuals have different situations and outlooks so it's almost pointless to generalize. But for me, I've been fortunate to be on the receiving end most of the time of a fair number of comments. I attribute that to 3 things: 1. Moderator - got to be some sort of kick back simply by being one the moderators. How much, who knows, but I'm guessing it counts for something. 2. Decent photography. Ok, I'm proud of my work as most folks should be and I think I produce pretty good images and lastly, 3. Participation. I'm that guy that likes to comment on everyone's images... but many of you have figured out that I'm usually commenting on all those images while I'm actively posting. And by posting lots of comments, you will get many reciprocal comments.
Personally, I think participation is the key. I think if you're one that posts a lot of images, you should be posting lots of comments as well. The more you're involved, the more and better responses you'll get. If you're an infrequent poster, then I don't think those folks expect much to start with. But it all boils down to your participation AND contribution in making other members better photographers.
John, back to your original post here. Kudos to you for ending it with encouraging others to stand up and participate. Getting involved and helping others is the best way to improve those numbers - it becomes contagious.
Lon
--P