Location ID?

I was wondering if anyone can identify the location of the hill in this photo taken circa 1890? It's most likely in Colorado.

Here's the description of it on the back of the photo:

"The Castle or Watch-tower has looked down on thousands of weary pilgrims who have slowly wound their way to the land of Saints or farther on to the land of gold. A decade since it was a well known point. Now the Union Pacific railroad, fifteen miles north, has caused it to be almost forgotten."

It looks like the Union Pacific follows a route similar to I-70 in eastern Colorado, but a little farther south. It also has a line heading SE from Pueblo and a line in far southern Wyoming.

Grant,

It's just a guess on my part and the photo does not ring any bells for me. Typically when people talk about the Union Pacific and its affect on travelers heading west they are talking about Union Pacific's transcontinental railroad. This is the route that originated in Council Bluffs, IA and ended at Promontory Point, Utah where they met up with the Central Pacific Railroad heading east from Sacramento.

I'm not an expert by any means on the Oregon Trail and the other pathways across the west but when the UP started passenger service across the plains on its transcon route it pretty much killed the need for wagon trains and hoofing it on foot. The UP transcon route runs just north of Julesburg for a few miles but that is the only place it enters Colorado. It does run just north of the Colorado border from Pine Bluffs, WY all the way west of Cheyenne.

Thanks, Tom. I would tend to agree that it would normally mean the transcontinental railroad. Since this was 15 miles south of the Union Pacific, it would likely still place it in Colorado. However, this was a shot by my great-great-grandfather, who has no other shots in that area which were taken farther north than Fort Collins and farther east than Greeley. He has many more photos south of Denver, all the way into New Mexico. So my first hunch was Castle Rock area or Purgatoire River Canyon but it could well be up north...

Could the "land of Saints" actually be talking about Mormon lands in Utah that they were headed to? Also, I'd sure like to know the color of the rock (red or yellow-white), might be helpful in determining where this is.

Grant, this particular formation looks like Courthouse Rock in Nebraska. It is one of the famous locations along the Oregon Trail. Due north of Sydney near Bridgeport.

The tiny pillar is Courthouse Rock. The bigger formation on the right is Jail Rock.

I'll bet Bill is correct, cuz while I was reading your post I was thinking western Nebraska from what I remember from my high school history class.

Thanks, Bill. This certainly looks somewhat similar to Courthouse Rock, but in the pics where the top of Courthouse looks similar to this pic, the bottom is much narrower than this pic. And I couldn't find any pic of Jail that looks close to this. I'd also be surprised if Joseph Collier ever photographed in Nebraska but anything is possible.

So if anyone else has any other suggestions, I'd appreciate it. But if Todd doesn't know, this may well become a cold case. I'm guessing the rocks are more yellow-white given their light color, especially in the foreground.

I googled Courthouse Rock, Nebraska and came up with a lot of different looking images. Here's the one I was referencing earlier.

http://www.isu.edu/~trinmich/Courthouse.html

Doing a quick Google image search, one thing is clear: apparently these rock formations can only be photographed from one spot, or else they look exactly the same from any angle.

Based on the surrounding vegetation, I don't think it could be Nebraska -- I 've been to the towers in NE and they are surrounded by grassland. This looks like western CO or UT, to me.

After further digging, I saw some references to "The Land of the Saints" as Utah. I also noticed that the UP has a rail line that follows roughly the path of I-80 which puts it in the same area of the Oregon, California and Mormaon Trails which passed thorough WY as one trail and then diverged after crossing the Continental Divide south of the Wind River Range. If I were to guess (and it would be just a guess), I would say the Echo Canyon area in UT. I am really interested to find out!
Here is a webiste with some bad photos of the area: http://trailbuff.com/index.htm

Echo Canyon is all conglomerate rock. This looks more like Sandstone to me. I also believe the land of saints is Utah, which means this is not in Utah (and the land of gold is California). No idea where it is but it does remind me of the scenery around Dinosaur NM.

Guy

Grant, I am certainly no expert on pinpointing these type of locations, but this looks very similar to a rock formation on 287 between LaPorte and Laramie. The entire layut of the land looks similar to that entire area.

I know you already mentioned you don't think it could be Nebraska, and I agree this is not courthouse rock, but I would look at the Scotts Bluff/Mitchell Pass area a little farther west. This is the only area I can think of that has this type of geology, is along the Mormon Pioneer/Oregon/California Trail, and also south of a Union Pacific line. Take a look at these two links, Mormon Trail and 1925 Union Pacific. Good luck!

Edit: I found reference to a "Castle Rock" on this map which is right in line with my earlier thoughts.

Thanks for all the suggestions. Jason, the Castle Rock you found is certainly a possibility, though it would have to be from a different angle than the few pics I found online and at Google Earth street view. It also appears to be only 6 miles from Union Pacific and seemingly visible from UP.

I managed to find another historic photo of this same formation that says it's near the Cache la Poudre, which would place this closer to Fort Collins, maybe in the rocky, hilly area to the north. But it's conceivable the Cache la Poudre was confused with the Platte, since the Poudre flows into the Platte in Greeley.