I cant find the answer to a question I need on the Natural England site!! I have come across a rather unique set of circumstances where a pair of Peregrines have taken up residence in a local disused quarry, that is also a wildlife trust run nature reserve. The Quarry face where the Peregrines are is no more than 60ft high, and has visitors and dog walkers etc walking by everyday causing zero disturbance to the Peregrine's, they sit there unbothered. I have stood and watched with binos at a distance of approx 100m again with no disturbance with fellow bird watchers. Now looking at NE website the license is for DISTURBING the birds at the nest, as I wont be disturbing them do I need a license to photograph within the vicinty of the nest?? What is the standing on this please, if anyone can clear it up? Dont want to get in hot water ?
Regards
Rob
Posted by David Kjaer on April 10, 2012 at 3:14 PM
Hello Rob
In the circumstances you describe I would say that you do not need a licence as the key word is disturbance.
David
Posted by John Robinson on April 10, 2012 at 3:35 PM
I,d agree with David
I had exactly the same situation a few years back. They said not to bother with a licence, and there is no set rule for a distance from the nest . al. which constitutes disturbance. Each case is individual.
I had a bloke last year sat in a chair opposite a Kingfisher hole (30 foot away). He said they flew in a couple of times but seemed a "bit nervous" and on one occasion had a beak ful of muck !
That is an example of the other extreme. I put him right.
Best of luck
JR
Posted by David Sewell on April 10, 2012 at 6:01 PM
I also agree with David and John. I don't think you would be causing disturbance within the meaning of the Act (1981 Wildlife and Countryside Act that is). Obviously if the birds did appear to get upset you would stop, but it sounds as though you would be causing less disturbance than Joe Public.
I would generally agree with the above points. Playing devil's advocate, however, if for any reason the breeding attempt failed, if it were me, I would want some confidence that I wouldn't be made a scapegoat. There could be an argument that visitor traffic is sporadic, whereas a photographer spending large amounts of time close to the nest site may cause more disturbance. Again, just playing devil's advocate.
Posted by John Robinson on April 11, 2012 at 3:08 AM
Good point Peter, as photographers are beginning to get blamed for various things more and more as time goes on. ( Some of it warrented un fortunately)
JR
Posted by Vincent Jones on April 11, 2012 at 11:45 AM
Hi Rob
Pete makes some interesting points, which could be raised with the Wildlife Trust themselves. With what Pete says, you or any other photographer could become a magnet to attract other photographers, too many photographers turning up for a piece of the cake could cause to much disturbance, this would need to be evaluated by the Wildlife Trust themselves if it happens.
Think about the Peregrines that nest on Tower blocks in City Centres, they don't cordon off the building or the buildings close by. Peregrines are a difficult bird to licence because they will nest close to where people are.
From what you have stated, it does sound like no licence will be required because you state you will be within the area allocated where the public have access, you with a camera are public.
On a disturbance note, put your wildlife head on & simply check the behaviour of the Peregrines on the shots taken, the image will tell you if you are disturbing them or not from the public access area.
Disturbance at a recorded nest applies to binoculars, walkers (with or without dogs) & of course cameras, if the site location where the public have access to is not cordoned off then there is no illegal disturbance being caused. For the safety of the Peregrines, a protective boundary line away from the nest would be put in place & enforced by the Wildlife Trust & with probable guidance from Natural England.
Thanks for the above advice. Well I went over today with my camera and got some images. She was totally uninterested, and continued to sit on her eggs. Also spoke to a warden, who said when the young were being fed on the nest ledge last year there was sometimes 30 birders stood where I was with scopes etc, and the birds were not disturbed !! I've never come across Peregrine's like this, it's only the second year they have bred here and are totally relaxed around people, today there was a couple walking a dog right under were the nest is, calling the dog etc, and she was unfazed by it all, at other sites they would be circling above screaming their heads off !! I will go over in about 2 weeks and see how they are doing, but I will also be speaking to the site manager and telling him I feel the site needs more security and barriers, honestly if you saw it you would laugh that they are there !!!
Discussion
7 repliesI cant find the answer to a question I need on the Natural England site!! I have come across a rather unique set of circumstances where a pair of Peregrines have taken up residence in a local disused quarry, that is also a wildlife trust run nature reserve. The Quarry face where the Peregrines are is no more than 60ft high, and has visitors and dog walkers etc walking by everyday causing zero disturbance to the Peregrine's, they sit there unbothered. I have stood and watched with binos at a distance of approx 100m again with no disturbance with fellow bird watchers. Now looking at NE website the license is for DISTURBING the birds at the nest, as I wont be disturbing them do I need a license to photograph within the vicinty of the nest?? What is the standing on this please, if anyone can clear it up? Dont want to get in hot water ?
Regards
Rob
In the circumstances you describe I would say that you do not need a licence as the key word is disturbance.
David
I had exactly the same situation a few years back. They said not to bother with a licence, and there is no set rule for a distance from the nest . al. which constitutes disturbance. Each case is individual.
I had a bloke last year sat in a chair opposite a Kingfisher hole (30 foot away). He said they flew in a couple of times but seemed a "bit nervous" and on one occasion had a beak ful of muck !
That is an example of the other extreme. I put him right.
Best of luck
JR
David
I would generally agree with the above points. Playing devil's advocate, however, if for any reason the breeding attempt failed, if it were me, I would want some confidence that I wouldn't be made a scapegoat. There could be an argument that visitor traffic is sporadic, whereas a photographer spending large amounts of time close to the nest site may cause more disturbance. Again, just playing devil's advocate.
I would try to seek some reassurance in writing from Natural England's licensing department - http://www.naturalengland.org.uk/ourwork/regulation/wildlife/contactus/default.aspx
Cheers.
JR
Pete makes some interesting points, which could be raised with the Wildlife Trust themselves. With what Pete says, you or any other photographer could become a magnet to attract other photographers, too many photographers turning up for a piece of the cake could cause to much disturbance, this would need to be evaluated by the Wildlife Trust themselves if it happens.
Think about the Peregrines that nest on Tower blocks in City Centres, they don't cordon off the building or the buildings close by. Peregrines are a difficult bird to licence because they will nest close to where people are.
From what you have stated, it does sound like no licence will be required because you state you will be within the area allocated where the public have access, you with a camera are public.
On a disturbance note, put your wildlife head on & simply check the behaviour of the Peregrines on the shots taken, the image will tell you if you are disturbing them or not from the public access area.
Disturbance at a recorded nest applies to binoculars, walkers (with or without dogs) & of course cameras, if the site location where the public have access to is not cordoned off then there is no illegal disturbance being caused. For the safety of the Peregrines, a protective boundary line away from the nest would be put in place & enforced by the Wildlife Trust & with probable guidance from Natural England.
Hope this helps
Thanks for the above advice. Well I went over today with my camera and got some images. She was totally uninterested, and continued to sit on her eggs. Also spoke to a warden, who said when the young were being fed on the nest ledge last year there was sometimes 30 birders stood where I was with scopes etc, and the birds were not disturbed !! I've never come across Peregrine's like this, it's only the second year they have bred here and are totally relaxed around people, today there was a couple walking a dog right under were the nest is, calling the dog etc, and she was unfazed by it all, at other sites they would be circling above screaming their heads off !! I will go over in about 2 weeks and see how they are doing, but I will also be speaking to the site manager and telling him I feel the site needs more security and barriers, honestly if you saw it you would laugh that they are there !!!
Regards
Rob