Hello shooters, I'm looking for information to help me plan a Christmas week vacation.
I'm thinking of visiting the White Pocket, coyote buttes and surrounding areas. I have found lots of information on the Internet about locations for shooting but what I am looking for specifically is primitive camping information.
Typically I avoid campsites, hotels or anywhere near people. My style of a photography trip is living in my 4-WD truck and camping as close as possible to my sunrise and sunset shooting locations. I like to be alone in the desert where I can enjoy peace and solitude at night.
Is primitive camping legal near the popular white pocket shooting locations?
I understand that some of the dirt roads can be impassable in wet weather. I do come equipped with chains on all four and am familiar with airing down my tires and other techniques to get me through. However I'm very conscious about being sensitive to the fragile desert environment and just because one has a four-wheel-drive and knows how to get through does not mean it's okay to cause unnecessary erosion to the dirt roads. Hmm…. Sounds like I'm getting off topic.
Posted by Peter Coskun on October 19, 2012 at 4:35 PM
From what I understand there are camping options at the parking area for white pocket. I think Coyote buttes is a day use only area and am not sure of the camping options around there. There are a few scattered campgrounds in the region that shouldn't be too far from either location. Doug K knows the area better than most people, so maybe he can chime in.
Posted by John Mumaw on October 19, 2012 at 6:43 PM
Camping is allowed at the 'parking' area near the White Pocket.
Same with South Coyote Buttes. There's a primitive campground just south of the parking area for North Coyote Buttes (the Wave) on your right. Bring some firewood!
Actually, being wet (and frozen?) in the area will be a big plus for you in keeping your vehicle from sinking in the soft sand on the way in and out. The House Rock Valley road access into all of those places is a different story as it can be impassible when wet, even with 4WDs. Still, winters down here are pretty dry and the odds are definitely in your favor for traversing that road with no problems.
Thanks Peter, I will probably want to check out the Coyote Butte area as well.
John, I was hoping that you would chime in. You seem to have a vast knowledge of the Southwest that is reflected in your beautiful photos.
Cool, so camping near the white pocket shooting locations is possible. Excellent, I'll find a lonely spot nearby to enjoy a few quiet nights.
Gosh, folks on the inter-web make it sound like the sandy road is where I will meet my demise.
I'm ready to air down to 12 psi and engage the rear locker if necessary. Maybe I'll pick up some sand ladders for the trip.
Thanks for the info. With only one week of vacation this year it helps when folks share information.
Last year I spent Christmas week at canyonlands/Arches national Park. I made a beeline for the Icons because I was desperate to get something… This year I am willing to take a chance for more unique comps.
I've been to White Pocket probably a half dozen times now, and always Jeep camp it there. That allows you to go in and do a sunset/sunrise set. I'll be out shooting Christmas through New Years, maybe I'll see you there!
Posted by Kurt Budde on October 19, 2012 at 8:56 PM
Don't listen to the internet about the sand. The road is not a big deal. I can confirm that House Rock Valley Road can and will be nasty when muddy, but again, it's nothing 4wd and decent tires can't handle.
Posted by John Mumaw on October 19, 2012 at 10:15 PM
You won't need sand ladders or airing down your tires, Richard. Sounds like you're an experienced driver, so decent tires, rear lockers and keeping your speed up will be fine, esp. in the winter. Thanks for linking your images from last winter. You've got some really fine work in there!
Posted by Scott Fricke on October 20, 2012 at 12:00 PM
Ditto what Kurt and John posted, especially the part about keeping the speed up, keep a quick steady pace and you'll be fine. The parking/camping area is right at the edge of the formations so it is great for quick access in the morning for sunrise.
Posted by Kurt Budde on October 20, 2012 at 3:16 PM
Just to add a bit more.. you don't have to camp right at White Pocket if you prefer more solitude. There are innumerable side roads up there leading off to random areas of the plateau. One that comes to mind is just outside of White Pocket, it runs out between the Eastern formations to a large Hole-in-the-Rock mountain. As an aside, there's some cool cowboy-glyphs up there from the early 1900's near the hole.
Do be aware that it can be shockingly cold up there in winter. A few years ago over new years I had a 5 gallon jug freeze solid in my truck in just a few hours overnight..
Joshua, I just might see you there. So far the plan is to spend half the week with the wife in the arches national Park, then drop her off at the Grand Junction airport Wednesday, then it's off to the white pocket area till Monday.
Kurt, Scott, Roger that, keep up the momentum and practice typical wheeling protocol.
97 Yota, 11.5 x 32" tires, mechanical locker out back, two inch spring lift with Alcan in the rear, Race Runner coil overs in front, too many dirt miles to count…. I wish I was a photographer all those early years, now that I can afford good camera gear I don't get any time off work.
John, thanks for the kind words. I hope to have something worth posting this year.
Posted by Karl Buiter on October 22, 2012 at 5:10 PM
Richard
This may help. This is a screen cap of my Google Earth Waypoints and Paths. The trail that I took was the furthest SE path - Pine - Ranch Turn (go left Y when you see the ranch house) - Cattle Fence Y (go left, gate about 200-300m up). While it hangs you out a bit further, it is a fairly flat trail often reported as "Easiest" but with perhaps fewer landmarks. The Poverty Ranch route is most often listed, but requires an uphill sandy climb on the way back, plus reported deep sand along a fence line on the northern section. I have a few other paths listed. Its fairly amazing how so many sites (such as the Wave) and slots (such as Buckskin) are in close proximity.
As to the sand I encountered - no worse than anything you might encounter offroading Moab, including Sand Flats (Fins/Hells). Your Yota should have absolutely no issues. If you have traction control - turn it off! Most electronic traction systems attempt to stop wheel slip - which on sand will destroy your momentum.
I would consider heading out there for the holidays - except I have some other activities planned. Enjoy!
Posted by Doug Koepsel on October 22, 2012 at 6:22 PM
Richard, I think everything said above will have you covered well. I was just at WP and SCB this past weekend. Plenty of options are available to camp away from the "trailhead" at WP, NCB and SCB. Your vehicle should be fine. I would recommend going to SCB via Pine Tree marked on Karl's map, as opposed to driving up the hill via Paw Hole.
Nice…. You guys are spoiling me!
Karl, thanks for the map and info, this helps. I’m all for taking a longer rout to avoid the deep stuff. It should be fun just wheeling around the area, too.
No electronic traction control, just an old fashioned rear locker.
Doug, the photos on your site are inspiring.
“you don't have to camp right at White Pocket if you prefer more solitude. There are innumerable side roads up there leading off to random areas of the plateau. One that comes to mind is just outside of White Pocket, it runs out between the Eastern formations to a large Hole-in-the-Rock mountain.”
Kurt, I just saw your 2nd post. This sounds like the good stuff.
I’m ready for the cold. Last year all of the my 7 gallon containers froze the first night. I had to place one of them on the passenger floorboard and blast it with the heater to melt drinking water. The ice chest was used to keep food from freezing at night.
Posted by John Kyler on January 19, 2013 at 10:34 AM
Thanks for this thread and information.
Posted by Tom Stermitz on January 19, 2013 at 1:00 PM
Sorry, this is probably the better place to post:
How is the access for a VW Vanagon? It does quite well in rough roads, but it isn't a 4WD.
Tom, I would not recommend taking VW van into this area.
You can take house rock valley rd from the south and turn east on rd 1077 for at least a few miles. I’m not sure how far you would need to hike/bike from there.
Mountain biking would be very hard in the sandy sections. I am an avid mountain biker and would not be able to pedal through the deep sand.
Discussion
15 repliesI'm thinking of visiting the White Pocket, coyote buttes and surrounding areas. I have found lots of information on the Internet about locations for shooting but what I am looking for specifically is primitive camping information.
Typically I avoid campsites, hotels or anywhere near people. My style of a photography trip is living in my 4-WD truck and camping as close as possible to my sunrise and sunset shooting locations. I like to be alone in the desert where I can enjoy peace and solitude at night.
Is primitive camping legal near the popular white pocket shooting locations?
I understand that some of the dirt roads can be impassable in wet weather. I do come equipped with chains on all four and am familiar with airing down my tires and other techniques to get me through. However I'm very conscious about being sensitive to the fragile desert environment and just because one has a four-wheel-drive and knows how to get through does not mean it's okay to cause unnecessary erosion to the dirt roads. Hmm…. Sounds like I'm getting off topic.
Same with South Coyote Buttes. There's a primitive campground just south of the parking area for North Coyote Buttes (the Wave) on your right. Bring some firewood!
Actually, being wet (and frozen?) in the area will be a big plus for you in keeping your vehicle from sinking in the soft sand on the way in and out. The House Rock Valley road access into all of those places is a different story as it can be impassible when wet, even with 4WDs. Still, winters down here are pretty dry and the odds are definitely in your favor for traversing that road with no problems.
John, I was hoping that you would chime in. You seem to have a vast knowledge of the Southwest that is reflected in your beautiful photos.
Cool, so camping near the white pocket shooting locations is possible. Excellent, I'll find a lonely spot nearby to enjoy a few quiet nights.
Gosh, folks on the inter-web make it sound like the sandy road is where I will meet my demise.
I'm ready to air down to 12 psi and engage the rear locker if necessary. Maybe I'll pick up some sand ladders for the trip.
Thanks for the info. With only one week of vacation this year it helps when folks share information.
Last year I spent Christmas week at canyonlands/Arches national Park. I made a beeline for the
Icons because I was desperate to get something… This year I am willing to take a chance for more unique comps.
Do be aware that it can be shockingly cold up there in winter. A few years ago over new years I had a 5 gallon jug freeze solid in my truck in just a few hours overnight..
Kurt, Scott, Roger that, keep up the momentum and practice typical wheeling protocol.
97 Yota, 11.5 x 32" tires, mechanical locker out back, two inch spring lift with Alcan in the rear, Race Runner coil overs in front, too many dirt miles to count…. I wish I was a photographer all those early years, now that I can afford good camera gear I don't get any time off work.
John, thanks for the kind words. I hope to have something worth posting this year.
This may help. This is a screen cap of my Google Earth Waypoints and Paths. The trail that I took was the furthest SE path - Pine - Ranch Turn (go left Y when you see the ranch house) - Cattle Fence Y (go left, gate about 200-300m up). While it hangs you out a bit further, it is a fairly flat trail often reported as "Easiest" but with perhaps fewer landmarks. The Poverty Ranch route is most often listed, but requires an uphill sandy climb on the way back, plus reported deep sand along a fence line on the northern section. I have a few other paths listed. Its fairly amazing how so many sites (such as the Wave) and slots (such as Buckskin) are in close proximity.
As to the sand I encountered - no worse than anything you might encounter offroading Moab, including Sand Flats (Fins/Hells). Your Yota should have absolutely no issues. If you have traction control - turn it off! Most electronic traction systems attempt to stop wheel slip - which on sand will destroy your momentum.
I would consider heading out there for the holidays - except I have some other activities planned. Enjoy!
Karl, thanks for the map and info, this helps. I’m all for taking a longer rout to avoid the deep stuff. It should be fun just wheeling around the area, too.
No electronic traction control, just an old fashioned rear locker.
Doug, the photos on your site are inspiring.
“you don't have to camp right at White Pocket if you prefer more solitude. There are innumerable side roads up there leading off to random areas of the plateau. One that comes to mind is just outside of White Pocket, it runs out between the Eastern formations to a large Hole-in-the-Rock mountain.”
Kurt, I just saw your 2nd post. This sounds like the good stuff.
I’m ready for the cold. Last year all of the my 7 gallon containers froze the first night. I had to place one of them on the passenger floorboard and blast it with the heater to melt drinking water. The ice chest was used to keep food from freezing at night.
How is the access for a VW Vanagon? It does quite well in rough roads, but it isn't a 4WD.
What about parking and hiking of mtn biking?
You can take house rock valley rd from the south and turn east on rd 1077 for at least a few miles. I’m not sure how far you would need to hike/bike from there.
Mountain biking would be very hard in the sandy sections. I am an avid mountain biker and would not be able to pedal through the deep sand.