Posted by Lindy Martin on December 7, 2012 at 8:47 PM
I recently read that cold press or hot press BRIGHT papers needs to have UV light to activate the brighteners in the paper and that putting the photo in a frame with uv protected glass renders the brighteners useless. What do you do to frame these when you print on these papers? This printing is getting really confusing
Posted by Mark Stahlke on December 7, 2012 at 10:51 PM
Huh, I always thought papers with brighteners needed to be protected from UV or they would yellow.
Now I'm confused too.
Posted by Jim Bullard on December 8, 2012 at 10:30 AM
According to the article Jim kindly linked to, the 'brighteners' (OBA's) do rely on UV light to activate, making the paper appear to be more white. The risk is that, over time, the print will yellow, and color shifts will occur.
Mark's comment, then, is right on. For the best print longevity, protection from UV is a good idea. The issue then becomes one of how much you want to spend in order to protect a print that uses OBA's? Glass that absorbs UVa and UVb is very expensive. However, one can minimize the cost by using a good glass and then displaying the print in an environment that is lower in UV light. The other way is to use a paper that does not have OBA's.
Lindy, the article goes into pretty good detail, but be aware that it is on a site that sells high-end printing papers. There is a lot of hype out there (not saying this article is all hype), so you'll need to make your decisions based upon what you can expect for a return on your investment.
--P
Posted by Lindy Martin on December 8, 2012 at 6:28 PM
Thanks everone for the help. I will try all kinds of combinations and see what works best for my home frat of all and then other places. I really like museum glass and conservation glass so will try 2 prints on the same paper and on on without brighteners under different glass to see if there is any appreciable difference. Thanks again
Just out of curiosity, is there a specific reason for choosing papers with OBA's?
FWIW - My photographic revenue comes from selling prints at juried Arts & Crafts shows. I found out long ago that "bright" papers were not my friend. Often, loose prints on display would yellow at the edges before I could sell them. As a result, I switched to "natural" white paper, 100% cotton rag, with no OBA's, and a warmer white. I also switched to the Epson Hot Press Natural papers as soon as they were introduced, and use them exclusively to this day. I like the warmer look, although I often forget that it's a natural white, until I place a bright white next to it. But I no longer have to contend with OBA's. Just food for thought.
Posted by Lindy Martin on December 18, 2012 at 9:59 PM
Hi Michael
Cold press bright was recommended to me by a photographer who I admire. I printed a bunch on natural, cold and hot press bright (thanks to sample packs) and other fine art samples. The cold press bright with the Epson printer just seemed to make the images "pop" - they looked better, had greater range of colour including whites. The natural version seemed a little yellow when printing snow, or especially snowy owls. I definitely like the cold press bright better for landscapes with greater tonality and snowy owls (just my opinion) I have not sold a lot of prints yet, but the ones that I donate for wildlife auctions are predominately snowy owls or birds in the snow. Cold climate makes for cold colours
Posted by David Bostedo on December 19, 2012 at 11:59 PM
I like the warmer look, although I often forget that it's a natural white, until I place a bright white next to it.
The natural version seemed a little yellow when printing snow, or especially snowy owls. I definitely like the cold press bright better for ... greater tonality...
Both of these quotes point out a simple thing that some folks don't realize - your printer cannot print white. Instead, the whitest tones in your image are essentially bare paper color. And the lightest tones in your image may be mostly comprised of the color of the paper.
That's the reason some people like OBAs; There isn't any other way to get the whitest white tones possible without using them. Paper without them can't be brightened enough to appear truly white.
I agree with Michael, thought, that without direct comparison, non-OBA paper can stand up very well. (Your brain is very good at adjusting its expectation of "white".) So if OBA paper gives you trouble, sometimes it's easiest just not using it. But if you want the brightest/lightest possible whites, you may want to deal with it.
Discussion
7 repliesNow I'm confused too.
Mark's comment, then, is right on. For the best print longevity, protection from UV is a good idea. The issue then becomes one of how much you want to spend in order to protect a print that uses OBA's? Glass that absorbs UVa and UVb is very expensive. However, one can minimize the cost by using a good glass and then displaying the print in an environment that is lower in UV light. The other way is to use a paper that does not have OBA's.
Lindy, the article goes into pretty good detail, but be aware that it is on a site that sells high-end printing papers. There is a lot of hype out there (not saying this article is all hype), so you'll need to make your decisions based upon what you can expect for a return on your investment.
--P
FWIW - My photographic revenue comes from selling prints at juried Arts & Crafts shows. I found out long ago that "bright" papers were not my friend. Often, loose prints on display would yellow at the edges before I could sell them. As a result, I switched to "natural" white paper, 100% cotton rag, with no OBA's, and a warmer white. I also switched to the Epson Hot Press Natural papers as soon as they were introduced, and use them exclusively to this day. I like the warmer look, although I often forget that it's a natural white, until I place a bright white next to it. But I no longer have to contend with OBA's. Just food for thought.
Cold press bright was recommended to me by a photographer who I admire. I printed a bunch on natural, cold and hot press bright (thanks to sample packs) and other fine art samples. The cold press bright with the Epson printer just seemed to make the images "pop" - they looked better, had greater range of colour including whites. The natural version seemed a little yellow when printing snow, or especially snowy owls. I definitely like the cold press bright better for landscapes with greater tonality and snowy owls (just my opinion) I have not sold a lot of prints yet, but the ones that I donate for wildlife auctions are predominately snowy owls or birds in the snow. Cold climate makes for cold colours
Both of these quotes point out a simple thing that some folks don't realize - your printer cannot print white. Instead, the whitest tones in your image are essentially bare paper color. And the lightest tones in your image may be mostly comprised of the color of the paper.
That's the reason some people like OBAs; There isn't any other way to get the whitest white tones possible without using them. Paper without them can't be brightened enough to appear truly white.
I agree with Michael, thought, that without direct comparison, non-OBA paper can stand up very well. (Your brain is very good at adjusting its expectation of "white".) So if OBA paper gives you trouble, sometimes it's easiest just not using it. But if you want the brightest/lightest possible whites, you may want to deal with it.