Although I considered myself well versed in color management and printing, I just started experimenting with printing from Lightroom 5. This issue is this sandstone image and basically the reds being shifted more toward orange. The brightness is perfect, however. And yes, my iMac is color calibrated with an i1 Pro and am using the appropriate paper profiles. In fact, to double check, I have printed on 3 different papers with my Epson 3880. All were photo papers with photo black ink. For comparison, I have always used Aperture and is does capture and match my screen fairly close. I also printed out of PS CC with the same results poor results. So, its something with Adobe and/or my settings/ techniques, perhaps?
I also soft proofed and not soft proofed. The soft proof prints are a tad better, but still the reds are not displaying correctly. They shift to more orange and orange-ish brown. I have read through Jeff Schewe's Print e-book and other on line info and still have not found an answer to this issue.
No doubt I can continue to print out of Aperture, but now I have a challenge to figure this out! Also, I like the soft proofing capability feature of Lightroom over Aperture, hence why I was experimenting in the first place. Other trouble shooting I went through including recalibrating and restarting my Mac.
So, for those well versed in printing from Lightroom, do you have any words of wisdom? Are you able to get matched prints from your screen?
Hi Ken: Sure sounds like you have all of the color management issues under control. I'm assuming you were using the ICC profiles from Lightroom and not allowing the color to be Managed by the printer, then of course having the 3880 driver set to "ColorSync". I only ask because you didn't mention how you had the Color Management set from LightRoom or Photoshop.
Good question, Keith. Actually, out of desparation I tried both; let Lightroom manage colors and printer manage colors. To better illustrate the issue I've attached a scan of printing results from both Aperture and Lightroom. As you will note, the brighter orange image is from Aperture. It is also the image that most closely matches my screen.
Any chance you could post screen shots of the relevant screens in LR or PS for the printing setup. Something is just way off. I've never had any issues printing from either product.
Good news as I finally have Lightroom printing well. Besides messing with every setting known, I was at my wits end. From another forum, they suggested monitor recalibration. Well, yea I did conduct that with my i1 display device. However, for kicks I did it again this time in advanced mode. The only two items I really changed was the numbers of color patches it measured and a setting for ICC profile that was changed to standard settings (version 4 instead of version 2).
Well, $30+ of paper and ink was used, but now Lightroom printing is matching my screen quite well. Visually, I don't see much change on the screen display, but whatever changed it was for the better. That said, Aperture still prints well as before with no change. Unfortunately, I can't explain the technology of how those two image processors work in regards to printing, but there is a clear difference.
If nothing else, maybe the time and resources I put into this "experiment" will help others
From what you describe as the problem being with LR and PS, and your solution being to recalibrate your monitor, I believe that LR and PS had a monitor profile mismatch with Aperture, or LR and PS were not seeing your monitor profile.
If you look in Edit>Color Settings in PS and click the 'drop-down' arrow on "RGB:" in the Working Spaces area of the Color Settings dialog, your monitor profile should be listed there. Note: You don't want to select it, though. Leave the RGB working space as is.
I believe that Adobe programs compare the color gamut of your working space with the monitor color gamut so that images display properly. At least, this is what I think Adobe is doing. If I'm wrong about this, I'd appreciate clarification of this point.
Anyway, glad you got it fixed. These kinds of color issues can drive one batty.
Dang, thought i had everything working, but on another day I went back to print with Lightroom and again I'm back with the same issue.
If someone could explain the difference in how LR prints and uses color management, as opposed to Aperture, I might be able to determine what I should do. But for now LR is worthless for critical printing.
Once again, if you can post screen shots of all relevant screens for printing setup, I'm guessing we could find the issue. It is clear that LR is fine for printing based on millions of other users printing from LR and/or PS.
Update: I decided to try another image and found LR printed it fairly well. So, could it be a corrupt image somehow? That would be something I've never encountered in many years of printing. Odd though, that same image has printed well via Aperture.
I agree with Keith. Screen shots of your printing setup would really help, along with a screen shot of your color settings in PS and/or LR.
Is your monitor profile listed in in the Working Spaces area of the Color Settings dialog in PS/LR? Also, in the same dialog box, down near the bottom, look at "Desaturate colors by..." If it's unchecked, you will likely get a monitor/print mismatch. Try checking the box and experimenting with different percentages. Here's the description from the CS6 manual...
"Desaturate Monitor Colors By Determines whether to desaturate colors by the specified amount when displayed on the monitor. When selected,this option can aid in visualizing the full range of color spaces with gamuts larger than that of the monitor. However, this causes a mismatch between the monitor display and the output. When the option is deselected, distinct colors in the image may display as a single color."
I'm unsure if this is what is going on, but I think it's worth a look-see.
Preston,
FYI...I am printing out of LR primarily, so there isn't any desaturate color setting. Also, as you will see on the image, saturation wasn't an issue as much a color shift. That said, everything is worth double checking, so I appreciate the suggestion.
Just for kicks, I went back and printed the same image giving me fits and it printed quite well. Given that Aperture has printed it well the whole time, that would tend to suggest no system wide issue. What it would suggest is some kind of glitch with LR in reading the ICC profile correctly. I can't, nor has anyone else on multiple forums, suggested anything they were aware of that would cause this printing issue. I've been recording the settings for each of the prints I made so I'm 99.8% sure settings were not the issue, otherwise I would post screen shots.
Discussion
10 repliesAlthough I considered myself well versed in color management and printing, I just started experimenting with printing from Lightroom 5. This issue is this sandstone image and basically the reds being shifted more toward orange. The brightness is perfect, however. And yes, my iMac is color calibrated with an i1 Pro and am using the appropriate paper profiles. In fact, to double check, I have printed on 3 different papers with my Epson 3880. All were photo papers with photo black ink. For comparison, I have always used Aperture and is does capture and match my screen fairly close. I also printed out of PS CC with the same results poor results. So, its something with Adobe and/or my settings/ techniques, perhaps?
I also soft proofed and not soft proofed. The soft proof prints are a tad better, but still the reds are not displaying correctly. They shift to more orange and orange-ish brown. I have read through Jeff Schewe's Print e-book and other on line info and still have not found an answer to this issue.
No doubt I can continue to print out of Aperture, but now I have a challenge to figure this out! Also, I like the soft proofing capability feature of Lightroom over Aperture, hence why I was experimenting in the first place. Other trouble shooting I went through including recalibrating and restarting my Mac.
So, for those well versed in printing from Lightroom, do you have any words of wisdom? Are you able to get matched prints from your screen?
Ken
Well, $30+ of paper and ink was used, but now Lightroom printing is matching my screen quite well. Visually, I don't see much change on the screen display, but whatever changed it was for the better. That said, Aperture still prints well as before with no change. Unfortunately, I can't explain the technology of how those two image processors work in regards to printing, but there is a clear difference.
If nothing else, maybe the time and resources I put into this "experiment" will help others
From what you describe as the problem being with LR and PS, and your solution being to recalibrate your monitor, I believe that LR and PS had a monitor profile mismatch with Aperture, or LR and PS were not seeing your monitor profile.
If you look in Edit>Color Settings in PS and click the 'drop-down' arrow on "RGB:" in the Working Spaces area of the Color Settings dialog, your monitor profile should be listed there. Note: You don't want to select it, though. Leave the RGB working space as is.
I believe that Adobe programs compare the color gamut of your working space with the monitor color gamut so that images display properly. At least, this is what I think Adobe is doing. If I'm wrong about this, I'd appreciate clarification of this point.
Anyway, glad you got it fixed. These kinds of color issues can drive one batty.
--
If someone could explain the difference in how LR prints and uses color management, as opposed to Aperture, I might be able to determine what I should do. But for now LR is worthless for critical printing.
I agree with Keith. Screen shots of your printing setup would really help, along with a screen shot of your color settings in PS and/or LR.
Is your monitor profile listed in in the Working Spaces area of the Color Settings dialog in PS/LR? Also, in the same dialog box, down near the bottom, look at "Desaturate colors by..." If it's unchecked, you will likely get a monitor/print mismatch. Try checking the box and experimenting with different percentages. Here's the description from the CS6 manual...
"Desaturate Monitor Colors By Determines whether to desaturate colors by the specified amount when displayed on the monitor. When selected,this option can aid in visualizing the full range of color spaces with gamuts larger than that of the monitor. However, this causes a mismatch between the monitor display and the output. When the option is deselected, distinct colors in the image may display as a single color."
I'm unsure if this is what is going on, but I think it's worth a look-see.
--P
FYI...I am printing out of LR primarily, so there isn't any desaturate color setting. Also, as you will see on the image, saturation wasn't an issue as much a color shift. That said, everything is worth double checking, so I appreciate the suggestion.
Just for kicks, I went back and printed the same image giving me fits and it printed quite well. Given that Aperture has printed it well the whole time, that would tend to suggest no system wide issue. What it would suggest is some kind of glitch with LR in reading the ICC profile correctly. I can't, nor has anyone else on multiple forums, suggested anything they were aware of that would cause this printing issue. I've been recording the settings for each of the prints I made so I'm 99.8% sure settings were not the issue, otherwise I would post screen shots.