I've been seriously tempted by this extreme macro lens, thanks to pictures like these that I've seen posted on the web.
Before I lay out the big bucks for this lens, I'd like to collect all the feedback I can get. Have you used it? Impressions? Thanks.
Posted by Dave Larkman on July 26, 2006 at 2:30 PM
It's a hard lens to get used to. There is no focus on this lense. You focus it by moving it closer or further away. Once you get used to this though it is a very sharp lens. You will also need to purchase a macro flash with it. It is useless without one. I love mine, I find it opens up a whole new world of photography.
This is a extremely specialized lens, probably the macro equivalent of the 600 mm for birders. I have used one briefly and found it to be far easier to work with than a (normal macro lens with converters and extension tubes). The big issues with the normal macro route were weight and size. From experience - 180 macro, 1.4 and 2x converters, plus 37 mm of extension, is almost impossible to work with in the field and I don't recommend it, although I have done it multiple times. The 65 mm 1x-5x was far easier to handle.
The downsides are twofold: First, it gets really dark to look through, once you reach the 3x-5x, especially with a 20D viewfinder. Second, you are committing yourself to buying a macro flash unit to go with it. Because the subject will be so close to the lens, +- 1 inch, any normal flash bracket won't put the flash over the subject without the lens casting a shadow. Conjecture here: I think if you would use a normal flash on a modified bracket, you might have problems with lens flare.
It is on my list of future buys. Realiistically, if those magnifications are what you are looking for, it is a tough lens to beat.
Tough learning curve with this lens... Focal range is about an inch. There is no focus ring. You focus by moving the camera closer or further away from the camera. Can you see well enough to get sharp focus in an almost dark viewfinder? This lens has the usual DOF issues that all macro lenses experience; you don't get any until about f/16 which compounds your viewfinder darkness problems. My only salvation with this lens was the MT-24 which has a pair of incandescent focusing lamps to help you get a clear focus. I also mount it on a Kirk focus rail so I can get fine focus control. I've never been successful at getting a sharp image hand held. Think this one through carefully. Almost nothing with legs is going to let you get within an inch or less with that giant camera and lens (their perspective). It's practically useless without a fairly expensive flash unit, and really needs some kind of focus rail to get good sharp focus. You're looking at the better part of two thousand dollars to get a workable setup.
Another consideration while I think about it. How much macro experience do you already have? A 100 mm plus converter and cropping digital body may be all you really need. 2x in the field, which is what this combination would be, is reasonable. Much more than that gets tough.
I am really not trying to discourage you from buying that lens, but as Kelly points out, this is not a beginner's lens.
Posted by Dave Larkman on July 26, 2006 at 4:43 PM
I actually always use mine handheld. It's never been on the tripod. The trick is to use the high speed flash sync and a shutter speed of no less then 1/500th.
"I actually always use mine handheld. It's never been on the tripod. The trick is to use the high speed flash sync and a shutter speed of no less then 1/500th."
I'll give that a try, but don't hold your breath. I really suck at hand-holding macro shots.
Posted by Dave Larkman on July 26, 2006 at 5:01 PM
Hi Kelly,
It's just too hard to sneak up on those bugs with a tripod. You'll be surprised what you can do handheld with it. I shoot in manual 1/500th to 1/1000th, iso 400 or 800 f/16 I use the Sigma macro flash and usually use the lamp feature because as you said the viewfinder can get pretty dark. Let us know how it works out.
The summaries you've received are accurate. I have the lens, and love it, but I am a nut.
My advice to you is not to get it--The reason, the lens is so difficult and frustrating to use, that you won't stick to it and master it unless you are really really driven to. And if you have to ask if you should get it, you aren't really, really driven to. I'm completely serious about this!
To summarize my thoughts on it (some of which have already been made):
Focusing range 1 to 4 inches
depth of field of MAXIMUM of 1.2 (or something like that) millimeters at 5x, and you'll have huge diffraction issues if you stop it down that much (f/96!!!!!!!)
Requires a special macro flash to use effectively, and the combination is big and bulky and must usually be handheld to be used effectively
With moving targets, 95% (seriously) of your photos will be utterly out of focus throw-aways. Even breathing will take the lens hopelessly out of focus at 4 or 5x
Must manual focus with dim viewfinder, usually by using the whole camera
If I haven't talked you out of it yet, borrow a 180mm lens, put a 2x teleconverter, some extension tubes, and a 500D closeup diopter on it. Spend a morning shooting with the combination. Keep in mind that this combo will be a DELIGHT to use compared to the MP-E-65, much easier, then consider if you still want an MP-E-65. And I'm completely serious about that, despite the big grin.
Lest you think I hate the lens, I must say I love it, just that I've known several excellent photographers who have given up on it with frustration. But you can get some awesome shots with it, if you're willing:
Note that on the harvester ant shot, the near antenna is out of focus, the head of the ant is in focus, and the thorax (middle body part) of the ant is getting out of focus because it is too far away. And this is with the lens stopped down all the way for maximum DOF! So much so that the shot has diffraction problems at 100%.
Discussion
8 repliesBefore I lay out the big bucks for this lens, I'd like to collect all the feedback I can get. Have you used it? Impressions? Thanks.
Dave
www.digitalwilderness.ca
The downsides are twofold: First, it gets really dark to look through, once you reach the 3x-5x, especially with a 20D viewfinder. Second, you are committing yourself to buying a macro flash unit to go with it. Because the subject will be so close to the lens, +- 1 inch, any normal flash bracket won't put the flash over the subject without the lens casting a shadow. Conjecture here: I think if you would use a normal flash on a modified bracket, you might have problems with lens flare.
It is on my list of future buys. Realiistically, if those magnifications are what you are looking for, it is a tough lens to beat.
I am really not trying to discourage you from buying that lens, but as Kelly points out, this is not a beginner's lens.
Dave
www.digitalwilderness.ca
I'll give that a try, but don't hold your breath. I really suck at hand-holding macro shots.
It's just too hard to sneak up on those bugs with a tripod. You'll be surprised what you can do handheld with it. I shoot in manual 1/500th to 1/1000th, iso 400 or 800 f/16 I use the Sigma macro flash and usually use the lamp feature because as you said the viewfinder can get pretty dark. Let us know how it works out.
My advice to you is not to get it--The reason, the lens is so difficult and frustrating to use, that you won't stick to it and master it unless you are really really driven to. And if you have to ask if you should get it, you aren't really, really driven to. I'm completely serious about this!
To summarize my thoughts on it (some of which have already been made):
Focusing range 1 to 4 inches
depth of field of MAXIMUM of 1.2 (or something like that) millimeters at 5x, and you'll have huge diffraction issues if you stop it down that much (f/96!!!!!!!)
Requires a special macro flash to use effectively, and the combination is big and bulky and must usually be handheld to be used effectively
With moving targets, 95% (seriously) of your photos will be utterly out of focus throw-aways. Even breathing will take the lens hopelessly out of focus at 4 or 5x
Must manual focus with dim viewfinder, usually by using the whole camera
If I haven't talked you out of it yet, borrow a 180mm lens, put a 2x teleconverter, some extension tubes, and a 500D closeup diopter on it. Spend a morning shooting with the combination. Keep in mind that this combo will be a DELIGHT to use compared to the MP-E-65, much easier, then consider if you still want an MP-E-65.
Lest you think I hate the lens, I must say I love it, just that I've known several excellent photographers who have given up on it with frustration. But you can get some awesome shots with it, if you're willing:
wood tick
http://photomacrography.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2261&highlight=mpe65
rattlesnake scales (seriously!)
http://photomacrography.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1992&highlight=mpe65
ladybug takeoff
http://photomacrography.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2023&highlight=mpe65
harvester ant (my favorite)
http://photomacrography.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=700&highlight=mpe65
Note that on the harvester ant shot, the near antenna is out of focus, the head of the ant is in focus, and the thorax (middle body part) of the ant is getting out of focus because it is too far away. And this is with the lens stopped down all the way for maximum DOF! So much so that the shot has diffraction problems at 100%.