Posted by Bill Chambers on August 4, 2006 at 2:38 PM
I'm hesitant to ask this because there seem to be so many differences of opinions as to what is "best", but here goes...
Several questions actually:
I currently have a 250 GB Raid 1 (mirrored) hard drive. After reading a recent thread I now know this isn't actually safeguarding my data like I thought it was.
I want to (1) enlarge my storage capacity since my 250 is almost tapped out. (2) Provide saftey thru having an independant back-up system.
Can I "un-mirror" my current 250, making it a 500, then buy an additional 500GB external HD for an indepedent back up? Is there a better way?
As far as brands of external HD, it seems that for every one person who likes a particular brand there's 5 trashing it, regardless of brand. Is there one acknowledged leader in external HD's that actually makes the 'best'?
Bill, I resorted to manual backups as well. I have 2 external 500GB drives that I use to manually back up my data (I wrote a little batch script to copy entire directories over). Not the most efficient way but it works and has saved me on a couple of occasions already.
Another thing I can suggest is a good UPS unit. I don't know about your area, but we have brown-outs or lose power completely almost every time a thunderstorm blows through. Keeping the computer and drives on UPS power and configured to perform a clean shutdown if power is not restored in time will prevent data corruption due to power loss.
As far as leaders. Not sure I have a good answer but from my (admittedly limited) research, Western Digital seems to have the least-tarnished reputation.
Guy
Posted by Bill Chambers on August 4, 2006 at 3:40 PM
Thanks Guy - I unfamilar with UPSs, but from the jist of your comments I assume that stands for Uniform Power Source maybe, or something similar. Any idea on what these cost, and where would I buy one?
Also, any idea about 'un-mirroring' my current drive?
UPS= Uninterruptable Power Supply
You can get them at any office supply store. They come in different sizes and power ratings and prices. Take a look at APC for some options.
UPS is Uninterrupted Power Supply. It's basically a large rechargeable battery that kicks in when power goes out. Get the largest unit in your budget. Mine can power the computer + 3 external drives for about 30 minutes. It also has a USB cable and software that can shut down the computer gracefully when power level gets very low (mine is set to shut down when there's 5 minutes of juice left).
Re mirrored disks, yes you can delete the array and use both disks as seperate drives. You can keep all the data on 1 disk and format the other to use as a seperate disk. Mirroring is a form of back-up incase 1 drive goes kaput you can always retrieve the data from the other........very unlike stripe arrays which can be hellish when one goes on the blink.
After losing all my wildlife shots from the past 5 years or so due to several HDD failures I am now using 6 320gb WD external drives. I now back up all my shots to three drives in 1,4 and 12 week intervals. It's taken a nightmare for me to wake up to the fact that these shots only exist as 1s and 0s on a fragile disk and to rely on always on internal drives as storage was madness and tempting fate.
John
Posted by Bill Chambers on August 4, 2006 at 7:15 PM
Thanks all.
John - I may just be naive, but why 3 separate back-ups, and why the 3 different back-up intervals? Also, what's a stripe array? In your opinion, is the mirroring worthwhile if I bought a separate HD for the dedicated purpose of back-up?
Posted by David Redding on August 4, 2006 at 11:00 PM
Bill,
A produce you may want to look into is the Maxtor 250 GB external HDD. One feature that I really like about it is the software/hardware back-up. It has a button on the front that, when pushed, will automatically backup everything from a predefined folder/drive.
Hi Bill,
I use 3 drives for back ups at differing intervals simply because I am only switching on my main back-up drive once every 12 weeks and hopefully reducing the risk of losing all the shots, if I were to use all three drives every week to back up I would be puting equal wear on all three drives and increasing the probability of all three giving out at roughly the same time.......slim chance I know, but when you've lost all your favourite shots once you will know where I'm coming from.
A stripe array is two disks in in a RAID array where the disk space is equal to approx the total of the two disks, reason for having the two run together is speed of retrieval......THIS IS NOT A SAFE WAY TO KEEP IMPORTANT DATA.....if on disk goes you lose all the data and it is very difficult to get the data recovered economically.
I would say that mirroring is a lazy way to back up files. It also means that both disks are running at the same time and as I said before that increases the probability of both failing. External HDD for back up
and only switch it on for saving files to it.
FWIW I have boxes of slides that my grandfather shot during the 2nd world war, all are in great condition.....I have no shots left that I took three years ago with my digital set up. Worth thinking about
John
Posted by Mel Ladewig on August 7, 2006 at 2:40 PM
First off, RAID does not inherintenly increase your risk of drive failure. All but RAID 0 reduce the risk of data loss by sharing the risk of drive failure across several drives.
Secondly, A stripe array is one one where the data is split into small pieces across two drives to aid in read and write speed. Niether drive contains all of the data to make up a file. Therefore if one drive fails, you lose all of the information from both drives. A JBOD is another type of array where the drives are grouped together into what the system sees as one big disk. In this system the files are not broken into pieces, so drive failure does not mean total data loss. It is not technically a type of RAID, but most RAID controllers provide this functionality.
Targeted directly to Bill, is can you consider archiving media that is not "keeper" media? By doing this you may be able to extend the life of your RAID array.
However, to answer Bill's questions.
Although a RAID 1 setup does not replace the need for a backup, it does increase the safety of your system by reducing the risk that you'll have a drive failure take out your only source of data on your production instance. I wouldn't recommend removing the RAID array.
To increase your drive capacity using the drives you have, you would need to switch the drive setup to either a JBOD (single 500 GB array that can be done by the RAID controller) or two seperate 250GB disks. When you take down the RAID array, the controller may destroy the data that is on the disks by reformatting. You'll need backups before you do this.
Another option is to see if your RAID controller will allow you to mount a new larger disk. If it will do this and allow you to update your mirror, then you can remove one drive and replace with a new larger drive alowing the Array to build the mirror on the new disk. Then replace the other small disk and allow the same to occur. This is dependent on whether the array will automatically update to the new disk size once both disks are mounted.
Yet another question is whether your computer has room to mount 1 or 2 more disks. If so, you should see if your current RAID controller will control 2 arrays. If not, you can buy a second RAID controller that will install into a PCI slot. Then you could move some of your data to the second array or simply a 3rd disk.
I do think there is a better way to manage your backup needs. From having a work laptop that tried to destroy itself on a weekly basis, I'd picked up a few tips from the laptop/desktop support team.
1) Seperate your personal data from the system data. Either use a partition or a seperate drive. This makes a system restore easier and makes your backup strategy simpler. If you can get more internal drives into your computer, do it and move your personal media to the new drives.
2) Expend the majority of your efforts backing up the personal data. You can always go back to disk to reinstall windows if you need to.
3) Automated the backup as much as possible.
For my solution, I chose a couple of applications and a piece of hardware to help me.
I purchased a Buffalo Terrastation which attaches to my network. I can access it from any computer inside my home network. There are a few other NAS models out there now, so you can chose from a couple different configurations. It works like an external drive, but I don't have to plug it in to a USB port on my computer to make it work. However, the access speed isn't as fast as a USB drive so plan around this accordingly. The terrastation can be controlled by a UPS to shut down safely in the case of a power failure.
To backup the system applications, I use an application called Acronis True Image. I use it to back up Windows and applications. It rolls up everything into one package, that you can use to repair a computer. It will make a recovery disk for you.
To backup my personal media files, I use an application called SyncBack SE. It determines which files I have added or changed and copies them to the destination that I selected based on simple rules that I selected. I can click on the backup rule that I created to run it any time.
Both Acronis and SyncBack SE allow scheduling with Windows XP and I've set this up to run automatically on an interval.
I'd like to add tape backups in the future, but the need is low.
Discussion
9 repliesSeveral questions actually:
I currently have a 250 GB Raid 1 (mirrored) hard drive. After reading a recent thread I now know this isn't actually safeguarding my data like I thought it was.
I want to (1) enlarge my storage capacity since my 250 is almost tapped out. (2) Provide saftey thru having an independant back-up system.
Can I "un-mirror" my current 250, making it a 500, then buy an additional 500GB external HD for an indepedent back up? Is there a better way?
As far as brands of external HD, it seems that for every one person who likes a particular brand there's 5 trashing it, regardless of brand. Is there one acknowledged leader in external HD's that actually makes the 'best'?
Another thing I can suggest is a good UPS unit. I don't know about your area, but we have brown-outs or lose power completely almost every time a thunderstorm blows through. Keeping the computer and drives on UPS power and configured to perform a clean shutdown if power is not restored in time will prevent data corruption due to power loss.
As far as leaders. Not sure I have a good answer but from my (admittedly limited) research, Western Digital seems to have the least-tarnished reputation.
Guy
Also, any idea about 'un-mirroring' my current drive?
You can get them at any office supply store. They come in different sizes and power ratings and prices. Take a look at APC for some options.
Guy
After losing all my wildlife shots from the past 5 years or so due to several HDD failures I am now using 6 320gb WD external drives. I now back up all my shots to three drives in 1,4 and 12 week intervals. It's taken a nightmare for me to wake up to the fact that these shots only exist as 1s and 0s on a fragile disk and to rely on always on internal drives as storage was madness and tempting fate.
John
John - I may just be naive, but why 3 separate back-ups, and why the 3 different back-up intervals? Also, what's a stripe array? In your opinion, is the mirroring worthwhile if I bought a separate HD for the dedicated purpose of back-up?
A produce you may want to look into is the Maxtor 250 GB external HDD. One feature that I really like about it is the software/hardware back-up. It has a button on the front that, when pushed, will automatically backup everything from a predefined folder/drive.
I use 3 drives for back ups at differing intervals simply because I am only switching on my main back-up drive once every 12 weeks and hopefully reducing the risk of losing all the shots, if I were to use all three drives every week to back up I would be puting equal wear on all three drives and increasing the probability of all three giving out at roughly the same time.......slim chance I know, but when you've lost all your favourite shots once you will know where I'm coming from.
A stripe array is two disks in in a RAID array where the disk space is equal to approx the total of the two disks, reason for having the two run together is speed of retrieval......THIS IS NOT A SAFE WAY TO KEEP IMPORTANT DATA.....if on disk goes you lose all the data and it is very difficult to get the data recovered economically.
I would say that mirroring is a lazy way to back up files. It also means that both disks are running at the same time and as I said before that increases the probability of both failing. External HDD for back up
and only switch it on for saving files to it.
FWIW I have boxes of slides that my grandfather shot during the 2nd world war, all are in great condition.....I have no shots left that I took three years ago with my digital set up. Worth thinking about
John
Secondly, A stripe array is one one where the data is split into small pieces across two drives to aid in read and write speed. Niether drive contains all of the data to make up a file. Therefore if one drive fails, you lose all of the information from both drives. A JBOD is another type of array where the drives are grouped together into what the system sees as one big disk. In this system the files are not broken into pieces, so drive failure does not mean total data loss. It is not technically a type of RAID, but most RAID controllers provide this functionality.
Targeted directly to Bill, is can you consider archiving media that is not "keeper" media? By doing this you may be able to extend the life of your RAID array.
However, to answer Bill's questions.
Although a RAID 1 setup does not replace the need for a backup, it does increase the safety of your system by reducing the risk that you'll have a drive failure take out your only source of data on your production instance. I wouldn't recommend removing the RAID array.
To increase your drive capacity using the drives you have, you would need to switch the drive setup to either a JBOD (single 500 GB array that can be done by the RAID controller) or two seperate 250GB disks. When you take down the RAID array, the controller may destroy the data that is on the disks by reformatting. You'll need backups before you do this.
Another option is to see if your RAID controller will allow you to mount a new larger disk. If it will do this and allow you to update your mirror, then you can remove one drive and replace with a new larger drive alowing the Array to build the mirror on the new disk. Then replace the other small disk and allow the same to occur. This is dependent on whether the array will automatically update to the new disk size once both disks are mounted.
Yet another question is whether your computer has room to mount 1 or 2 more disks. If so, you should see if your current RAID controller will control 2 arrays. If not, you can buy a second RAID controller that will install into a PCI slot. Then you could move some of your data to the second array or simply a 3rd disk.
I do think there is a better way to manage your backup needs. From having a work laptop that tried to destroy itself on a weekly basis, I'd picked up a few tips from the laptop/desktop support team.
1) Seperate your personal data from the system data. Either use a partition or a seperate drive. This makes a system restore easier and makes your backup strategy simpler. If you can get more internal drives into your computer, do it and move your personal media to the new drives.
2) Expend the majority of your efforts backing up the personal data. You can always go back to disk to reinstall windows if you need to.
3) Automated the backup as much as possible.
For my solution, I chose a couple of applications and a piece of hardware to help me.
I purchased a Buffalo Terrastation which attaches to my network. I can access it from any computer inside my home network. There are a few other NAS models out there now, so you can chose from a couple different configurations. It works like an external drive, but I don't have to plug it in to a USB port on my computer to make it work. However, the access speed isn't as fast as a USB drive so plan around this accordingly. The terrastation can be controlled by a UPS to shut down safely in the case of a power failure.
To backup the system applications, I use an application called Acronis True Image. I use it to back up Windows and applications. It rolls up everything into one package, that you can use to repair a computer. It will make a recovery disk for you.
To backup my personal media files, I use an application called SyncBack SE. It determines which files I have added or changed and copies them to the destination that I selected based on simple rules that I selected. I can click on the backup rule that I created to run it any time.
Both Acronis and SyncBack SE allow scheduling with Windows XP and I've set this up to run automatically on an interval.
I'd like to add tape backups in the future, but the need is low.